champ11 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 45 minutes ago, broncos67 said: I'm not denying he might be #1 on our board, but I'm saying it's most likely a result of his physical stature and tools, not his game performance. The combine is one area that tells you nothing about accuracy. If you're not accurate throwing to guys in shorts in scripted drills with no defenders, that's a huge issue in and of itself. I'm not denying Allen's obvious physical skills, but there's more to a QB than that. Rosen is quite literally the ideal prospect for us at this stage. He could start now, he has experience, he throws the ball well and with anticipation to all fields. His concerns are his frame, and that he had a concussion. I'm not sure we have the coaching staff to help improve facets of Allen's game. Why would we? We didn't develop Brock and Paxton- two guys with unique physical skillsets and big arms who weren't pro ready. Why would we be able to develop anyone this time? Keenum is trash. Aside from this one outlier season, his career TD:INT ratio is 1:1. That's horrific. He's not a particularly talented QB, but he landed in the right situation in MIN. If he comes to Denver, he's going to struggle mightily because, let's face it, he's not, and hasn't been, very good throughout his career. I think Keenum could have turned a corner. I'm not high on him and think he'd be a major risk. But it's not unlikely that he becomes a solid starting QB from here out. I heard the comparison to Alex Smith turning a corner and didn't think it was the worst in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 hour ago, bMiller031 said: Why is that safe to say? From my assessment, him being a physical marvel is the ONLY pro on the pros and cons list-- that's why he's such a gamble. Otherwise, given how dominant he is physically, why isn't he the unanimous sure-fire #1 QB in this draft? That's not true. Allen gets sky-high marks for his work ethic, his leadership, his football IQ and his off-field behavior. He doesn't have the character or personality red flags that both Mayfield and Rosen have. The only con on the con list that Allen has is his accuracy, which, unfortunately for him, is a pretty bad con to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Hows Allen compare to Blake Bortles and Jamarcus Russell. 2 former top 4 picks. I believe he compares very favorably. He will no doubt go top 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos67 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 11 minutes ago, champ11 said: I think Keenum could have turned a corner. I'm not high on him and think he'd be a major risk. But it's not unlikely that he becomes a solid starting QB from here out. I heard the comparison to Alex Smith turning a corner and didn't think it was the worst in the world. Sure, it's certainly possible, but Smith only had one year with a worse QBR than Keenum. Smith isn't a world beater, but his expectations were also inextricably linked to his draft status. He never turned into what it was hoped he'd be, but he's still been an above average QB in the NFL for a long time. It can also be argued that Smith showed measureable progression year over year (for the most part) where Keenum has had mostly middling to below average results and one good season. If he would have another quality season in or out of Minnesota, I might be inclined to agree. But for now, to me it appears his performance was an aberration, not the beginning of upward trends in his play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
champ11 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, broncos67 said: Sure, it's certainly possible, but Smith only had one year with a worse QBR than Keenum. Smith isn't a world beater, but his expectations were also inextricably linked to his draft status. He never turned into what it was hoped he'd be, but he's still been an above average QB in the NFL for a long time. It can also be argued that Smith showed measureable progression year over year (for the most part) where Keenum has had mostly middling to below average results and one good season. If he would have another quality season in or out of Minnesota, I might be inclined to agree. But for now, to me it appears his performance was an aberration, not the beginning of upward trends in his play. Yeah, we'll see. Keenum's advanced numbers from last year are pretty good too. That team had the top third down offense of any team in the league I believe. Not that I want Keenum in Denver, but just making the point that it could not be an aberration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncofan48 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 minute ago, champ11 said: Yeah, we'll see. Keenum's advanced numbers from last year are pretty good too. That team had the top third down offense of any team in the league I believe. Not that I want Keenum in Denver, but just making the point that it could not be an aberration. My issue with Keenum, and frankly most of the rookie QBs, is that we don't have the staff to help them out and maximize their abilities Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 29 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said: The only con on the con list that Allen has is his accuracy, which, unfortunately for him, is a pretty bad con to have. LMAO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 For what it's worth, Mike Klis thinks Josh Allen is the best QB prospects in years. Quote I think Allen is the best quarterback prospect in years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos67 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 minute ago, AnAngryAmerican said: For what it's worth, Mike Klis thinks Josh Allen is the best QB prospects in years. That's not even remotely true. He's not even the consensus best prospect in this class, so how the hell could the above be true? Obviously we'll be drafting him, Kalen Ballage, and someone else from Colorado because it just makes geographic sense, but my god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolly red giant Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 53 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: Hows Allen compare to Blake Bortles and Jamarcus Russell. 2 former top 4 picks. I believe he compares very favorably. He will no doubt go top 6. Those are not really the stature of QBs that you aspire to. - being favourable to both is not a lot to write home about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolly red giant Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 13 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said: For what it's worth, Mike Klis thinks Josh Allen is the best QB prospects in years. Another LMAO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bMiller031 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 hour ago, AnAngryAmerican said: That's not true. Allen gets sky-high marks for his work ethic, his leadership, his football IQ and his off-field behavior. He doesn't have the character or personality red flags that both Mayfield and Rosen have. The only con on the con list that Allen has is his accuracy, which, unfortunately for him, is a pretty bad con to have. Sure - I'm not criticizing him in the abstract. I'm speaking comparatively. I haven't seen or read anything concrete that differentiates Allen from Mayfield, Darnold, or Rosen in terms of football IQ. Mayfield and Darnold have been lauded for their leadership, I'm not sure Allen has the clear comparative advantage in the "leadership" department when grouped with the other three guys. I can't speak to their off-screen work ethic or off-field (and off-camera) character - but when you sit down and list the strengths and weaknesses of each prospect compared to the other prospects in that tier, the only thing I see with Allen that distinguishes him from the other guys is his superior physical strengths. However, his accuracy (or lack therefor) is a massive weakness that distinguishes him from the other three. In the past, guys with this profile are bad news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 10 minutes ago, bMiller031 said: Sure - I'm not criticizing him in the abstract. I'm speaking comparatively. I haven't seen or read anything concrete that differentiates Allen from Mayfield, Darnold, or Rosen in terms of football IQ. Mayfield and Darnold have been lauded for their leadership, I'm not sure Allen has the clear comparative advantage in the "leadership" department when grouped with the other three guys. I can't speak to their off-screen work ethic or off-field (and off-camera) character - but when you sit down and list the strengths and weaknesses of each prospect compared to the other prospects in that tier, the only thing I see with Allen that distinguishes him from the other guys is his superior physical strengths. However, his accuracy (or lack therefor) is a massive weakness that distinguishes him from the other three. In the past, guys with this profile are bad news. I don't disagree with any of this. Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 We can also put Woody Paige on the list of Colorado media personalities who prefer Allen to the other rookies. Quote Allen remains my choice, but he continues to rise above the Broncos’ position in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bMiller031 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Given the smoke of Miami being enamored by Mayfield.... If Miami called and offered Ryan Tannehill and 1.11 for 1.5 - would that be something we should consider? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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