bruceb Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 22 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said: You don't use the #1 overall pick on a QB that is a year or two away from starting Ya, I guess GB screwed up on Rodgers and NE on Jimmy G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 1 hour ago, bruceb said: Ya, I guess GB screwed up on Rodgers and NE on Jimmy G. They were in the exact situations I mentioned. Favre/Brady were there so they could use a 2nd round pick to groom a project QB for the future. They didn't trade up to #1 overall to get them nor would they consider it. I have no issue at all with what they did, 2nd round QBs should be seen as potential starters and if you get lucky they could have success right away. They didn't have Kizer as a starting QB who needs replaced immediately nor did they have to trade or sign a QB to start while those players got ready if it were necessary, we would. If Darnold is the average of Kizer, Carr, Garaoppolo, Geno, Osweiler, Dalton, Kaep, Clausen, Pat White, Brohm, Henne, Kolb/Beck etc... he should be drafted in the 2nd round as a project. If he is selected #1 overall he better be ready to start day 1. Same with Rosen and Mayfield. You don't buy a new car to invest money to get it running, that is what the #1 pick should be, ready to drive off of the lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 9 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said: If he is selected #1 overall he better be ready to start day 1 Sorry, I do not subscribe to this pov. We are not going to win enough games soon enough for it to matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 1 hour ago, bruceb said: Sorry, I do not subscribe to this pov. We are not going to win enough games soon enough for it to matter. It's not about winning it's about putting the best player on your team at a position in a starting role. If the #1 overall pick isn't the best player at his position on the roster you should have selected someone else. Who would draft Barkly #1 overall and start Duke? Grab an OT #1 overall and not start him? Others can feel however they want but my #1 overall pick is starting if I'm in charge and if I don't project him being good enough to start immediately and learn on the job I no longer even consider him at #1 overall, nor at #4 for that matter. Superbowl winners picking at #32 can grab someone who may not start, 0-16 teams shouldn't ever, repeat, EVER consider drafting a back up at #1 overall even if it's just for a year or two. EVER. If Darnold is #1, he starts if healthy. Otherwise, grab yourself someone who can start. For the record I see no reason why he can't start, I think at least 3 QBs can start right away and probably 6 of them on this Browns team. I don't think 6 are better than Kessler but I don't project Kessler being here, so 6 should be better than Hogan/Kizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 23 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said: It's not about winning it's about putting the best player on your team at a position in a starting role. If the #1 overall pick isn't the best player at his position on the roster you should have selected someone else. Who would draft Barkly #1 overall and start Duke? Grab an OT #1 overall and not start him? Others can feel however they want but my #1 overall pick is starting if I'm in charge and if I don't project him being good enough to start immediately and learn on the job I no longer even consider him at #1 overall, nor at #4 for that matter. Superbowl winners picking at #32 can grab someone who may not start, 0-16 teams shouldn't ever, repeat, EVER consider drafting a back up at #1 overall even if it's just for a year or two. EVER. If Darnold is #1, he starts if healthy. Otherwise, grab yourself someone who can start. For the record I see no reason why he can't start, I think at least 3 QBs can start right away and probably 6 of them on this Browns team. I don't think 6 are better than Kessler but I don't project Kessler being here, so 6 should be better than Hogan/Kizer. Patience is a virtue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateDawg Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 3 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: Yeah I'll pass on a QB that needs a year or two to develop, I'd pick him in the 2nd round if I needed an eventual replacement for my vet or just wanted a project but I'm not spending a 1st on a QB that you have to rebuild. If it is something they could have worked out prior to the season and he works on throughout the season then sure. There is always a chance that tinkering with his mechanics could make him worse and you have to go back to where he was originally, it happens. You don't use the #1 overall pick on a QB that is a year or two away from starting, that is what the 2nd round or later is for. If we draft Darnold his *** better be ready to start day 1, this is a strong QB class and there are other options who I believe will be ready and will be starting day 1. Bad take. Whatever QB we take, I don’t want him out there until he’s ready. If that means we draft the guy that’s the long-term best QB, that’s who I want, period. I don’t want to simply target the QB that has a best chance of getting us to a meaningless 5 wins in 2018. Long term goals here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FGK Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 As I continue to love our one pretty unanimous QB take, that Josh Allen is not worth an early first round pick, I would like to share with you all the glory that is... Www.draftjoshallen.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 8 minutes ago, freakygeniuskid said: As I continue to love our one pretty unanimous QB take, that Josh Allen is not worth an early first round pick, I would like to share with you all the glory that is... Www.draftjoshallen.com Is this your site? