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Lions Select LB Jahlani Tavai #43 Overall

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19 minutes ago, Nazgul said:

You're all debbie downers.
Let's give these players a chance before we run them out of Detroit like we do every single year.

When nazgul is the voice of reason, we have huge issues. 

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And say what you want about it but I have heard a few times now that NE would have targeted him with their 2nd round pick. 

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They had no video on this Linebacker when he was drafted he was predicted to go round 4 or 5 bye both Mel and his side kick in mock drafts.  I also heard that his 40 time is terrible 4.7 or 4.8 for a linebacker isn't good & the other knock  he has trouble making tackles seriously that should be what a slow backer does best!

YIKES i hate this pick even more today after hearing them talk about him on the radio this morning.

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9 minutes ago, theuntouchable said:

And say what you want about it but I have heard a few times now that NE would have targeted him with their 2nd round pick. 

That doesn’t mean it’s a good move...

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13 minutes ago, Millenhater said:

I get it.  And I was WAY wrong about Hand last year but at least there was a spot for him.  I just think we are wasting premium picks on inferior talent and that’s one thing, but doing so on player/positions that are slated to be back ups is another.  I could understand if they were premier talent that slipped but I feel they did the opposite; they reached.  I really hope I’m wrong but I feel I’ve seen this movie before and it doesn’t end well for us...

I have no arguments with any of this.

I have done a bit more research and this kid shares a good deal of similarities with Dont'e Hightower. Of course Hightower was a much more notable prospect. Time will tell.

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5 minutes ago, Millenhater said:

That doesn’t mean it’s a good move...

Sure, but just because we haven’t heard of him doesn’t mean it’s a bad move. 

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Not to keep piling on this pick but has there EVER been a successful/impactful player selected from Hawaii?

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8 minutes ago, Millenhater said:

Not to keep piling on this pick but has there EVER been a successful/impactful player selected from Hawaii?

I don’t know but Old Dominion just had its first two players ever drafted.

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3 hours ago, theuntouchable said:

Sure, but just because we haven’t heard of him doesn’t mean it’s a bad move. 

I’ve heard of him.  I just don’t think he’s a good player and I don’t think he was close to BPA.  Dane Brugler has been big on him for awhile. I just have a hard time with limited athletic player that don’t dominate against lesser talent.  I’ve been wrong before I just think it’s a waste when we have Davis and we play nickel as much as we do.

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I love how you guys immediately hated the pick because you didn't know who the player was. If you guys had ever stayed up to watch a Hawaii game or bothered to watch any of his cut-ups on youtube you would know he's a very good player. 

The Patriots were planning on taking him and he is a good player. Anyone thinking he's a reach needs to consider that. He will be a contributor and they wouldn't have been able to get him if they trade down or tried to get him with a later pick. 

Anyone saying he isn't a good athlete clearly is just going off of his workout numbers that came after he just finished recovering from surgery and didn't have any time to really prepare for the workout. Turn on a cut-up of him and you can see for yourself that he's a good athlete. Has a lot of strength which will allow them to use him at the LOS in their 5-1 fronts. He gets great depth on his drops, might be the best LB in the class in this regard. Speed is solid, nothing special, but if it were he probably wouldn't have been there at 43. Linebackers have to be good athletes moving side to side. Tavai is just that. Plus, because he's 250 pounds and has the strength to stack up with offensive lineman, he does have some potential to be used as an outside rusher on top of being used on blitzes.

 

And yes, he is a leader, he is a high character guy, he is a tough SOB. I know some people think the Lions are too focused on that, but you need players like that in then NFL. Not being mentally prepared for NFL life is what causes the majority of draft busts. It's a good thing the Lions are targeting that. 

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15 hours ago, Millenhater said:

I’ve heard of him.  I just don’t think he’s a good player and I don’t think he was close to BPA.  Dane Brugler has been big on him for awhile. I just have a hard time with limited athletic player that don’t dominate against lesser talent.  I’ve been wrong before I just think it’s a waste when we have Davis and we play nickel as much as we do.

