2019 Draft - Edge Rushers

[BleedTheClock]

12 hours ago, Bullyball said:

What's everyone opinion on Jaylon Ferguson?

Violent hands, excellent at setting the edge. Struggles to bend, but got effective pressure bull rushing OT's back into the QB's grill. I think he plays base LDE in a 4-3. Good starter for many years, but I wouldn't consider him an elite prospect. His ceiling is kind of limited.

Oh, and no, he can't and shouldn't bump inside to a DT on passing downs. I don't think he has that kind of ability.

[Tugboat]

On 18/02/2019 at 8:52 AM, BleedTheClock said:

Violent hands, excellent at setting the edge. Struggles to bend, but got effective pressure bull rushing OT's back into the QB's grill. I think he plays base LDE in a 4-3. Good starter for many years, but I wouldn't consider him an elite prospect. His ceiling is kind of limited.

Oh, and no, he can't and shouldn't bump inside to a DT on passing downs. I don't think he has that kind of ability.

Yeah.  I think Ferguson kinda profiles as one of those guys who ends up being more "valuable" than the sack stats may ever show.  He'll get his sacks, but probably going to pile up a lot more of those uncredited "assists" by crashing around creating disruption on that end that helps corral guys in the backfield for the bendier edge guys and interior penetrators to get home.  More "gamewrecker" than "gamebreaker" if that makes any sense.

I really like him though.  In an age where we've got a lot of these bendy speedy guys who aren't great at holding up at the point, you want a guy like Ferguson opposite them.

[jrry32]

On 2/18/2019 at 8:52 AM, BleedTheClock said:

Violent hands, excellent at setting the edge. Struggles to bend, but got effective pressure bull rushing OT's back into the QB's grill. I think he plays base LDE in a 4-3. Good starter for many years, but I wouldn't consider him an elite prospect. His ceiling is kind of limited.

Oh, and no, he can't and shouldn't bump inside to a DT on passing downs. I don't think he has that kind of ability.

This is a total digression, but it blows me away that Forrest Lamp hasn't done anything thus far in his career. He completely erased Ferguson in his final year at WKU. Hopefully, he'll get over the injuries.

[Scoundrel]

1 hour ago, Tugboat said:

Yeah.  I think Ferguson kinda profiles as one of those guys who ends up being more "valuable" than the sack stats may ever show.  He'll get his sacks, but probably going to pile up a lot more of those uncredited "assists" by crashing around creating disruption on that end that helps corral guys in the backfield for the bendier edge guys and interior penetrators to get home.  More "gamewrecker" than "gamebreaker" if that makes any sense.

I really like him though.  In an age where we've got a lot of these bendy speedy guys who aren't great at holding up at the point, you want a guy like Ferguson opposite them.

So like Trey Flowers?

[Tugboat]

55 minutes ago, Counselor said:

So like Trey Flowers?

Probably a fair comp for the sort of player i think you're looking at with Ferguson, yeah.  I think Ferguson is maybe a little more violent in the way he attacks blockers, a little less disciplined, but same sort of deal probably.  Same sort of impact.

[Ozzy]

2 hours ago, Tugboat said:

Yeah.  I think Ferguson kinda profiles as one of those guys who ends up being more "valuable" than the sack stats may ever show.  He'll get his sacks, but probably going to pile up a lot more of those uncredited "assists" by crashing around creating disruption on that end that helps corral guys in the backfield for the bendier edge guys and interior penetrators to get home.  More "gamewrecker" than "gamebreaker" if that makes any sense.

I really like him though.  In an age where we've got a lot of these bendy speedy guys who aren't great at holding up at the point, you want a guy like Ferguson opposite them.

I agree, he does not get enough credit.  People call him a bad athlete for whatever reason, that is bull the kid can play and like you said holding the point of attack and not getting pushed around is important.  He plays with great passion and this past year he easily played the best of his career.  A career where he has been productive since his freshman year, like extremely productive without a ton of top end defensive talent around him.  He is a big tall kid and has ideal size for a 4/3 DE and depending on the system could play in a 3/4 OLB position I feel if need be but most likely not.  

 

Really he is similar to Marcus Davenport from UTEP, both played at smaller schools and were productive over four years, but Ferguson was far more productive arguably.  Davenport developed into a stronger player over time but started out as a very thin and long DE.  Doubt Ferguson times out as well as Davenport at the combine, and Ferguson is a little more thick in his base where Davenport early was pretty skinny but is a longer player wing span wise and length wise. But still has similar build and arguably Ferguson better pass rush moves as well.  Few even batted an eye at Davenport being the 14th pick overall yet some say Ferguson is not even worth a 1st round pick which I feel he is especially late 1st round even in a DE heavy draft.  

 

 

[BleedTheClock]

2 hours ago, jrry32 said:

This is a total digression, but it blows me away that Forrest Lamp hasn't done anything thus far in his career. He completely erased Ferguson in his final year at WKU. Hopefully, he'll get over the injuries.