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 1 hour ago, bruceb said: Patience is a virtue? So we should wait until there is a draft where there is a QB that is ready to play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 1 hour ago, NateDawg said: Bad take. Whatever QB we take, I don’t want him out there until he’s ready. If that means we draft the guy that’s the long-term best QB, that’s who I want, period. I don’t want to simply target the QB that has a best chance of getting us to a meaningless 5 wins in 2018. Long term goals here. Well whatever QB we get I don't want him at #1 overall unless he is capable of being ready to start the year. We get our pick of the bunch. There is no reason to sit a great prospect. If he can't play at the NFL level immediately he isn't a great prospect. He may be a good prospect but not a great one and not one I would take in the top 10. Darnold is the same age as Rosen. He only has 300 less college pass attempts. He played some QB as a sophomore in HS and was the starter his JR and SR years even though he was injured his JR year. If he isn't ready to play in the NFL for a year or two I pass. So you think there are better QBs available but Darnold will somehow be better than them down the road because he needs to change the way he throws a football? What if he doesn't have any zip with his new throwing motion? Who is better 5 years down the road then? Just sounds like a huge gamble at #1. This is a QB league, the rules favor them so much if #1 can't be ready to have some success out of the gate I'm not wasting my time on him. Kizer is understandable, he wasn't a top pick so there wasn't really a letdown for me, I didn't expect much and even though he delivered less than that I could handle it because it wasn't drastically worse than I could have expected. Darnold should start day 1 if draft #1 and he should at worst be a 78 passer rating or better as a rookie. That is low end expectations. Realistic expectation from me is above 85. I also have the belief that you can't break a QB unless it would happen eventually anyway so you may as well get it out of the way ASAP. Not that he would be coming into a bad situation we have a decent OL assuming Joe comes back. Any of the top 3 QBs should experience some success as a rookie. We have what looks to be a tough schedule so there may only be a few wins but the passing game should look a lot better than 2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownLeader Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 3 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: It's not about winning it's about putting the best player on your team at a position in a starting role. If the #1 overall pick isn't the best player at his position on the roster you should have selected someone else. Who would draft Barkly #1 overall and start Duke? Grab an OT #1 overall and not start him? Others can feel however they want but my #1 overall pick is starting if I'm in charge and if I don't project him being good enough to start immediately and learn on the job I no longer even consider him at #1 overall, nor at #4 for that matter. Superbowl winners picking at #32 can grab someone who may not start, 0-16 teams shouldn't ever, repeat, EVER consider drafting a back up at #1 overall even if it's just for a year or two. EVER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztec Hammer Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 5 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: So we should wait until there is a draft where there is a QB that is ready to play? Jared Goff wasn't ready to start day one. Probably shouldn't have played at all that first season considering what it could've done to him. Would you spend the first pick on him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 7 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: So we should wait until there is a draft where there is a QB that is ready to play? You mean like Wentz or Watson? Yeah, we should wait to draft them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztec Hammer Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Was watching some Baker Mayfield stuff in the hope that I would forge a bit of a liking for him. Man, just taking all the on field stuff out of it for a second and focusing solely on his attitude and personality... I'm just not there yet. There was an interview where he spoke about why he hates the Longhorns. I'm all for the chip on the shoulder but to me it came off really immature, the way he just said his piece and walked off. The flag planting, crotch grabbing and throat slashing gestures. I've sort of tried to internalise that it's not a big deal in the grand scheme of things but I think it is. It's the little things that make up the grand scheme and define who you are. It's immature man, and I dread to think how emotionally negative his reactions will be in the pros when the failure rate is ratcheted up many levels and experienced a lot more than at the college levels. The police video is the hardest thing for me to get over though. The other stuff is immature antics but you can sort of try to explain it away as competitive fire or whatever. The police video is real life, and not only does he get pulled for drunk and disorderly or whatever it is, but he actually tries to run. That's just really troubling decision making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 From my take from Thomas is the Browns shouldn’t draft a QB and sign a Vet QB like Cousins or McCarron because those guys will lead to immediate success because that’s all that matters when getting a QB. If you don’t plan to start that QB from day1 he isn’t worth drafting. So the browns should just sign a guy who could come in and be the day 1 starter then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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