Week 17 GDT - Houston Texans at San Francisco 49ers

[J-ALL-DAY]

7 hours ago, Forge said:

I've kicked around the idea of trading kinlaw in my head, especially if we resigned Jones.

 

His value won't be high coming off that injury. I'm fine keeping him but also want Jones back. I think we can bring Jones back at a decent deal. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

Ambry Thomas the last two games:

Targets 7

Completions 3

Yards 46

PBUs 3

For him to have as many PBUs as completions allowed is great. He is starting to finish the plays better and now he needs to turn those PBUs into INTs. Love his progress and for those wondering why they kept going with Thomas over Lenoir, this was why. Lenoir had some good moments, but his potential is not close to Thomas' potential. Thomas could legitimately turn into a high end #2 CB or even a #1 CB down the line. He has pretty much all the physical tools you look for but just needs seasoning and more experience playing off man coverage. Teams are going to continue testing him but I don't think he's going to get overwhlemed.

The Bengals game was not pretty at all, but he was lined up against Ja'Marr freaking Chase all game long. That man is SPECIAL and has been killing pretty much every corner he is matched up against. Heck, he had damn near 300 yards yesterday lol. Need to have some patience but good signs for Thomas going forward. Hope we make the playoffs and he has two or more games to show his progress and potential. Still want another corner either in the draft or free agency, but having Thomas/Moseley makes me feel good, especially if there is any sort of injury to our corners...Which has been the case every single season lol.

[GW21]

When can we get E-Man back? I feel like we'd be pretty decent with him and Ambry on the outside. Norman is just flat out awful. Just my opinion, but I think Dontae Johnson has played way better than Norman this year. 

[Forge]

3 minutes ago, GW21 said:

When can we get E-Man back? I feel like we'd be pretty decent with him and Ambry on the outside. Norman is just flat out awful. Just my opinion, but I think Dontae Johnson has played way better than Norman this year. 

There's a decent chance he is back this week for the Rams 

[Forge]

3 hours ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

His value won't be high coming off that injury. I'm fine keeping him but also want Jones back. I think we can bring Jones back at a decent deal. 

That's why I think it has to be disappointing player of disappointing player. I don't mind doing that at all, but obviously I was never a supporter of the Kinlaw selection so there is a bias there. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

3 minutes ago, GW21 said:

When can we get E-Man back? I feel like we'd be pretty decent with him and Ambry on the outside. Norman is just flat out awful. Just my opinion, but I think Dontae Johnson has played way better than Norman this year. 

He has a chance to return this week but Shanny did say it was going to be tough and the playoffs is more likely, if we make it.

We will need him this week against the Rams. You can't just trot out Thomas/Johnson or Norman on the outside against this offense. 

I do hope that Ward gets the primary reps on Kupp. He didn't allow a catch in the first match up against Kupp when he was matched up against him.

Stafford isn't playing great ball at the moment so if we can get decent pressure, we should be okay. But I would feel much better if we had Moseley on the outside. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

That's why I think it has to be disappointing player of disappointing player. I don't mind doing that at all, but obviously I was never a supporter of the Kinlaw selection so there is a bias there. 

It's just tough trading him after that injury. He flashed enough in his rookie season and I think we just have to give him time and hope he is able to get healthier after this surgery. If so, he should be productive. 

IF we can bring back only one, who would you prefer between Jones and Key?

[Forge]

Just now, J-ALL-DAY said:

It's just tough trading him after that injury. He flashed enough in his rookie season and I think we just have to give him time and hope he is able to get healthier after this surgery. If so, he should be productive. 

IF we can bring back only one, who would you prefer between Jones and Key?

If I'm certain that Kinlaw is healthy, I'll bring back Key and let Jones walk. 

[GW21]

20 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

It's just tough trading him after that injury. He flashed enough in his rookie season and I think we just have to give him time and hope he is able to get healthier after this surgery. If so, he should be productive. 

IF we can bring back only one, who would you prefer between Jones and Key?

I mean, we have Kinlaw and Jones has his own injury issues. If it was me I'd go with Hurst/Key over Jones/Willis or something like that. I know that's not necessarily the question. I'd probably lean Key as I think he's just finding his stride, and I loved his sophmore tape at LSU and can't seem to let that go lol. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

22 minutes ago, Forge said:

If I'm certain that Kinlaw is healthy, I'll bring back Key and let Jones walk. 

 

2 minutes ago, GW21 said:

I mean, we have Kinlaw and Jones has his own injury issues. If it was me I'd go with Hurst/Key over Jones/Willis or something like that. I know that's not necessarily the question. I'd probably lean Key as I think he's just finding his stride, and I loved his sophmore tape at LSU and can't seem to let that go lol. 

Interesting, but Jones has been so damn good against the run alongside Armstead of course. But yeah, if Kinlaw is healthy, then you probably do prefer Key since he brings something different to the table as a pass rusher. 

Really curious to see the types of contracts those two will be getting in the offseason.

[GW21]

1 minute ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

 

Interesting, but Jones has been so damn good against the run alongside Armstead of course. But yeah, if Kinlaw is healthy, then you probably do prefer Key since he brings something different to the table as a pass rusher. 

Really curious to see the types of contracts those two will be getting in the offseason.

I think another thing to consider is where Armstead is playing. It seems like our run D really stepped it up when he moved inside more. I think with Armstead and Kinlaw on the inside and someone like Hurst & Givens backing them up we'd be sturdy up the gut. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

2 minutes ago, GW21 said:

I think another thing to consider is where Armstead is playing. It seems like our run D really stepped it up when he moved inside more. I think with Armstead and Kinlaw on the inside and someone like Hurst & Givens backing them up we'd be sturdy up the gut. 