Forrest Lamp was such a good guard prospect. He blanketed some of the best players in CFB with ease and had the prototypical size, strength, and athleticism. Not sure why he isn't dominating. I think he's good, but he's certainly not a standout.

[BleedTheClock]

30 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

Really he is similar to Marcus Davenport from UTEP, both played at smaller schools and were productive over four years, but Ferguson was far more productive arguably. 

Davenport has way more upside. Davenport can bend and fly past guys. While both utilize power as their base, Ferguson is stiff. Davenport is bendy and has elite quickness off the snap.

[pnies20]

1 minute ago, BleedTheClock said:

Davenport has way more upside. Davenport can bend and fly past guys. While both utilize power as their base, Ferguson is stiff. Davenport is bendy and has elite quickness off the snap.

Agreed. He’s more Montez Sweat than Davenport.

[Ozzy]

8 hours ago, BleedTheClock said:

Davenport has way more upside. Davenport can bend and fly past guys. While both utilize power as their base, Ferguson is stiff. Davenport is bendy and has elite quickness off the snap.

Davenport was only considered a great athlete after the combine when he performed so well then people really got on board with him.  Most rarely said a word about him during the season, and he did transform himself from being a 6-6 220 skinny DE early in his career to using a little more power later in his career.  People were not saying he had great speed before that combine performance.  And Ferguson uses his hands better, could argue Ferguson will have as many sacks or more than Davenport did his rookie year I feel.  Sure Davenport is a little longer and a little quicker but not by that much, again one can assume on athletic numbers Davenport has more upside but let us see how Ferguson performs at the combine.  Even though Davenport might be faster Ferguson to me is more of a natural pass rusher with more natural pass rush skills.

[BleedTheClock]

3 hours ago, Ozzy said:

People were not saying he had great speed before that combine performance.

I said he did. I don't remember people questioning his great speed. He was incredibly explosive off the ball and violent at the point of attack. He literally attacked the chest of OT's with brute force. I loved Davenport as a prospect and had him as the 6th best prospect in a loaded draft class. I'm surprised he hasn't blown up the league, but he's definitely still developing.

[Shanedorf]

26 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

I'm surprised he hasn't blown up the league, but he's definitely still developing.

"When Marcus Davenport first returned from a toe injury that cost him three games earlier this season, he may have been physically ready to play, but his New Orleans Saints teammate Alex Okafor said it was clear Davenport was not fully comfortable.

“It was kind of like he was running on a wet floor,” Okafor said. It was a challenge when the Saints’ 2018 first-round pick first came back from that toe injury. He did all the work he was supposed to do in the training room So, yeah, at first it looked like he was running on a wet floor. But now it is all starting to look a little more natural. “Now, he’s got more traction, he’s learned how to play with that. You’ve seen his production and he’s continued to grow,” Okafor said.  He changed up his stance and the way he maneuvered around the field. "

[Ozzy]

1 hour ago, BleedTheClock said:

I said he did. I don't remember people questioning his great speed. He was incredibly explosive off the ball and violent at the point of attack. He literally attacked the chest of OT's with brute force. I loved Davenport as a prospect and had him as the 6th best prospect in a loaded draft class. I'm surprised he hasn't blown up the league, but he's definitely still developing.

People had no clue who he was outside of his senior year, or most did not I feel.  I was on him as sophomore and few if anyone talked about him much less his speed.  Sure is easy to call him fast and athletic after he runs a 4.58 40 at 6-6 264 in the combine.  Sure he might have more upside but again that is based on his athletic ability he showed at the combine so let us see what Ferguson does in private pro day workouts.  That entire combine situation is odd especially since it seems like just a minor thing.

I still say Ferguson has better pass rush moves, uses his hands better and is more natural at getting to the QB.  Davenport was a little stiff in his rush at times but obviously wowed many with those great combine numbers at that size which was very impressive.  The only other guys at 6-5+ 240+ to run a 4.58 or better 40 outside of Davenport since 2006 was Manny Lawson, Jadeveon Clowney and Danielle Hunter.  

[BleedTheClock]

36 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

People had no clue who he was outside of his senior year, or most did not I feel.  I was on him as sophomore and few if anyone talked about him much less his speed.  Sure is easy to call him fast and athletic after he runs a 4.58 40 at 6-6 264 in the combine. 

I mean, I can go find evidence of me saying he's a 4.5-4.6 speed guy. BEFORE the combine. I'll do it when I get home. I definitely saw that speed on the field.

[DreamKid]

10 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Davenport was only considered a great athlete after the combine when he performed so well then people really got on board with him.

Nah. People were on him way earlier.

I posted this video in the Ravens' forum on 1/4/18, and I considered myself late to the party. I looked him up after seeing so many in the draft community brag about his physical traits. From what I saw, everyone was hyped on him as an athlete. The big question was over his level of competition.