KManX89 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 1 hour ago, D82 said: https://twitter.com/manabyte/status/1163934719018328064?s=21 Oh thank God. Marvel/Disney should just play ball with whatever Sony wants, though. Having a smaller cut is preferable to not having Spider-Man appear in any future MCU films, I think they know that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 This would hurt Sony more than Disney. Lol. Disney should let them do it with a wink/nod to Holland to come back in 4 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 If this fast tracks Mutants, I’m okay with it. Getting a little burnt out on MCU anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Could you imagine the backlash Sony would receive if they took Spider-Man out of the MCU? They wouldn’t be able to make a successful Spider-Man movie for 20 years. And MCU fans would actively boycott Venom 2. If this happens, it would tell me everything I already knew about Sony and the people they have making decisions for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Outpost31 said: Could you imagine the backlash Sony would receive if they took Spider-Man out of the MCU? They wouldn’t be able to make a successful Spider-Man movie for 20 years. And MCU fans would actively boycott Venom 2. If this happens, it would tell me everything I already knew about Sony and the people they have making decisions for them. It would still make Sony a boatload of money. Look at Into The Spiderverse. Look what Venom did alone. MCU enthusiasts are still a small contingent compared to the casual movie goer. Millions of people see these movies, and just think anything with the Marvel logo is under the same umbrella. Heck, a lot of people don't know the difference between DC and Marvel. The majority of cash flow is going to come from folks that aren't really concerned about film rights for characters between studios. That being said, it's probably in the interest of both sides to make a deal. Edited August 21, 2019 by PapaShogun 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) Also, too bad Fiege has to go in front of all those ticked fans at D23 this weekend, and maybe do some damage repair for something he had no control over. Alan Horn needs to GTFO. Almost screwed up Guardians 3 too. Also, Holland just unfollowed Sony media accounts in his IG. Coincidence? Hmmm... Edited August 21, 2019 by PapaShogun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 7 hours ago, PapaShogun said: It would still make Sony a boatload of money. Look at Into The Spiderverse. Look what Venom did alone. MCU enthusiasts are still a small contingent compared to the casual movie goer. Millions of people see these movies, and just think anything with the Marvel logo is under the same umbrella. Heck, a lot of people don't know the difference between DC and Marvel. The majority of cash flow is going to come from folks that aren't really concerned about film rights for characters between studios. That being said, it's probably in the interest of both sides to make a deal. Don’t think you understand the reality of fandom right now. Their last two live action Spider-Man movies bombed hard. The last X-Men movie bombed hard. Fans aren’t ****ing with stuff that’s not in the MCU. And don’t even go there with Venom. Venom made 213 million domestically. It didn’t do as well as Sony pretends it did. I’ve gone over that before. They let Disney use Spider-Man for a reason. If they made a Spider-Man movie right now not connected to the MCU and without Holland, it would Waterworld bomb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 They'll both blink. Sony will just blink harder. Stupid for both parties if they don't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gnat Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 16 minutes ago, MikeT14 said: They'll both blink. Sony will just blink harder. Stupid for both parties if they don't. Yup, I'd put money on that, not Sony/Disney type of money, if I had that I'd be running the MCU, but a small amount of money. Sony doing Spider-Man would work fine, however, the returns would diminish over time and probably fairly quickly as right now it has a slot in MCU movie line-up, in the future it would just be another super hero movie to watch. I get why both of them are doing this though. Marvel didn't have a good deal getting 5% of the gross and merchandising. And 50% of the gross is unreasonable for Sony to accept, I suspect in the end it will be some deal around 20% that Marvel gets, that makes it worthwhile for them and makes it very worthwhile for Sony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Before we rehash the "Venom still made a boatload of money" argument, maybe we can do a TL:DR post, before it spirals into pages.... 1. Venom did make 850M worldwide. But worldwide profit returns aren't close to 1:1, much lower returns. As such, domestic successes have a much bigger impact. No argument that it made money, but it's not nearly the runaway success as when a movie's domestic box office soars above production & marketing costs. As Venom cost about 100M to make, usually it's doubled for advertising/marketing/other, the 200M costs were barely matched by the domestic take of 213M. The international $ was the profit, but the margins were much, much smaller. And that makes for bigger concerns with sustainability of a franchise, when the opening chapter in planned trilogy/series doesn't create an automatic domestic winner. 2. Venom also made a ton of $ being front-loaded domestically, and from international sales. That's another major warning flag to movie studios for future chapters. Basically, the need to see if the Venom franchise could take off sold it to NA audiences. It made 50 percent of its entire domestic earnings in the first week. That's a major warning flag for any sequels. Now, I know someone is going to point out the mega-movies are front-loaded too - fair point. But their gross totals were so much higher, and well above production costs, that doubling up on 300-400M Week 1 is a lot more impressive than doubling up on a 50-100M week 1. Now, the lure of the hero franchise reigns supreme - so it's absolutely a risk worth taking. It's why Suicide Squad 2 is going for it with James Gunn, and why Sony is sticking to its guns. But man, using the "Venom made $" argument is the classic "true for that movie...but doesn't say anything reassuring for a sequel". I mean, Independance Day & Starship Troopers (which actually gets unfair reviews IMO, but that's another story) made a ton of $...but the sequels bombed hard. IIRC they had the same issues above, and why execs pulled the plug on franchise starters when they show the same problems. OK, that wasn't a TL:DR post, but hopefully it avoids pages of the prior "domestic vs. international" box-office arguments...lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_z34 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Sony made a ton of money with Venom with no Spiderman in it. Imagine now if they did put Spidey in it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Just now, buddy_z34 said: Sony made a ton of money with Venom with no Spiderman in it. Imagine now if they did put Spidey in it. For the love of God, why are there two people on this entire thread that understand domestic versus international box office? Venom did NOT make a ton of money compared to literally every other superhero movie made in the past 10 years. Suicide Squad made more money for DC than Venom made for Sony. This is all of course neglecting the backlash Sony would receive if they deprived Marvel fans of SpiderMan being in the MCU. If you or anybody thinks that there wouldn't be a massive backlash and boycott of the second Venom movie and every stupid Venom spinoff for them killing Holland's Spider-Man, you're out of your damn mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gnat Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Random idea/thought, could this be something that Sony could be doing and pushing for to get Venom into the MCU as their end goal for the MCU bump in terms of the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: For the love of God, why are there two people on this entire thread that understand domestic versus international box office? Because you guys still underrate the International Box Office. Its still important, it still counts as money made (sure not the same as Domestic) and every argument started about it you guys pretend like its Monopoly money and doesn't count at all. You have to atleast admit they love to tout that International total, and it is mostly the sole reason Venom is getting a squeal. 5 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: This is all of course neglecting the backlash Sony would receive if they deprived Marvel fans of SpiderMan being in the MCU. I dont know if we will ever get the real story of how this is going down right now, but to just assume all fault on Sony here is a really Marvel fanboy-ish stance. You think that Disney/Marvel is just standing there like the bully took their toy and left them on the playground with nothing? It seems more likely to me that the juggernaut that is the MCU wanted more, more money, more control, more everything Spidey. I dont blame them, and I dont blame Sony for wanting to hang onto the one big hit they have with a death grip either. But after the very lack-luster Phase 4 announcement, Losing the possibility of Spider-Man is going to hurt the MCU too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 5 minutes ago, The Gnat said: Random idea/thought, could this be something that Sony could be doing and pushing for to get Venom into the MCU as their end goal for the MCU bump in terms of the money. No. Lol. Sony’s stock took a hit immediately after this story broke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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