Is Mac Jones done in NE?

[lancerman]

22 hours ago, biggie. said:

Jack Jones

Marcus Jones

Rhamondre Stevenson

Josh Uche

Christian Barmore

Jakobi Meyers

Kyle Dugger

Michael Owenwu

Mac Jones (depending on your perspective)

All post-Brady homegrown talent. BB the GM as a whole isn't as problematic as people make it out to be. It's his main weaknesses (WR evaluation and being too skeptical of hiring outsiders for his coaching staff) that's the problem.

The drafts have gotten better. The free agency picks have been overpays, but not duds, just not the splashes they were expected to be. 

Bill's problem is him and his coaching staff got high on their own supply. It was largely reported that when Brady was there that there was a sentiment in the building that they had a system that Bill could win with any top 10 QB in the league.  The last few Brady years, Bill was known for going against scouting reports, and he was wrong more than he was right. He fixed that. The next problem is that he thought he could have no DC and OC and fill the team with his own guys. Defense is run by his son and former player. Ironically that's not much of a problem right now. Offense is run by two former coaches on different sides of the ball, and that is a problem. And considering Belichick told everyone "blame me if the Patricia hiring goes wrong", he gets the blame. So hopefully he makes the correction he made with drafting and goes out of house to hire good coaches.

[lancerman]

13 hours ago, jofos said:

I am in no way saying that Patricia is any good. I didn't want the Patriots to bring him back in any capacity. But it's hard to judge Patricia based on Mac Jones. Part of the difference with Jones this year when compared to last year is that teams have a season to go on when defending what he can and cannot do. It really only took teams to the bye week last year. After the bye Mac was 106-175 (60 %) 1164 7TDs 7INTs, his issues started before Patricia was calling plays. People talk about how great Jones was at Alabama and it's hard to argue against that but, his last season at Alabama 29% of his passes were thrown behind the line of scrimmage, 41% of his passing yards was from YAC. 

Scouting reports on Jones are very accurate and all of the things he struggled with in college are magnified when his team isn't heads and tails above the opposition. 

Does Mac Jones Fit Patriots' Offense? - Draft Network (thedraftnetwork.com)

I know there are fans that will say it's all on the coaches, but those same fans would drop Jones in a second if they could get the Brady that played against the Bengals Sunday. 

You can judge Patricia on this. Every single player on the Patriots offense besides Stevenson has regressed since last year. 

[CP3MVP]

I said last year if everything breaks right his ceiling is maybe the 6th best QB in the AFC in his prime. I’m not really ok with that if the goal is to wins A title so yeah I would look to moving on 

[sammymvpknight]

1 hour ago, CP3MVP said:

I said last year if everything breaks right his ceiling is maybe the 6th best QB in the AFC in his prime. I’m not really ok with that if the goal is to wins A title so yeah I would look to moving on 

Of course your goal should be to compete with the QBs of the AFC, but how practical is that? Allen, Mahomes, Jackson, Herbert, Burrows, and Lawrence are insane talents. It can take multiple decades to accumulate that amount talent. You should certainly try to compete with that by getting your own elite QB, but it may not be the most practical plan. The other way of doing it is going bizarro…getting a solid QB and surrounding him with good talent. That is probably the more realistic method of competing in the AFC.

Edited December 20, 2022 by sammymvpknight

[StatKing]

All you have to do is give him a competent OC. We all saw what he could do last year with McDaniels calling the plays. The kid is a good QB. There's no doubt in my mind if he was playing for Shanahan he would look like a top 10 QB.

[goldfishwars]

The decisions which led to Patricia becoming a play calling OC are the result of an insane over confidence amongst all of the parties involved.

 

[agarcia34]

I don’t think he’s great but you have to give the kid a legit OC. What Bill did this year was pure negligence and if any other HC did this the media would be calling for him to be fired. QB malpractice. You cannot judge Jones for this year. 