Armstead needs to continue playing on the inside. Much better rushing the passer from the inside and good against the run.

It's seriously remarkable how much better our run defense has been since Street/Kerr stopped getting reps at NT lol. Those two would be washed away on any run play and made it awfully hard on the backers. 

 

[J-ALL-DAY]

Pretty much, though Lance made a STUPID decision just before half where he almost got picked off. When Lance misses on those outside the number throws, they will usually just be overthrown. Lance obviously missed Deebo wide open on the INT, but even that decision wasn't terrible. Just needed to put more air on the ball and get it over the underneath defender. Seemed like he wasn't fooled by the coverage but just made a bad throw. 

I'm not looking for some deep shots without the use of the play action. Just have a 5 step dropback and let it rip to someone like Aiyuk, 

Also, that report by Schefty that the 49ers are optimistic that Jimmy plays against the Rams? Shanny confirmed that Jimmy did not pass on Saturday or Sunday. What a stupid leak that was lol. I mean can he play on Sunday? Of course, but no one will know for sure until he is actually out on the field and throwing the ball. If he hasn't passed in 10 days, what makes you so certain he will be able to pass this week and be fully healthy or close to fully healthy??

[rudyZ]

This is what you guys were all waiting for : my opinions.

It was the Texans. I didn't realize just how few players I'd actually know on that team. Talent-starved is an understatement. But still, it's an nfl game, and they beat the chargers just a week ago, which tells me Culley must be coaching his *** off. Cannot take anyone lightly.

As I've said a few times this year, I hope Kyle becomes more aggressive one of these days. His offensive play calling philosophy is to play off of the opponents defensive rules. But first, he has to establish what those rules are. I hate that he always has to take a while to set up the opponent, rather than just straight out attacking it. I can't think of another coach, in football or in any other sport, who is more reactive when "attacking". He will be extremely conservative, trying to set up plays in order to use the defense's rules against itself. When everything goes right, it pays off, and I bet the players love that, when they see their patiently laid out plan work, and kyle looks like a genius. But you gotta mix it in with a little more aggression at times. And guys, I think we may get to see it with Trey. What happened right after Harris' interception (thank you refs for that...)? Trey went deep. There was some of that momentum building I talked about last week. And maybe that's just Trey, that the option to throw deep was always there with Jimmy, but he didn't have the ability to push downfield, whereas Trey has, and the sudden rush of adrenaline created by the turnover just makes the deep throw all that more tempting, for a youthful playmaker. Anyways... at the end of the game, the play calling seemed to be adjusted, and if the future looks anything like what we had in the second half, there are some good times ahead.

Now Trey specifically... There were some nerves at the beginning, he'd move off his spot in the pocket for no reason, a little inaccurate, but nothing too bad. I really disliked many of the play calls early on. They weren't going anywhere in the first quarter, and I put it 40% on Trey and 60% on Kyle. But when they started rolling, Trey started looking much more comfortable. I think there are things we've taken for granted with Jimmy, the quick passing, operating over the middle of the field, and probably pre-snap reads, that Trey is nowhere near. I can't wait for the day Trey will do with a flick of the wrist what has been Jimmy's bread and butter for four years. When you watch QBs like Mahommes and Rodgers, they don't even need to move in the pocket, or look at their receiver, they just know what spot to get the ball to at the appropriate time, and if the pressure gets closer, they just flick the wrist, get rid of it, and it's in a playmaker's hands. And the thing is : we have a lot of playmakers on this team. When he gets that part of the game down, with his ability to extend plays, to work the sidelines (which Jimmy cannot physically do... a 15 yard out from Lance can be virtually undefendable) and throw deep, Trey will be very close to elite.

One thing we probably overestimated is his speed, on the other hand. Trey is not that fast. He moves extremely well. He's much quicker than Kap ever was. Kap needed a few steps, but his top speed was unreal. Trey looks much quicker in the pocket, and if he gets a great feel for the pocket, he'll just toy with opponents all day long. In the running game, he's better when it's understated. They ran him early on, and it didn't go nowhere. I said before the game that NFL LBs aren't his college LBs, that he can just plant his feet and carry them for a couple of yards. Well, I was slightly wrong. NFL DBs seem sturdier than his college LBs. He tried to lower his shoulder on DBs, but they stopped him right there. It's the NFL, anybody not named Dre Kirkpatrick is going to challenge you physically. After the first quarter, Kyle didn't have him running as much. He had to get the ball going through the air to open things up. I wish it didn't take a half of football to figure that out. And maybe some of that comes down to the pre-snap read. Maybe he had the option to change some of these running plays, but he didn't because he still felt he could bulldoze a defender one on one. His rushing TD that got called back because of holding was what I expect to see from him. He had been effective through the air, the running game had been effective, he wasn't the primary focus of that play, and he ran through arm-tackles into the end zone, and that was a great play call, great use of his legs. But in the first quarter? Terrible use. And he could learn a thing or two from Jimmy about QB sneaks as well. It's weird to see how terrible our offense has been on fourth downs with Trey, while we were pretty good with Jimmy, I think. 

What I loved about yesterday's game, it's that all of our playmakers got to make plays. Maybe not enough in certain cases, but when we run a clock control type of offense, you'd need more than 60 minutes to give everyone his due. But Aiyuk made several incredible plays. Deebo had the bomb and a few decent runs. George had just the one amazing catch. Elijah did Elijah things.

And we had a kid run onto the field. What more can you ask?

[Ataal]

I just wanted to give a shout out to the defense for keeping the score manageable early on.  I'm glad that Lance got more comfortable as the game went on, but I wonder how differently the game plays out if the Texans go up 2 or 3 scores in the first half.

In any case, on to the Rams!