Jeezla Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, MKnight82 said: I'm not trying to be difficult, the reality is the biggest knock on Wentz is his availability, and tendency to get injured near the end of the season (when the games matter the most). Until he proves otherwise that's going to be the narrative on him. I don't think health is the biggest knock on Wentz. That means if Wentz stays healthy, he's Pat Maholmes tier, and that isn't the case. Health is a knock, but it's not a bigger knock than Wentz focusing on Ertz too much or playing it too safe. Wentz has 4 knocks, imo, all equally weighted. Staying healthy, Loss of athleticism/footwork in the pocket from 2017 and 2018 injuries, Not throwing outside or deep enough if he misses a couple early, and not trusting anyone besides Ertz or Goedert with 50/50 balls. These issues were not helped by our WR group's general inablity to get any seperation, and some pretty crap offensive play calling by Doug and co. Doug is a good, maybe even a great leader, but I think he's a crap coordinator. WR's that can't beat press coverage getting asked to do double moves every freaking route. HB draws on 3rd and inches or 3rd and 20, multiple times a game. Long developing pass plays in "and-goal" situations. We pass the ball even more when a starting OL or WR goes down. The only time Doug starts looking competant as a coordinator is when we are down 7+ points against the Giants or Redskins and it's halfway through the 3rd quarter. Then he starts calling stuff that makes sense and works to the strengths of our players or Wentz just says F this and starts audibling everything. Edited August 11, 2020 by Jeezla 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 44 minutes ago, Jeezla said: Not throwing outside or deep enough if he misses a couple early, and not trusting anyone besides Ertz or Goedert with 50/50 balls. To be fair, there was really no one on the team that gave him any such chance last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 2 hours ago, MKnight82 said: Mahomes, Wilson, Watson, Lamar, and I'd still take Brady, Rodgers and Brees over him (for this season). Then take your pick of the Wentz, Goff, Rivers, Ryan, Stafford group. 8-13 sounds right. 2 hours ago, Danger said: I'm not a believer in LaMar long term to be anything close to what he was last year. I expect the NFL with a full off season of footage to figure him out. He'll be down to earth. I'd probably take Rodgers and perhaps Brees over Wentz for this year. Brady is shot but his numbers might look ok because he has an all-time caliber set of weapons to throw to. :bites tongue: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 1 minute ago, Danger said: To be fair, there was really no one on the team that gave him any such chance last year. Like with Nelly. A 50/50 ball would be a play where there's no one within 10 yards of him... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 1 hour ago, Jeezla said: I don't think health is the biggest knock on Wentz. That means if Wentz stays healthy, he's Pat Maholmes tier, and that isn't the case. Health is a knock, but it's not a bigger knock than Wentz focusing on Ertz too much or playing it too safe. Wentz has 4 knocks, imo, all equally weighted. Staying healthy, Loss of athleticism/footwork in the pocket from 2017 and 2018 injuries, Not throwing outside or deep enough if he misses a couple early, and not trusting anyone besides Ertz or Goedert with 50/50 balls. These issues were not helped by our WR group's general inablity to get any seperation, and some pretty crap offensive play calling by Doug and co. Doug is a good, maybe even a great leader, but I think he's a crap coordinator. WR's that can't beat press coverage getting asked to do double moves every freaking route. HB draws on 3rd and inches or 3rd and 20, multiple times a game. Long developing pass plays in "and-goal" situations. We pass the ball even more when a starting OL or WR goes down. The only time Doug starts looking competant as a coordinator is when we are down 7+ points against the Giants or Redskins and it's halfway through the 3rd quarter. Then he starts calling stuff that makes sense and works to the strengths of our players or Wentz just says F this and starts audibling everything. From the games I watched over the past few years, my perception of Wentz was that he was a gunslinger. But after looking at some analytics from last year, he really is rather conservative. He was below league average in terms of pushing the ball down field. He also targeted his tight ends more than anyone in the league not named Lamar Jackson. I understand that the WR situation was pretty bad last year in Philly. I should look at these trends over a longer period of time, but here they are from 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 16 minutes ago, Gmen said: From the games I watched over the past few years, my perception of Wentz was that he was a gunslinger. But after looking at some analytics from last year, he really is rather conservative. He was below league average in terms of pushing the ball down field. He also targeted his