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Cavaliers Thread: We Somehow Both Don't and Do Suck


LETSGOBROWNIES

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On 1/23/2024 at 12:08 AM, sdrawkcab321 said:

It’s not a coincidence that we’re good without garland. A 2 small guard lineup just doesn’t work. They need to choose between the two. 

I don’t think it’s just the size thing either, both Garland and Mitchell are ball dominant as hell.

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55 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I don’t think it’s just the size thing either, both Garland and Mitchell are ball dominant as hell.

It is a size thing. There hasn’t been a 2 guard lineup under 6’2 to win a title since the black and white era. Yeah the ball dominate thing matters but not as much as the size. It makes playing defense impossible. 

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I'm not sure how we will end up with anything that would be comparable in value.  We have plenty of role players on this team.  Can we get a quality stretch 3 for Garland?  I don't know......They can try and limit their time on the court together?   I don't see a great solutions, especially not know what Mitchell is going to do at the end of his contract.

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4 minutes ago, big poppa pump said:

I'm not sure how we will end up with anything that would be comparable in value.  We have plenty of role players on this team.  Can we get a quality stretch 3 for Garland?  I don't know......They can try and limit their time on the court together?   I don't see a great solutions, especially not know what Mitchell is going to do at the end of his contract.

A quality stretch 3? Garland would go for much much more than that. Regardless we’re not trading him until we know what Mitchell is going to do in free agency. 

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Just now, sdrawkcab321 said:

A quality stretch 3? Garland would go for much much more than that. Regardless we’re not trading him until we know what Mitchell is going to do in free agency. 

Actually meant stretch 4...but you know what I mean...and we have some dudes like that already (on a lower level)

I mean I would take Markkanen back.......

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2 hours ago, sdrawkcab321 said:

It is a size thing. There hasn’t been a 2 guard lineup under 6’2 to win a title since the black and white era. Yeah the ball dominate thing matters but not as much as the size. It makes playing defense impossible. 

We literally had the best defense in the NBA last season and did amazing defensively in the playoffs. We lost because we couldn’t score. 

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3 minutes ago, sdrawkcab321 said:

We had the best defense because we played the slowest pace

We played at a slow pace but I'm not talking points per game - that's an archaic measure nobody uses anymore. 

Cavs 2023 Rankings

Offensive Rating: 8th

Defensive Rating: 1st 

^ those are per possession metrics, meaning we scored the 8th most points per possession and allowed the least amount of points per defensive possession on. 

 

For comparison on 'can you win a title with a defense like that' - the answer is yes, because we didnt win a title and the other 29 teams had a worse defense. But for context, the Nuggets won with the 16th rated defense. In 2021, the Bucks won with the 10th rated defense. 

 

This year the Cavs have the #2 rated defense per possession but the #16 rated offense per possession. We play at a slightly below average pace of play. 

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6 minutes ago, BetterCallSaul said:

I feel like Mitchell would be a monster off the ball if he really wanted to be. That said, his explosion and athleticism really shows when he's got the ball in his hands driving past people.

 

DG has a higher basketball IQ, but isn't nearly the player.

Both DG and Mitchell are awesome off ball but coaching offball play is more tactically difficult 

 

Flowing stuff through one player all game is easy and effective but limits upside substantially

 

Remember pre-2015 Curry? He spammed the pick n roll all game long. He was fantastic and the Warriors were good and won playoff series and Curry was a top 15 guy. But his game unlocked when Kerr went to a motion offense instead of a PnR spam offense and Curry became the greatest off ball player in the history of the NBA. Curry went from the 15th best player in the NBA to a top 15 player in NBA history. 
 

But it requires a coach to play to a players strength instead of coaching to the path of least resistance which is one man ISO or PnR spam

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On 1/28/2024 at 4:31 AM, candyman93 said:

The Clippers are finally championship caliber.

 

There biggest flaw has always been injuries, so it remains to be seen.

Well we just womped them at full strength without DG and Mobley on a minutes restriction. 

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