Mr Anonymous Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 Just now, Leader said: No....you're not going there again are you? Seems like people here were going on about the issues with this team's way of doing things 3-4 pages back. Don't act like it's just me. I'll just leave this here... https://theathletic.com/3738786/2022/10/31/packers-chiefs-nfl-trade-deadline/ Quote The Chiefs have a structural advantage. Think how complicated it must be for a bill to become a law in the Packers’ organization. President Mark Murphy, general manager Brian Gutekunst, coach Matt LaFleur and the increasingly emboldened Rodgers all must sign off, to varying degrees, for Green Bay to make significant decisions regarding the offense. Did we mention Russ Ball, who oversees the salary cap? Quote The Packers are still set up like (former GM) Ted Thompson is there,” said an AFC exec, who spoke on the condition of anonymity for competitive reasons. “Personnel does the personnel and coaches coach who they give them. Where in Kansas City, Andy doesn’t have anyone to blame. If he signs a free agent, he has a clear vision for how they want them to be used and he is getting more production out of those guys. If it doesn’t work, like with the back from Pittsburgh (Le’Veon Bell), Andy puts up with him for part of the season and then makes him inactive for the Super Bowl. Think how hard it would be for LaFleur to make, say, Randall Cobb inactive for a big game. He’d have to meet with Rodgers and then meet with Gutey, because it’s still set up the old way. Quote Murphy, the Packers’ president, vowed in April that Green Bay’s receiver room would look much different come September. “I know you are concerned about our wide receiver position,” Murphy wrote on the Packers’ web site in early April, “but we have almost six months left before we play our first game. With four picks in the first two rounds, we have the draft capital to either trade for a veteran receiver or draft a top-quality receiver(s). I’m confident that our wide receiver room will look very different in September than it does now.” When September arrived, the additions included Watkins, Christian Watson in the second round and Doubs in the fourth. Watkins had missed 10 games over the previous two seasons and had averaged 505 yards receiving over a six-year stretch. There wasn’t much to choose from in free agency, but the Chiefs got JuJu Smith-Schuster and ex-Packer Marquez Valdes-Scantling, whom the market valued more than Watkins. Quote KC had an answer and a plan, and they committed to it,” an exec said. “It does not seem like Green Bay did. And I’m not talking just this year. It is years in the making. It's not working. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitnhope Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 8 hours ago, DWhitehurst said: While trading for a WR who was a great fit and at a fair price in terms of draft collateral would have been nice, nevertheless, after what we've seen through 8 games. trading a high pick for one of these WR's which were on the trade market was not going to win us a Super Bowl this year. It may not even get us to the playoffs. A WR isn't going to solve the problems with the Defense and the Oline. This 3-5 team is not a legit Super Bowl contender this year. I'm sorry, but it isn't. At best, a Wild Card team that falls short of the NFC Championship, although even that is doubtful at this point. So I myself am ok with them failing to make a trade for a WR now, that is, one that makes sense as far as fit and price. We weren't going to win a Super Bowl with just a new WR this year anyways. There's always hope for next year. Always. Of course, that may take alot of offseason moves which are not all trade related. Like, perhaps alot of firings. Agree that there was no acquisition that was going to get us to a SB. That is a pretty big ask. We should have been looking for core players that we could pick up with an eye toward keeping them for multiple years. Incremental improvements to the roster. Hockenson would have been a player we should have looked at. Good young player that we could have kept for multiple years. The kind of player you can build around. Our TE room is pretty empty. The cost in draft picks to Minnesota was reasonable, with the likelihood that Gute does better with those draft picks being low. We play at the edges but never make the bigger moves needed. Seems the goal is to be decent rather than doing what is possible to win championships. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 52 minutes ago, Mr Anonymous said: Seems like people here were going on about the issues with this team's way of doing things 3-4 pages back. Don't act like it's just me. I'll just leave this here... https://theathletic.com/3738786/2022/10/31/packers-chiefs-nfl-trade-deadline/ It's not working. So it's official. You are going there....but it will be without me. We've been there / discussed this to death already. Failure to make good decisions isnt a structural impediment. It's just poor judgement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 8 minutes ago, hitnhope said: Agree that there was no acquisition that was going to get us to a SB. That is a pretty big ask. We should have been looking for core players that we could pick up with an eye toward keeping them for multiple years. Incremental improvements to the roster. Hockenson would have been a player we should have looked at. Good young player that we could have kept for multiple years. The kind of player you can build around. Our TE room is pretty empty. The cost in draft picks to Minnesota was reasonable, with the likelihood that Gute does better with those draft picks being low. We play at the edges but never make the bigger moves needed. Seems the goal is to be decent rather than doing what is possible to win championships. The Packers need a shrewd GM or Head Coach that is in charge of all football decision making. The four pillars isn't getting it done. We need this generations Ron Wolf. I wonder how the next potential team president views things? It's thought to be Ed Policy, who really does not have as strong of a pure football background. You'd have to think he would maybe want to go back to having one GM running the football operation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 54 minutes ago, Mr Anonymous said: Seems like people here were going on about the issues with this team's way of doing things 3-4 pages back. Don't act like it's just me. I'll just leave this here... https://theathletic.com/3738786/2022/10/31/packers-chiefs-nfl-trade-deadline/ It's not working. I mean, anytime you can pay 10mil/year for a guy averaging 53 yards per game in the easiest offense to get yards, you gotta do it, right? I'm not sure losing MVS is the foundational piece of evidence upon which you want to ground your