tight ends more than anyone in the league not named Lamar Jackson. I understand that the WR situation was pretty bad last year in Philly. I should look at these trends over a longer period of time, but here they are from 2019 If you ask me, Wentz is more aggressive if he believes that his target his capable. If he doesn't trust their ability he then opts to be more conservative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daimonas Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 The only real issue i need to see Wentz solve is his fumbling issue. It was really bad last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 2 hours ago, Gmen said: From the games I watched over the past few years, my perception of Wentz was that he was a gunslinger. But after looking at some analytics from last year, he really is rather conservative. He was below league average in terms of pushing the ball down field. He also targeted his tight ends more than anyone in the league not named Lamar Jackson. I understand that the WR situation was pretty bad last year in Philly. I should look at these trends over a longer period of time, but here they are from 2019 Im telling you man, his MO is: 1. Short passes 2. Inaccurate passes 3. Unreal Highlight passes There is no consistency. Its one of those 3 almost every single play. You dont see him out there completing 10 yard passes like 5 times in a drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 The Cowboys are going into a bubble. Not something that really makes practical sense for any other team in the NFL. But then again, the Cowboys are the only team with this as their bubble: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 On 8/9/2020 at 2:49 PM, Danger said: You couldn't pay me to live on the West Coast these days. ???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 2 hours ago, Matts4313 said: Im telling you man, his MO is: 1. Short passes 2. Inaccurate passes 3. Unreal Highlight passes There is no consistency. Its one of those 3 almost every single play. You dont see him out there completing 10 yard passes like 5 times in a drive. Honestly Matts... just be quiet. You are making yourself look bad. Carson is always looking for the deeper pass. Do you even watch the Eagles play? Dude just had no one to hit on deep stuff. The wide receivers were barely getting separation on the short to intermediate. Yet he was still 11th for the rate of deep passes and higher than Prescott last year who had Gallup, Cobb, and Cooper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 The Prescott/Wentz debate is hilarious, because people act like one is significantly better than the other when there is no argument for that on either side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said: Honestly Matts... just be quiet. You are making yourself look bad. Carson is always looking for the deeper pass. Uhh.... No he doesnt. He has led the NFL twice in a 4 year career for passes less than 5 yards. But his deep balls fall into that 1/3 highlight reel section. Quote Do you even watch the Eagles play? Unforuntiantly Quote Dude just had no one to hit on deep stuff. The wide receivers were barely getting separation on the short to intermediate. There are literally 4 year sample sizes that disagree with you. Quote Yet he was still 11th for the rate of deep passes and higher than Prescott last year who had Gallup, Cobb, and Cooper. Dak was a significantly better deep ball passer last year. That said, Daks bread and butter is intermediate throws. Also: Dak's average air yards was 9.3 yards (6th highest). Wentz's was 7.9 yards (22nd highest). Dak attempted 53 passes over 21 yards on 596 attempts completing 55%. Wentz attempted 52 passes over 21 yards on 607 attempts completing 52%. Dak was PFF's #4 best deep ball passer in the NFL. Wentz was PFF's #10 deep ball passer. Who is making themselves look bad? Edited August 12, 2020 by Matts4313 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 Just now, Matts4313 said: Uhh.... No he doesnt. He has led the NFL twice in a 4 year career for passes less than 5 yards. Obviously you don't. Just now, Matts4313 said: Unforuntiantly Unfortunately you can't spell. 1 minute ago, Matts4313 said: Dak's average air yards was 9.3 yards (6th highest). Wentz's was 7.9 yards (22nd highest). Because he had no one to throw to down the field...... are you dense? 1 minute ago, Matts4313 said: Who is making themselves look bad? You are.... Measure Prescott Wentz Rate of Deep Passes (PFF) 10.8% 12.7% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted August 12, 2020 Share Posted August 12, 2020 1 minute ago, TheRealMcCoy said: Obviously you don't Unfortunately you can't spell. Wow. Got me on a typo. 1 minute ago, TheRealMcCoy said: Because he had no one to throw to down the field...... are you dense? In 4 years? 1 minute ago, TheRealMcCoy said: You are.... Measure Prescott Wentz Rate of Deep Passes (PFF) 10.8% 12.7% I just gave you multiple stats..... What is "rate of deep passes" anyways? What are all the criteria? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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