Raiders-Titans GDT

[NJ Raider]

I've wanted to post today but haven't really had time and it seems like some of you have addressed most of my concerns collectively.

 

Who knows what will happen with Brady, but if you think Gruden wont jump at the chance of bringing him in you're crazy. Imagine what he could do with our line, tight ends, and Jacobs. We definitely wouldn't have all of the stalled drives. Guys are getting open. Carr just can't read the field.

People are saying they don't want to see Kizer, but I think Gruden and Mayock might see him as someone that can take the reigns as soon as next year. As much as I want to draft a rookie and move on from Carr, I think their plan could be to bring Carr back while Peterman and Kizer develop. They would both know the offense pretty well by that point. Carr provided us hope after over a decade of atrocious qb play. We are still hoping he will get better. It's been six years and although he has made some progress, I don't think he can be fixed. Kizer should have received some snaps yesterday when the game was out of hand. He definitely scores on that fourth and one fwiw..

[BackinBlack]

8 minutes ago, raidr4life said:

Why we even asking this question Gruden at the very beginning of the season said he wanted Carr to take more deep shots and use his feet more, so im sure Gruden is disappointed, and you don't really want your QB thinking you are down on him plus you want to keep his percieved value up if you decide to try and trade him.

Agreed on Gruden wanting to take more deep shots, but with our Oline, and running game, why arent we using the play action more? 
I know Gruden wants to be a run first team, that can throw it deep, but I dont see it in the play calling. 
Where is Waller running right down the middle of the field to hold the safeties? Teams do it to us all the time.

I think it is time for our QB to know we are down on him.

His trade value isnt much right now regardless, teams probably think we will either cut him or roll with him. Lets see Gruden go light a fire under him. 

 

[raidr4life]

4 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

Agreed on Gruden wanting to take more deep shots, but with our Oline, and running game, why arent we using the play action more? 
I know Gruden wants to be a run first team, that can throw it deep, but I dont see it in the play calling. 
Where is Waller running right down the middle of the field to hold the safeties? Teams do it to us all the time.

I think it is time for our QB to know we are down on him.

His trade value isnt much right now regardless, teams probably think we will either cut him or roll with him. Lets see Gruden go light a fire under him. 

 

Gruden is the type you will find out he's down on you the moment you get traded. I still think Carr trade value is a 2nd round pick in this QB starved league. Carr ran play action plays and went straight for the dump off.

Edited December 9, 2019 by raidr4life

[BackinBlack]

2 minutes ago, NJ Raider said:

People are saying they don't want to see Kizer, but I think Gruden and Mayock might see him as someone that can take the reigns as soon as next year. As much as I want to draft a rookie and move on from Carr, I think their plan could be to bring Carr back while Peterman and Kizer develop. They would both know the offense pretty well by that point. Carr provided us hope after over a decade of atrocious qb play. We are still hoping he will get better. It's been six years and although he has made some progress, I don't think he can be fixed. Kizer should have received some snaps yesterday when the game was out of hand. He definitely scores on that fourth and one fwiw..

Not trying to speak for other people, but I think this is why there is such a black and white debate among Raider fans.
I have been a die hard since 2002, and in my late 20s... which i imagine is around middle age for most people here. 

because of this, most of us have only seen absolute trash at the QB position. I remember cheering for Gannon, but, im not going to sit here and say I remember watching him read and carve up defenses when i was like 12 years old. 

Carr has shown us what a capable QB looks like, and for a lot of us, that is 1000 times better than anything weve seen on this roster. 
Carr is the best Raider QB i have legit watched play, so it is scary to just get rid of him, because I know how much worse it can get. 

but being scared of it getting worse, shouldnt be the reason Carr keeps his job

[oakdb36]

You guys really want the HC to publicly bash a player in a PC? What for exactly? To make you feel better?

[NJ Raider]

Those 2010-11 Jason Campbell years were pretty fun to watch. We had an awesome run game, but he took advantage of defenses selling out against the run. I'm not saying Jason Campbell is some amazing qb, but I think that some of the things he did were not all that different from Carr. Just a much smaller sample size. Not as many comebacks, but you can only come back if you're behind.

[Chali21]

20 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

Not trying to speak for other people, but I think this is why there is such a black and white debate among Raider fans.
I have been a die hard since 2002, and in my late 20s... which i imagine is around middle age for most people here. 

because of this, most of us have only seen absolute trash at the QB position. I remember cheering for Gannon, but, im not going to sit here and say I remember watching him read and carve up defenses when i was like 12 years old. 

Carr has shown us what a capable QB looks like, and for a lot of us, that is 1000 times better than anything weve seen on this roster. 
Carr is the best Raider QB i have legit watched play, so it is scary to just get rid of him, because I know how much worse it can get. 

but being scared of it getting worse, shouldnt be the reason Carr keeps his job

This is how i feel as well. I think many of the ideas on replacing Carr around here are foolish. If the Raiders end up getting someone else they need to be smart about it. 

