2023 Off-season Talk

[rickyt31]

n/a

Edited January 12, 2023 by rickyt31

[jetfuel34]

I was reading that teams would have to trade for Carr? Why would Carr make the team he is going to give up picks for him. I think he will just sit back and force the Raiders to just plan cut him and he can sign with anyone. 

[KingOfNewYork]

2 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

For me the difference between Zach and the guys before him that didn’t work out was that he had weapons. Darnold had garbage compared to what Wilson had this last season. And while we were winning in spite of Wilson’s awful play. He never played good with those weapons. When there was Hall, Wilson, Davis, Moore, Conklin, Uzo and all out there he wasn’t a threat at all with his arm. So for me that’s the difference. I won’t defend the system at all bc I think MLF was garbage in that he had his system and refused to alter it. Never catering to a young QB or anything. Awful game planning. I can keep going on things I don’t like about MLF.

 

But to sit back and say Wilson wasn’t to blame is laughable. While you weren’t active on here…. Trust me I was darn near debating this whole forum alone on how Mike White wasn’t good. And that there are bumps and bruises for young QBs like Wilson.

 

Facts are with Wilson was the he was garbage as a rookie to start. For me that was expected being I didn’t exactly want him bc I knew he wasn’t close to polished from a smaller competition school. That jump from slightly above good TX high school teams to the NFL is gigantic. He got injured and the rest seemed to serve him well. Still wasn’t a threat throwing. But wasn’t turning the ball over like he was. So there was growth there and optimism going into the off-season. All we heard was how he looked good and all in TC and stuff this year. He gets injured and once again the sitting down seemed to serve him well. Once again not winning with his arm. But not turning the ball over and actually winning games. Something thy was big for us but we weren’t winning bc of Zach at all. He plays one of the worst games a QB can possibly play and in turn deflects the blame which the combo of that and his play gets him benched. White goes and lights up a crappy Fieldsless team and the fan base goes nuts (not including me). White gets brought back down to earth playing better teams yet the fan base still is spot on Wilson. While me personally I think Wilson > White. At that point and whatever was going on with Wilson. White did give us the best chance to win. And in a playoff race that’s what matters. White gets injured which gets Wilson back in. And for me player better than White did against DET than White did. Which the staff apparently somewhat agreed with bc he got another start against JAX. And looked to revert back to that QB we saw against NE twice. Where they don’t belong on the field. Especially in a playoff race. For me I would’ve still played Wilson against MIA bc why not. But 1 game isn’t moving what he did over the season for us. The key in all this seems to be when Wilson sits. He comes out looking better than he did before. Which does show growth. But he still is a bottom QB in this league. There’s no reason he shouldn’t be able to throw for 200+ 60%+ and more TDs than INTs each week. We have the talent to do that now. Yet we have half’s where we have 40yds of offense. Of course a lot of that is on the OC. But a huge part of that is the QB as well.

 

Fir those reasons. For me Wilson doesn’t deserve the starting role going into 2023. For me he should be slated as hands down the backup. Fight to close that gap between you and the starter where if he slips. They think you’ve done enough to bench him and play you. But he for me by no means should be the starter for us in 2023. You need QB play to win in this league. But there’s 52 other guys being affected by his awful play.

I definitely dont want to excuse Wilson's play, he wasn't good and played a huge role in his struggles. But it's as I've always said, if a guy is good he'll be good no matter whos around him so the weapons think isn't relevant IMO. especially since Garrett Wilson was the only guy to really thrive this season regardless of who was at QB. I think Moore against the Bears and Conklin vs the Patriots were the only other big games by skill players not named Garrett or Breece. 

For Zach, numbers and accuracy aside I think the immense pressure under him did him in. It started with Moore's frustration then the highlights of his low moments got bigger. That mental block is huge for athletes and their ability to be the best version of themselves.

All we can ask is he put in the work, if he's the guy who's the best for us he should play next season because we shouldn't hold 2022 against him if he's improved enough to warrant the starting spot. 

[rickyt31]

 

[KingOfNewYork]

1 minute ago, jetfuel34 said:

I was reading that teams would have to trade for Carr? Why would Carr make the team he is going to give up picks for him. I think he will just sit back and force the Raiders to just plan cut him and he can sign with anyone. 

I think he has a NTC but Carr isn't gonna care about picks. It's about the money. I think he makes more being traded then expecting a huge offer through free agency. His next 3 years in cash are $33M, $42M and $41M. He aint getting that as a free agent with other options available. 

[KingOfNewYork]

Just now, rickyt31 said:

 

Wow, he really is delusional. 

[Abe56]

3 minutes ago, rickyt31 said:

 

Yeah we def trading for Lamar

[rickyt31]

Woody saying there isn't a mandate helps a lot with the OC search. OC's don't feel like they're walking straight into the hot seat. 

I knew Woody would be willing to spend a lot to upgrade the QB position like I mentioned before. They're going to try to go big if the opportunity is there. They're not looking at guys like Minshew unless we miss on everyone else. 

[rickyt31]

Just now, Abe56 said:

Yeah we def trading for Lamar

Don't get my hopes up. lol

[KingOfNewYork]

There's no public mandate but if they miss the playoffs again it's a wrap. 

Saleh firing the entire offensive staff is huge because while everyone think "We're a QB away" the entire offensive unit had far too many struggles to be pleased with where this team was going. 

All steps in the right direction but there's a lot of work to do.

[Bobby816]

2 minutes ago, KingOfNewYork said:

There's no public mandate but if they miss the playoffs again it's a wrap. 

Saleh firing the entire offensive staff is huge because while everyone think "We're a QB away" the entire offensive unit had far too many struggles to be pleased with where this team was going. 

All steps in the right direction but there's a lot of work to do.

I think the bigger thing is him pretty  much for sure saying we will upgrade at QB. We already know we'll have a new system in 2023, just a matter of who and what. But Who's running that system is even bigger.

 

I'm thinking Carr for some reason.

[Abe56]

6 minutes ago, rickyt31 said:

Don't get my hopes up. lol

Woody is looking for headlines, thats Lamar, not a Jimmy G

[KingOfNewYork]

What trade packages are yall thinking Lamar and/or Carr might go for?

Also factor in competition, say Sean Payton takes a job and wants to trade for Lamar Jackson. 

Being aggressive is one for us but there's no guarantees. 

[Abe56]

2 minutes ago, KingOfNewYork said:

What trade packages are yall thinking Lamar and/or Carr might go for?

Also factor in competition, say Sean Payton takes a job and wants to trade for Lamar Jackson. 

Being aggressive is one for us but there's no guarantees. 

Lamar prob 3 firsts +
 

Carr 2nd or 3rd rounder

[rickyt31]

I do think Woody lied about the mandate for potential OCs. I'm not looking too deep into that. 

As for Carr, The Raiders will wait to see if they can pull a pick for him. I don't think they will get a first because of the contract and benching, but if a team feels like Carr's contract will be the average in a year or two, I can see a 2nd or 3rd+ another pick being offered. Once when Jackson, Burrow, Herbert, and Hurts get their new deals, Carr's cap hit will fall into the 13-15th range. 

In 2024, we're looking at $100M+ in cap space right now. So there will be plenty of flexibility if we did pick up his contract. So if other teams are in the same situation, that's how I can see a trade for him happening.