Texans fire Bill O'Brien head coach/GM; Romeo Crennel to be interim

[ET80]

3 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

I mean, it's been months since they let him trade Hopkins so...

And? I'm really trying to figure out why you're stuck on this. BoB consulted with nearly everyone on this - Easterby, Cal, Kelly. Nobody said no.

So, why would you fire someone when they did something you didn't disagree with?

[CKSteeler]

1 minute ago, ET80 said:

Giving him a title, when he already had the responsibilities of the role?

He ended up in that role because they ended up in an actually odd position where they couldn't hire their chosen GM late into the process. They could have hired someone else the next year after his bizarre moves, but chose not to. So they got a taste of what he was selling as GM, and then decided rather than than reign him in to give the title full time. Hence doubling down. This isn't complicated.

They signed off on the moves he made in 2019 by giving him the title in 2020 and letting him trade away Hopkins. Then reversed course just 4 games in. Yea, that's poor decision making.

[ET80]

2 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

He ended up in that role because they ended up in an actually odd position where they couldn't hire their chosen GM late into the process. They could have hired someone else the next year after his bizarre moves, but chose not to. So they got a taste of what he was selling as GM, and then decided rather than than reign him in to give the title full time. Hence doubling down. This isn't complicated.

They signed off on the moves he made in 2019 by giving him the title in 2020 and letting him trade away Hopkins. Then reversed course just 4 games in. Yea, that's poor decision making.

Much easier than continuing this discussion:

6 minutes ago, ET80 said:

You're referencing semantics at this point. What's there to argue?

You: Four games in!

Me: He had 22 games with GM responsibilities.

You: But only four games as ACTUAL GM!

Me: He had the roles and responsibilities of a GM before the title, though.

You: But he only got the title now!

Me: But the actual job has been his since he pulled the rug from the other guy?

You: Double Down!

Me: By giving him a new title that aligns with his existing job function? No new contract? No new money? Just a new title to go with an old job?

You: Double Down!!!

I sincerely think you're just being obtuse. Which is fine, I really don't care.

 

[CKSteeler]

5 minutes ago, ET80 said:

And? I'm really trying to figure out why you're stuck on this. BoB consulted with nearly everyone on this - Easterby, Cal, Kelly. Nobody said no.

So, why would you fire someone when they did something you didn't disagree with?

If they agreed with the decision, then they're firing him after 4 games with the roughest schedule in the league. If they didn't agree with the decision, they let a guy they had such little faith in continue to make franchise-altering decisions. But it's puzzling to you why I'm stuck on this and saying there's a larger issue at play.

This is an argument I don't care about. I have no stakes in it. Even if  you want to call it 22 games into his tenure, it changes nothing about my actual argument. You really just don't want to address the actual point that your ownership is as much to blame as BoB for all of this.

[N4L]

No one is saying the Texans ownership isn't to blame 

 

Don't worry ET, even bad owners make good decisions sometimes. Even Jed York got it right eventually. Only took him 5 tries. Sooo considering how long you guys kept moldy Bob past his expiration, it will only be another 40 years until you hire a the right guy 

[ET80]

6 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

You really just don't want to address the actual point that your ownership is as much to blame as BoB for all of this.

Go ahead and point to me where I tried to defend the McNair family in any of this. Only thing I said is that they're traditionally hands off, which is true. 

"BoB had 22 games to prove his incompetence" and "The McNair family made a mistake in retaining BoB as long as they did" are two mutually exclusive statements. Not sure where you're getting the impression that I'm letting the McNair family slide on this, but I'm not.

My only engagement with you is how this isn't a reaction that's four games in. Really, this is seven years in.

[ET80]

Just now, N4L said:

No one is saying the Texans ownership isn't to blame

I'm REALLY struggling where @CKSteeler is getting that impression. At the least, they admitted a problem (about five years too Iate).

[ET80]

2 minutes ago, N4L said:

Don't worry ET, even bad owners make good decisions sometimes. Even Jed York got it right eventually. Only took him 5 tries. Sooo considering how long you guys kept moldy Bob past his expiration, it will only be another 40 years until you hire a the right guy 

As long as it's not BoB, I'm ok. Until I'm not ok.

[CKSteeler]

1 minute ago, ET80 said:

Go ahead and point to me where I tried to defend the McNair family in any of this. Only thing I said is that they're traditionally hands off, which is true. 

"BoB had 22 games to prove his incompetence" and "The McNair family made a mistake in retaining BoB as long as they did" are two mutually exclusive statements. Not sure where you're getting the impression that I'm letting the McNair family slide on this, but I'm not.

My only engagement with you is how this isn't a reaction that's four games in. Really, this is seven years in.

They didn't just retain him too long. They gave him more power as time went along with it peaking just four games before his firing. That's where we are disagreeing, seemingly. They aren't (just) hands-off. They are incompetent.

[ET80]

6 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

They didn't just retain him too long. They gave him more power as time went along with it peaking just four games before his firing

22 games.

6 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

That's where we are disagreeing, seemingly. They aren't (just) hands-off. They are incompetent.

Please show me where I tried to refute that at any point. If that's your argument, you've moved the goalposts about three miles from your original statement:

2 hours ago, CKSteeler said:

I'm going to be the one to defend BoB. If he lost the locker room, you let a guy of his caliber clean it up. If that means trading Watson, you trade Watson. You cut JJ Watt? You cut him. Clean up that culture.

BoB has 5 winning records in 6 seasons. He has 4 division titles. Watson has never even won a playoff game (I aint counting that one against Buffalo).

This was your original argument. This is what got me involved. Joke or not, we find ourselves here... you creating strawmans about my views of the competency of the McNair family and altering a timeline based on a title updated to reflect his current role, me explaining that it's not just four games and how O'Brien benefitted from a weak division to get his pelts on the wall.

Nonetheless, I don't think we disagree. We just need to work on your delivery.

[CKSteeler]

The first post was a joke so I'm not going to argue any of that.

I think N4L summed things up well enough in his last post.

[ET80]

1 minute ago, CKSteeler said:

The first post was a joke so I'm not going to argue any of that.

I think N4L summed things up well enough in his last post.

Still need to work on your delivery.

[N4L]

5 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

I think N4L summed things up well enough in his last post.

Ok, this was the second true thing you've said 

Even a broken clock is right twice a day 

[pwny]

1 hour ago, ET80 said:

Because he lost the team. Over the last two weeks, the team turned on him. So, as an owner, you have two options:

- Fire him.

- Trade away MORE players to create the culture he wants.

Which sounds more feasible?

As a Jaguars fan, I can tell you that the latter is completely feasible. But a horrid idea.

[ET80]

Humble in victory.