2023 Draft Talk

[The Gnat]

UCLA's Dorian Thompson-Robinson would be my next one.

[Boda]

5 hours ago, swede700 said:

McCombs neglecting the resources into the team came after the Denny era when he couldn't get the new stadium.  And Denny was the Vikings' head coach and defacto GM for 6 years before Red even bought the team.  The failures on defense were all Denny's inability to identify defensive talent in the draft and free agency.  The only defensive players he had of any substance were either acquired before he got there (Randle, Henry Thomas) or lucked into them via UDFA or late round (Ed McDaniel and Robert Griffith). 

Thats not true, its kind of hard to bring in premier defensive talent when your owner refused to spend.  Its really that simple.  We already agreed he was horrible identifying Defensive talent in the draft so can you please stop trying to pass McCombs failures off on Denny Green?  McCombs was trying to get a new stadium here the day he built the team and kept running into obstacle after obstacle which not only led to him selling the team, Finally.  His ** traded Moss in the process

[swede700]

10 minutes ago, Boda said:

Thats not true, its kind of hard to bring in premier defensive talent when your owner refused to spend.  Its really that simple.  We already agreed he was horrible identifying Defensive talent in the draft so can you please stop trying to pass McCombs failures off on Denny Green?  McCombs was trying to get a new stadium here the day he built the team and kept running into obstacle after obstacle which not only led to him selling the team, Finally.  His ** traded Moss in the process

You're thinking way too late in the process.  Denny was doing all the drafting and bringing in talent starting in 1992.  Red didn't even take ownership until the 1998 season.  That's fine if you want to blame Red for everything that happened after, but the failures of Denny's defenses took place long before that.  After the 1998 season, Denny was only in charge for basically 3 seasons of full McCombs ownership...he was in charge for 6 seasons before that.  You're trying to excuse Denny.  It was after the 2000 season when Red started being cheap, you either aren't old enough to remember pre-Red or are just having revisionist history. 

For as "cheap" as you think Red was, John Randle's cap number was nearly 13% of the cap during the 2000 season, larger than what Kirk's percentage is for this coming season, and a larger cap hit than any other DT in today, except for Chris Jones.  Red's cheapness reputation and reality came in the 2001 season, after Robert Smith walked away, the death of Korey Stringer and the firing of Denny with 1 game to go and promoting Tice to full-time head coach.  You've lumped the later ownership of Red after Denny with the majority of Denny's tenure and the early tenure of Red.  They are 2 completely different eras. 

[swede700]

 

[battle2heaven]

2 hours ago, The Gnat said:

UCLA's Dorian Thompson-Robinson would be my next one.

he's my bae.

[solidvikingfan]

 

[SemperFeist]

Mazi Smith isn’t getting talked about enough amongst Vikings fans. 

He’s a meat and potatoes type pick. Nothing flashy. Isn’t going to dominate a box score. But a guy like him in the middle of the d-line could open up so much for everyone else. 

[swede700]

Quote

 

Iowa State wide receiver Xavier Hutchinson ’s path to get where he is now was a bit longer than most after starting his collegiate career at Blinn College, a junior college in Brenham, Texas. But after three years at Iowa State that featured three first-team All-Big 12 nods and a 2022 season that made him a first-team All-American and Biletnikoff Award finalist, he’s established himself as one of the top-10 receivers available in the 2023 NFL Draft class.

The Iowa State product is a scheme-versatile receiver, so he could fit anywhere. But these four teams in particular could use a receiver like Hutchinson if he’s on the board where they’re picking on day two.

Minnesota Vikings

There’s a good chance that the Vikings will look for a strong No. 2 receiver in the 2023 draft rather than settle for who they have already. Hutchinson’s skill set would be a great complement to Justin Jefferson’s explosive playmaking ability. He’s a good route-runner contested-catch winner that picks up yards after the catch and produces consistently. Hutchinson could fill a role similar to what Tee Higgins or Tyler Boyd do for the Cincinnati Bengals behind Ja’Marr Chase.

 

https://thedraftnetwork.com/xavier-hutchinson-nfl-draft-ravens-panthers-vikings-texans/

[JDBrocks]

On 3/1/2023 at 10:57 AM, battle2heaven said:

ok cool, thank you!

Did you wish they moved him around a bit, rushing from different gaps, etc?

 

I found this interesting!