He isn't limited athletically. He's actually a very good fit as an athlete for the position they will use him in. He isn't a dime LB that will be asked to step out and cover guys one-on-one half the time. He will play the spot Christian Jones played, which mostly is responsible for controlling backside gaps to prevent cut-backs, pursuing plays from behind, blitzing/rushing, and setting the edge from their 5-1 look.

And, he did kind of dominate his level of competition. He was the best player on that defense by far, he was often making impactful plays, and he was a very productive player over multiple years. 

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I initially didn't like the move because of all of the reasons that have been suggested, principally because I didn't know much about him. I feel a lot better about the pick after having listened to Quinn's reasoning. Thick bodied, big LB with length that played multiple positions. They know what they want/need and as he pointed out, there aren't that many guys who fit the profile each year. They were expecting other teams to be sniffing around him (someone mentioned NE above, which isn't a shocker) and they took their guy.

This feels a lot like the Golladay pick, albeit a different position and a round earlier. Most of us were upset with the pick because we saw the CB's available and thought we'd miss out on one of our key guys like Oruwariye.

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Puzzled by this pick.  I think Quinn must like wasting 2nd rnd picks ( Teez, he plays faster than his 40 time, Tabor)This guy is slow.  He may be a sure tackler, but if it's 6 yds downfield it doesn't do  the defense any good.  They drafted him only because NE had an interest in him.  This where Quinn and Patricia haven't learned from previous Pats GM's and coaches.  You can't create your team in the image of the Patriots.  All who've tried have failed. 

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, lioneye22 said:

Puzzled by this pick.  I think Quinn must like wasting 2nd rnd picks ( Teez, he plays faster than his 40 time, Tabor)This guy is slow.  He may be a sure tackler, but if it's 6 yds downfield it doesn't do  the defense any good.  They drafted him only because NE had an interest in him.  This where Quinn and Patricia haven't learned from previous Pats GM's and coaches.  You can't create your team in the image of the Patriots.  All who've tried have failed. 

There is no guarantee that this is going to work but I don't believe that most of those prior situations had a HC and GM with lengthy ties and experience in the NE system and had worked together. Also, this is a player that fits the defensive scheme they're running and the guy in charge of that is our HC. It's not the same as a Josh McDaniel's or Bill O'Brien going to a team and trying to role this out while they focus on the offense.

Cleveland Browns - Romeo Crennel/Phil Savage: Savage was hired by Bellichick when he was HC of the Browns but stayed on with the Ravens after they moved to Baltimore. Some similar processes and language but there is a disconnect in time from working directly together

Houston Texans - Bill O'Brien/Rick Smith: No connection or overlap when O'Brien was hired from Penn State to take over the Texans

Denver Broncos - Josh McDaniels/Brian Xanders - No connection or overlap when McDaniels was hired from New England

 

If you look at the Titans and Lions

Titans - Mike Vrabel/Jon Robinson: Robinson spent 11 years with the Patriots in their scouting staff in different positions. Vrabel played for the Patriots for 7 years and was an integral player on that defense. He's risen up the ranks over the years in a few different stints

Lions - Matt Patricia/Bob Quinn: Quinn spent 15 years with the Patriots in their scouting staff in different positions. Patricia spent 13 years with the Patriots in different roles including 5 years as the Defensive Co-Ordinator.

No guarantees that these will work but I would say these are significant differences in the situations.

Edited by Karnage84

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5 hours ago, lioneye22 said:

Puzzled by this pick.  I think Quinn must like wasting 2nd rnd picks ( Teez, he plays faster than his 40 time, Tabor)This guy is slow.  He may be a sure tackler, but if it's 6 yds downfield it doesn't do  the defense any good.  They drafted him only because NE had an interest in him.  This where Quinn and Patricia haven't learned from previous Pats GM's and coaches.  You can't create your team in the image of the Patriots.  All who've tried have failed. 

He's got enough speed. His game speed is at least solid.

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