[Apparition]

1 hour ago, StatKing said:

All you have to do is give him a competent OC. We all saw what he could do last year with McDaniels calling the plays. The kid is a good QB. There's no doubt in my mind if he was playing for Shanahan he would look like a top 10 QB.

We can't discount the possibility that going through a year like this so early in his development can ruin a QB.

[Daniel]

1 hour ago, goldfishwars said:

The decisions which led to Patricia becoming a play calling OC are the result of an insane over confidence amongst all of the parties involved.

 

I keep forgetting about Patricia when I argue that Downing is the worst OC in the league.

[CP3MVP]

1 hour ago, sammymvpknight said:

Of course your goal should be to compete with the QBs of the AFC, but how practical is that? Allen, Mahomes, Jackson, Herbert, Burrows, and Lawrence are insane talents. It can take multiple decades to accumulate that amount talent. You should certainly try to compete with that by getting your own elite QB, but it may not be the most practical plan. The other way of doing it is going bizarro…getting a solid QB and surrounding him with good talent. That is probably the more realistic method of competing in the AFC.

You can say that for every year and time in nfl history. The goal is to get a superstar QB. If you don’t have one or you’re guy can never become one I think you’re wasting everyone’s time.

The chiefs had a good QB in Alex smith for years and said we love Alex but we want a stud

[Charles]

No.  Give him an OC and some weapons that take advantage of what he does well, accurate distribution of short to intermediate throws, and he'll be fine.   He'll never be one of the elite qbs, but you can win with him.

[StatKing]

1 hour ago, Apparition said:

We can't discount the possibility that going through a year like this so early in his development can ruin a QB.

I'm not worried about his development in regards to understanding the game. The kid just knows football. I haven't seen a rookie process things as fast as he did last year since Andrew Luck.

What I'm concerned about is BB absolutely wrecking his confidence like he tried to do earlier in the year by benching him for Zappe. That was such a clown move I almost couldn't believe it. Things like that are starting to make me believe BB lost his fastball years ago and that the only reason he's had any success over the last decade is because he had Tom Brady to carry him.

[sammymvpknight]

4 hours ago, CP3MVP said:

You can say that for every year and time in nfl history. The goal is to get a superstar QB. If you don’t have one or you’re guy can never become one I think you’re wasting everyone’s time.

The chiefs had a good QB in Alex smith for years and said we love Alex but we want a stud

Of course that’s the goal. But it is much easier said than done. Much more likely to get another Mac Jones than Patrick Mahomes. 

[nicfre2011]

10 hours ago, lancerman said:

The drafts have gotten better. The free agency picks have been overpays, but not duds, just not the splashes they were expected to be. 

Bill's problem is him and his coaching staff got high on their own supply. It was largely reported that when Brady was there that there was a sentiment in the building that they had a system that Bill could win with any top 10 QB in the league.  The last few Brady years, Bill was known for going against scouting reports, and he was wrong more than he was right. He fixed that. The next problem is that he thought he could have no DC and OC and fill the team with his own guys. Defense is run by his son and former player. Ironically that's not much of a problem right now. Offense is run by two former coaches on different sides of the ball, and that is a problem. And considering Belichick told everyone "blame me if the Patricia hiring goes wrong", he gets the blame. So hopefully he makes the correction he made with drafting and goes out of house to hire good coaches.

I'm not sure what these coaches are thinking when they make these off-the-wall coaching staff decisions....like when Andy Reid moved Juan Castillo from offensive line coach to DC after he fired Sean McDermott. Patricia from experience at DC to OC is probably not as much of a stretch as the Castillo move.

[Soko]

7 hours ago, CP3MVP said:

You can say that for every year and time in nfl history. The goal is to get a superstar QB. If you don’t have one or you’re guy can never become one I think you’re wasting everyone’s time.

The chiefs had a good QB in Alex smith for years and said we love Alex but we want a stud

I mean, that’s more or less what Pittsburgh, NY, San Diego, and Atlanta did for most of the last decade and a half. Those guys weren’t Mahomes level but they were good. You’re happy with that at QB.