[BackinBlack]

10 minutes ago, oakdb36 said:

You guys really want the HC to publicly bash a player in a PC? What for exactly? To make you feel better?

pretty much i am tired of the excuses. As derek carr said "no one cares" when asked about injuries.
I want reporters to start calling out Gruden for his play calling
I want Gruden to question Carr on some of his reads
I want Gruden to question PG about missed tackles. 

also, I think there is a difference between publicly bashing a player, and calling them out. and it just happens, that I also believe this to be an important role in a coaches job.
If you keep telling carr he is doing good and doing what you want, are you expecting him to start doing things differently?
(again, I can only go off what is said in public, I dont know what gruden is saying in team meetings)
If your gf says everything is fine, and then just dumps you 2 months later.. are you not a little angry she didnt tell you what was wrong?

If Gruden is planning on moving on, I believe, you man up, address the situation, tell the players how it is, and see how they react.

[BackinBlack]

16 minutes ago, NJ Raider said:

Those 2010-11 Jason Campbell years were pretty fun to watch. We had an awesome run game, but he took advantage of defenses selling out against the run. I'm not saying Jason Campbell is some amazing qb, but I think that some of the things he did were not all that different from Carr. Just a much smaller sample size. Not as many comebacks, but you can only come back if you're behind.

yea that is a fair point Jason Campbell was good for us, it is to bad he and DMC couldnt stay healthy that 7-4 season. (DMC was on that team right?)

[oakdb36]

2 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

pretty much i am tired of the excuses. As derek carr said "no one cares" when asked about injuries.
I want reporters to start calling out Gruden for his play calling
I want Gruden to question Carr on some of his reads
I want Gruden to question PG about missed tackles. 

also, I think there is a difference between publicly bashing a player, and calling them out. and it just happens, that I also believe this to be an important role in a coaches job.
If you keep telling carr he is doing good and doing what you want, are you expecting him to start doing things differently?
(again, I can only go off what is said in public, I dont know what gruden is saying in team meetings)
If your gf says everything is fine, and then just dumps you 2 months later.. are you not a little angry she didnt tell you what was wrong?

If Gruden is planning on moving on, I believe, you man up, address the situation, tell the players how it is, and see how they react.

But you do it face to face, not through the media. Not sure how anyone can imagine Gruden isn't telling Carr everything he's doing wrong in the meeting room. There's no point adressing it publicly.

[BackinBlack]

1 hour ago, oakdb36 said:

But you do it face to face, not through the media. Not sure how anyone can imagine Gruden isn't telling Carr everything he's doing wrong in the meeting room. There's no point adressing it publicly.

ok cool we agree with that. 
I guess, from what I hear from how both Gruden and Carr speak, they both seem to think his play his fine. 

Gruden sounding confident in Carr, I agree could (probably is) jsut be coach speak... but why the hell does Carr seem comfortable with his play. Why isnt he more PO'd if he knows his coach is going to be on him / has been on him?

[RaidersAreOne]

1 hour ago, NJ Raider said:

Those 2010-11 Jason Campbell years were pretty fun to watch. We had an awesome run game, but he took advantage of defenses selling out against the run. I'm not saying Jason Campbell is some amazing qb, but I think that some of the things he did were not all that different from Carr. Just a much smaller sample size. Not as many comebacks, but you can only come back if you're behind.

Ah man that's a major throw back. I remember really liking Campbell before he broke his collarbone. 

[NCOUGHMAN]

20 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said:

Ah man that's a major throw back. I remember really liking Campbell before he broke his collarbone. 

I was at that game 😤

[dante9876]

2 hours ago, oakdb36 said:

But you do it face to face, not through the media. Not sure how anyone can imagine Gruden isn't telling Carr everything he's doing wrong in the meeting room. There's no point adressing it publicly.

He clearly is. Watch last week end of the game presser vs mid week presser from Carr. Carr on kc interceptions end of the game presser was "safeties made great plays. I have hit that William's slant plenty of times. Mid week presser. "Yeah on that 2nd interception I'll probably just throw it some where else next time. I just throw it where my coaches tell me to. 

 

Clearly he got ripped for not reading that safety breaking on that play. 

[big_palooka]

15 hours ago, BackinBlack said:

Not trying to speak for other people, but I think this is why there is such a black and white debate among Raider fans.
I have been a die hard since 2002, and in my late 20s... which i imagine is around middle age for most people here. 

because of this, most of us have only seen absolute trash at the QB position. I remember cheering for Gannon, but, im not going to sit here and say I remember watching him read and carve up defenses when i was like 12 years old. 

Carr has shown us what a capable QB looks like, and for a lot of us, that is 1000 times better than anything weve seen on this roster. 
Carr is the best Raider QB i have legit watched play, so it is scary to just get rid of him, because I know how much worse it can get. 

but being scared of it getting worse, shouldnt be the reason Carr keeps his job

This post kind of embodies what I feel Raider Nation has become. Because things have been so bad, for so long even a marginal talent is better than what was. As fans we've become insecure about having terrible QBs, that we don't feel we deserve better. There is a "good enough" factor. A comfort with being just kind of okay vs. being terrible. Personally, I want more... a lot more.

The Raiders motto is Commitment to Excellence. Committing to Carr is committing to average. Fans have to want more than that.