NYRaider Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 24 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: Hmmmmmm sounds like excuses 🤣 even though I agree they are logical points. 🤣 It's a win or lose league for sure. I think a lot of red flags with Wilson were ignored though, particularly his decline in rushing production and how poorly he looked post injury. Not to mention that they hired a head coach and let him call the plays when he wasn't even the playcaller as an OC for the Packers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonGruber Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 Russ looks lost I definitely thought he be a problem for the Raiders. Granted he did look his best against our mighty defense lol. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 6 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Outside of Wilson what other QB could they have realistically acquired? Geno Smith. Lol No, in reality: Jimmy G? Rodgers? Mayfield? Mariota? There's a whole host of QBs they "could have acquired" for less than they gave up for Wilson. Absent MVP level numbers and a guaranteed ring, the price tag was already laughably high. Add in that it was practically an unkept secret he wanted a massive contract extension, it's even worse considering they gave it to him. At some point, a franchise has to realize that a trade and the backend requirements of getting a particular guy simply isn't worth the investment. The trade was a bad trade in general- I'd never give up THAT much for a guy- but the extension afterwards is what makes it atrocious. Maybe, maybe, all things considered Wilson had the highest upside in terms of history, age, and tools out of any QB they could've acquired. Is it still worth what they've wound up giving up? No. They boxed themselves in. They can't tank for a QB. They have virtually zero resources in terms of grabbing a guy. That's never a smart trade off. Where I fault and criticize is that they so objectively threw caution to the wind and had absolutely no contingency plan. That's next level vanity being displayed for a player that had already begun to alienate the team, coaches, and fanbase that made him famous to begin with, and a guy whose game was never going to age particularly well in a best case scenario. Anyone without rose tinted goggles for a best case Russ type QB saw it coming from a mile away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 I still expect Russ will get it together a bit, but he is looking worse than ever expected. Give him some time though, lot of moving pieces and a new O. Same with Carr, new O, rotating Oline, 2 new WRs (adams obviously prior chemistry, but Hollins stepping in for hunter) In a timing league, things take time to figure out. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 6 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: Geno Smith. Lol No, in reality: Jimmy G? Rodgers? Mayfield? Mariota? There's a whole host of QBs they "could have acquired" for less than they gave up for Wilson. Absent MVP level numbers and a guaranteed ring, the price tag was already laughably high. Add in that it was practically an unkept secret he wanted a massive contract extension, it's even worse considering they gave it to him. At some point, a franchise has to realize that a trade and the backend requirements of getting a particular guy simply isn't worth the investment. The trade was a bad trade in general- I'd never give up THAT much for a guy- but the extension afterwards is what makes it atrocious. Maybe, maybe, all things considered Wilson had the highest upside in terms of history, age, and tools out of any QB they could've acquired. Is it still worth what they've wound up giving up? No. They boxed themselves in. They can't tank for a QB. They have virtually zero resources in terms of grabbing a guy. That's never a smart trade off. Where I fault and criticize is that they so objectively threw caution to the wind and had absolutely no contingency plan. That's next level vanity being displayed for a player that had already begun to alienate the team, coaches, and fanbase that made him famous to begin with, and a guy whose game was never going to age particularly well in a best case scenario. Anyone without rose tinted goggles for a best case Russ type QB saw it coming from a mile away. I honestly think that they hired Hackett because they were convinced that Aaron Rodgers would ultimately land there. I don't think the trade was a bad idea but extending him off of a down year before he has ever even played a snap for you was insane. I mean even Stafford had to wait until after the Rams won the Super Bowl to get his extension. All of that guaranteed money they gave to him put the entire franchise on his back. I didn't think he was going to just dominate but I'm surprised that he has played so poorly this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilshark69 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 43 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: 1. I'd say they were a QB away from being one. Fangio and a real QB probably has this team rolling. Now, though, they're a HC, a QB, and about 3 solid years of assets away from it. 2. For the same reason we had fools like BayRaider wanting to ship out whatever necessary for Wilson. They ignored history and context at all costs, bought the hype of a fantasy football fan favorite QB, assumed