[Boda]

On 4/3/2023 at 3:11 PM, swede700 said:

You're thinking way too late in the process.  Denny was doing all the drafting and bringing in talent starting in 1992.  Red didn't even take ownership until the 1998 season.  That's fine if you want to blame Red for everything that happened after, but the failures of Denny's defenses took place long before that.  After the 1998 season, Denny was only in charge for basically 3 seasons of full McCombs ownership...he was in charge for 6 seasons before that.  You're trying to excuse Denny.  It was after the 2000 season when Red started being cheap, you either aren't old enough to remember pre-Red or are just having revisionist history. 

For as "cheap" as you think Red was, John Randle's cap number was nearly 13% of the cap during the 2000 season, larger than what Kirk's percentage is for this coming season, and a larger cap hit than any other DT in today, except for Chris Jones.  Red's cheapness reputation and reality came in the 2001 season, after Robert Smith walked away, the death of Korey Stringer and the firing of Denny with 1 game to go and promoting Tice to full-time head coach.  You've lumped the later ownership of Red after Denny with the majority of Denny's tenure and the early tenure of Red.  They are 2 completely different eras. 

Definitely old enough however when we get to those earlier 90's I was younger so maybe might be remembering stuff a little bit different but from 94 on there should be no issues & I don't feel Im having revisionist history either.  Ive already said that Denny was a horrible judge of Defensive talent through the draft.  The Vikings pre-McCombs werent a very good team and I blame that completely on the Herschel Walker trade in '89.  They simply gave up far too much and never were able to recover from that.  We basically gifted the Cowboys their dynasty

John Randle's cap was so high because the Vikings continually needed to get to the Floor of the cap because Red was so cheap. Robert Smith didn't walk away because of money issues so bringing him up just seems odd to me, almost like you were trying to use Red's penny pinching as a reason he walked away.

The fact remains that Red never invested anything more than he had to into the Vikings since the day he bought the team in 1998, he didn't just randomly start to be cheap in 2001, Three years later because of the stadium issues. So Im failing to see how you think Im lumping the two ERA's together, I fully believe there are completely 2 different reasons but Im also not naive enough to believe that what I say is the be all end all. 

You could be completely right about Denny Green being a complete idiot when it comes to Defensive talent all together,  I just kind of see it differently much like I view Tice much differently than others because I feel he never got a fair shake and was the scape goat

[Boda]

8 hours ago, SemperFeist said:

Mazi Smith isn’t getting talked about enough amongst Vikings fans. 

He’s a meat and potatoes type pick. Nothing flashy. Isn’t going to dominate a box score. But a guy like him in the middle of the d-line could open up so much for everyone else. 

I like him but I feel like he's more of a mid 2nd - mid 3rd round guy.  I do feel the defense is missing this type of defender though who excels in run defense.  Im just a bigger Gervon Dexter fan I guess who I also feel isn't being talked about enough or maybe Ive missed it.

[ArcticNorseman]

2 hours ago, Boda said:

I like him but I feel like he's more of a mid 2nd - mid 3rd round guy.  I do feel the defense is missing this type of defender though who excels in run defense.  Im just a bigger Gervon Dexter fan I guess who I also feel isn't being talked about enough or maybe Ive missed it.

Both Mazi Smith and Gervon Dexter are really good linemen.  Think they perform different roles though.   I view Smith as a true NT and more of a need in a 3-4 base set.   Dexter seems destined to be a 4-3 3T or UT . . . Although, in a 3-4 and a couple years gaining mass/strength could be a real handful as a super tall NT with reach.  

Would I spend a 1st rounder at #23?  Probably not, but it a Philly or KC wanted to swap 1st rounders, or if the Vikes made a trade to net a high 2nd, I would have to believe either would be in play. 

[JDBrocks]

I would love Dexter. Tailor made 5T for a Flores defense.

[Sad People]

Todd McShay had us taking Hendon Hooker at 23 in his latest mock

[Purplepride323]

35 minutes ago, Sad People said:

Todd McShay had us taking Hendon Hooker at 23 in his latest mock

I would hate this pick for too many reasons. First, I would hate to take another 1st rounder who will miss his rookie season due to injury. Second, the QB class next year is one of the best in recent years. Better than the Trevor Lawrence class. Also, Hendon Hooker is already 25 years old. He’s older than Trey Lance. So taking a guy at 23, with all of those things in consideration, makes no sense. I’d rather trade for Trey Lance and take a chance on him than take a 25 year old QB who will miss the season because of an ACL tear. If I were Kwesi, I’d focus on building a great defense through this draft. The offense is pretty set, only missing a WR, so there aren’t too many holes to fill there. Wait until next year to draft a 1st round QB. I’d take Spencer Rattler or JJ McCarthy over Hendon Hooker. 

Edited April 5, 2023 by Purplepride323