thesis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Anonymous Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Leader said: So it's official. You are going there....but it will be without me. We've been there / discussed this to death already. Failure to make good decisions isnt a structural impediment. It's just poor judgement. If the world hasn't figured out by now that the more cooks you have in the kitchen the more you open yourself up to chaos, indecision, and error, then the world never will. Think about your daily life. When a task needs to be completed, do you feel better or worse when you have to run it through many people to get it done? Edited November 2, 2022 by Mr Anonymous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Anonymous Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said: I mean, anytime you can pay 10mil/year for a guy averaging 53 yards per game in the easiest offense to get yards, you gotta do it, right? I'm not sure losing MVS is the foundational piece of evidence upon which you want to ground your thesis. Yeah because that's clearly the foundational piece of evidence. Did you even hesitate before you typed that out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 16 minutes ago, hitnhope said: Agree that there was no acquisition that was going to get us to a SB. That is a pretty big ask. We should have been looking for core players that we could pick up with an eye toward keeping them for multiple years. Incremental improvements to the roster. Hockenson would have been a player we should have looked at. Good young player that we could have kept for multiple years. The kind of player you can build around. Our TE room is pretty empty. The cost in draft picks to Minnesota was reasonable, with the likelihood that Gute does better with those draft picks being low. We play at the edges but never make the bigger moves needed. Seems the goal is to be decent rather than doing what is possible to win championships. Hockenson is a free agent after next year and is going to want a huge contract. If you're not a team that pays TEs (and we're not) he's a two year acquisition and you know in year 1, he and Rodgers aren't going to be on the same page. He's also going to have a ton of leverage in the negotiation as he's going to know if you traded the picks for him, it looks bad on the FO if he walks immediately. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 1 minute ago, Mr Anonymous said: Yeah because that's clearly the foundational piece of evidence. Did you even hesitate before you typed that out? What is that piece of evidence then? Your own cited article acknowledges there wasn't **** out there in Free Agency to go get a WR. Unless you wanted JuJu's crazy ***. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Anonymous Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 For the challenged among us, the point of the article of how other NFL executives are illustrating how Green Bay's structure makes it unnecessarily difficult to implement a plan and execute it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 I agree that 4 pillars is a problem. I also agree that MVS sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopackgonerd Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 I'm pretty sure it's not THAT difficult to decide if Randall Cobb should play or not on a given sunday lol. What a weird exaggerated example they gave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 1 hour ago, Mr Anonymous said: Seems like people here were going on about the issues with this team's way of doing things 3-4 pages back. Don't act like it's just me. I'll just leave this here... https://theathletic.com/3738786/2022/10/31/packers-chiefs-nfl-trade-deadline/ It's not working. It's the same system that Ron Wolf set up, only Murphy has stuck his nose into the coach hiring aspect of it and taken some power away from the GM there. We're like top 3 in wins since Wolf took over, think it works just fine. KC has an experienced HC with a young QB, we have a young HC with an experienced QB. Mahomes does what Rei tells him to, LaFleur does what Rodgers tells him to. Reid made a really good DC hire in Spags, LaFleur made a **** hire in Barry. There's the reasons why the Chiefs are good and we are not. Their DC is getting the most out of their defense, and their HC doesn't have to pander to his QB for every gameplan and playcall. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Anonymous Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said: What is that piece of evidence then? Your own cited article acknowledges there wasn't **** out there in Free Agency to go get a WR. Unless you wanted JuJu's crazy ***. Shouldn't you be spending hours compiling a handful of select plays to show how all of this is Aaron Rodgers' fault? I mean that's what you're doing here. Picking out one aspect of an article and trying to turn that into what the entire article is about to then try and say it's thus flawed. Even the flaw you try to point out is based in ill logic. MVS isn't effective because he puts up 8 catches for 100 yards each week. He can be used effectively to stretch defenses and open things up for others. If I'm not mistaken the Packers scored around 8-10 more points per game with him on the field. KC and GB both traded away clear #1 WRs last year. One of those teams has actually improved on offense this year. One team knows what it's team needs to make it offense click and goes out and gets exactly what it needs with a clear plan. Green Bay can have a plan but it has a structure making it much more difficult to implement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Anonymous Posted November 2, 2022 Share Posted November 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: It's the same system that Ron Wolf set up, only Murphy has stuck his nose into the coach hiring aspect of it and taken some power away from the GM there. We're like top 3 in wins since Wolf took over, think it works just fine. KC has an experienced HC with a young QB, we have a young HC with an experienced QB. Mahomes does what Rei tells him to, LaFleur does what Rodgers tells him to. Reid made a really good DC hire in Spags, LaFleur made a **** hire in Barry. There's the reasons why the Chiefs are good and we are not. Their DC is getting the most out of their defense, and their HC doesn't have to pander to his QB for every gameplan and playcall. Did you say that out loud first? Perhaps you should have. The Packers under the structure Murphy set up do not operate the same way they did under Wolf and Thompson. They are taking bits and pieces of what each of Gute, MLF, and Ball want to do and trying to mash it together. It's not an instant failure but over time it will fail and we're seeing the evidence of it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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