whatever context can't be avoided would be shot down because they have no earthly idea how to actually scout QBs with any understanding beyond a stat sheet and an over-reliance on this weird idea they like to call "tools" while refusing to recognize that real life is not a videogame and playing QB has a lot more involved than just running fast and throwing perfect dimes on cue. Age, injury history, whether they were carried by a Defense or run game, those things.... actually matter. Whodathunkit? Well, there's those of us who did and wouldn't have gotten fleeced. Then there's those who don't, and would give up the house for a shiny QB toy without any contextual regard, and then would've signed him to a big extension before going radio silent on the matter when the pie starts to fly. Now, just waiting for Trey Lance and Malik Willis to prove they are elite level QBs to be feared for the next decade..... And the guy who is pro bowl level was hated on because he was a “beta” type personality? Lmfao!!!!! He was soft, but played with bad ribs, just like being called a coward when said player played 2 wks after fracturing bones in his flippin back! Oh yeah, I remember that “hot garbage!” And no, I don’t think carr is Superman.....at all. All any of us has said is “give me a realistic/viable replacement plan. Smh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, Devilshark69 said: And the guy who is pro bowl level was hated on because he was a “beta” type personality? Lmfao!!!!! He was soft, but played with bad ribs, just like being called a coward when said player played 2 wks after fracturing bones in his flippin back! Oh yeah, I remember that “hot garbage!” And no, I don’t think carr is Superman.....at all. All any of us has said is “give me a realistic/viable replacement plan. Smh I mean Russ did produce 9 consecutive winning seasons, 2 super bowl appearances, and a super bowl victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 34 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Outside of Wilson what other QB could they have realistically acquired? Carr? For those picks I bet JMD Ziegler are tempted. Carr is a get into FG range machine, as we know, and with that Den D, it appears 4 FG trips a game is all you need lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 1 minute ago, BackinBlack said: Carr? For those picks I bet JMD Ziegler are tempted. Carr is a get into FG range machine, as we know, and with that Den D, it appears 4 FG trips a game is all you need lol Zero chance that we would've traded him in the division or that the Broncos would've given up the same package for Carr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilshark69 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: I mean Russ did produce 9 consecutive winning seasons, 2 super bowl appearances, and a super bowl victory. Hello? I think RW is a good qb, that post was about lance and Willis being touted as a potential “star qb” while Herbert got trashed because of some bullsh*t “alpha/beta” reasoning by some posters.....my post had zero to do with Wilson! SMH 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 13 minutes ago, NYRaider said: I honestly think that they hired Hackett because they were convinced that Aaron Rodgers would ultimately land there. I don't think the trade was a bad idea but extending him off of a down year before he has ever even played a snap for you was insane. I mean even Stafford had to wait until after the Rams won the Super Bowl to get his extension. All of that guaranteed money they gave to him put the entire franchise on his back. I didn't think he was going to just dominate but I'm surprised that he has played so poorly this year. Agreed. Agreed. And yep. That's the deal you make someone who has actually done something for you. That's not the deal you give someone to "lock them up" ahead of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 9 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Zero chance that we would've traded him in the division or that the Broncos would've given up the same package for Carr. haha yeah, I mean the only way we wouldve is if they offered the same package. Then I think they are tempted. I agree they probably wouldnt have offered that for Carr . . . but that doesnt mean, they wouldnt be better off right now with Carr over Russ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 6 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: Agreed. Agreed. And yep. That's the deal you make someone who has actually done something for you. That's not the deal you give someone to "lock them up" ahead of time. Russ still had 2 years left on his deal too so there wasn't really any reason they had to do it before the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 14 minutes ago, Devilshark69 said: Hello? I think RW is a good qb, that post was about lance and Willis being touted as a potential “star qb” while Herbert got trashed because of some bullsh*t “alpha/beta” reasoning by some posters.....my post had zero to do with Wilson! SMH I thought you were comparing Carr/Wilson based on the broken back comment, lmao. My bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilshark69 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 No sir, Wilson does not look the same. However, his career speaks for itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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