I want QB Mathew Stafford here, but how much would it cost to get him?

[lavar703]

9 minutes ago, ripsean21 said:

I think this allowed them to get a QB to assess the roster this year. They go BPA in this draft see who belongs move the ones that don’t fit next year and get even more picks possibly for next year. I like what Detroit is doing but I agree I’d probably have taken that too

But that doesn’t really matter. You could turn the 8th pick into so much more than what they got. They took on a terrible contract and got most likely two late first rounders, one of which is three seasons from now. It was an bad trade by both teams just much worse on the Rams so they’re getting hammered for it. 

[lavar703]

1 minute ago, turtle28 said:

@ripsean21 Trading away a few good DL players does not equate to giving up all of our depth IMO.

I mean are we forgetting that we aren’t going to be able to keep our top 5 DL anyways within 3 years and it’s smart to trade away one of them and get picks for one of our DTs - either Allen, Payne or Settle - now or next year anyway? 

One way to look at the Watson trade is that we’d be packaging one of them - say Payne - in with a few other picks & Sweat for a Franchise QB and if we end up trading Payne next off-season we likely are only going to get a 2nd for him anyway.

I’m not trading Payne, Sweat and multiple first rounders. I’m honestly at a point where I can’t believe fans have talked themselves into believing this is a good thing. We literally have nothing behind Sweat and Young and I have no desire to waste money on Kerrigan who basically can’t play full time anymore. You get three first rounders and Payne, take it or leave it. 

[ARTMONK HOF]

 

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, lavar703 said:

I’m not trading Payne, Sweat and multiple first rounders. I’m honestly at a point where I can’t believe fans have talked themselves into believing this is a good thing. We literally have nothing behind Sweat and Young and I have no desire to waste money on Kerrigan who basically can’t play full time anymore. You get three first rounders and Payne, take it or leave it. 

So how are we going to get a franchise QB? How are we going to be anything more than just a 10 win team which we’ve only been twice in the last 29 years mostly bc we haven’t had a franchise QB?

People keep saying no to trading to Stafford or to trading for Watson but I don’t see any franchise QB walking through that door who can take us from below average - which is what we currently are - to Super Bowl contender within the next few year w/o us trading them whether that’s trading for a vet who’s on the market or trading multiple firsts & Other picks to get up to where we can draft one of the top QBs in this draft.

[turtle28]

13 minutes ago, ARTMONK HOF said:

 

Go home? Chris Russell he always gets like 90% of things right bit not 100%. Stafford is from Georgia & Texas, he has no roots in LA.

[ripsean21]

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

@ripsean21 Trading away a few good DL players does not equate to giving up all of our depth IMO.

I mean are we forgetting that we aren’t going to be able to keep our top 6 DL anyways within 3 years and it’s smart to trade away one of them and get picks for one of our DTs - either Allen, Ioannidis, Payne or Settle - now or next year anyway? 

One way to look at the Watson trade is that we’d be packaging one of them - say Payne - in with a few other picks & Sweat for a Franchise QB and if we end up trading Payne next off-season we likely are only going to get a 2nd for him anyway.

And obviously we can still draft the guy who you think is going to be the franchise savior in Kellen Mond in the 3rd round to develop behind Watson even if we traded away our 1st & 2nd in this years draft for Watson.

 

I just don’t believe in creating holes because we can turn those players into more picks as the years move.  I just have a hard time moving guys that actually preformed here and are apart of this team trending up. And yes while we’re going to lose those DL as the years go on, moving them for picks allows us to replace them with younger talent and we will still have our natural picks to keep building up the roster. Trust me man I just like Mond he could bust just like any other. I just see something and it seems like nobody media or scouting sites even mention him they literally talked about every other QB on Chris Russell’s pod for the senior bowl recap. Idk trust me I’m tired of mentioning him as well but I just have a idea that I see work for teams that continuously seem to be relevant year in and year out and that system doesn’t involve trading two of your top 5 players and your best picks this year and next. Trading a first and a 3rd one year is one thing. Trading all these players and picks and I just can’t see how with all the leg injuries our QB’s have suffered here were so willing to trade for one on strike 2

[ripsean21]

1 hour ago, lavar703 said:

But that doesn’t really matter. You could turn the 8th pick into so much more than what they got. They took on a terrible contract and got most likely two late first rounders, one of which is three seasons from now. It was an bad trade by both teams just much worse on the Rams so they’re getting hammered for it. 

Oh I’m with you I just mentioned what they had to see with what they took. I would have talent the Carolina trade all day.

[lavar703]

45 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

So how are we going to get a franchise QB? How are we going to be anything more than just a 10 win team which we’ve only been twice in the last 29 years mostly bc we haven’t had a franchise QB?

People keep saying no to trading to Stafford or to trading for Watson but I don’t see any franchise QB walking through that door who can take us from below average - which is what we currently are - to Super Bowl contender within the next few year w/o us trading them whether that’s trading for a vet who’s on the market or trading multiple firsts & Other picks to get up to where we can draft one of the top QBs in this draft.

Watson won 4 games last year. FOUR. If we give up all our draft choices and talent we’re going to be in a similar situation. So you draft someone and you keep doing it until you get it right. That’s literally what all the teams in the league with franchise QBs have done. 

[ripsean21]

39 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Watson won 4 games last year. FOUR. If we give up all our draft choices and talent we’re going to be in a similar situation. So you draft someone and you keep doing it until you get it right. That’s literally what all the teams in the league with franchise QBs have done. 

This is what I’m basically saying it’s just selling what you were building and moving backward there for something they already could have had

[turtle28]

3 hours ago, lavar703 said:

I’m not trading Payne, Sweat and multiple first rounders. I’m honestly at a point where I can’t believe fans have talked themselves into believing this is a good thing. We literally have nothing behind Sweat and Young and I have no desire to waste money on Kerrigan who basically can’t play full time anymore. You get three first rounders and Payne, take it or leave it. 

I could see Payne and 3 first rounders. I think that the Texans aren’t going to trade Watson until they know they have to. I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s still on their roster in September, but if he doesn’t show up to play week 1 that then they’ll trade him.

I think by the time September rolls around that they’ll get less in their demands in a trade and a player like Payne, three first rounders & some mid round picks will do it.

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, lavar703 said:

Watson won 4 games last year. FOUR. If we give up all our draft choices and talent we’re going to be in a similar situation. So you draft someone and you keep doing it until you get it right. That’s literally what all the teams in the league with franchise QBs have done. 

Yeah, and I’ve said this before you need to analyze why the Texans lost games. They couldn’t stop anyone because half of their defense was injured - which when healthy was good. 
 

Trading away one or two of our top 6 DL does not devoid our defense of talent. It would still be top 10 as long as we re-sign Darby and upgrade our MLB spot.

Then, you put a QB on our offense capable of accounting for for 5,000 yards and 36 TDs (rushing & receiving) to go with Gibson in the backfield and we’re a Super Bowl contender next year and for as long as Watson is our QB, we have Terry and we have at least some of the D we have in tact.

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, ripsean21 said:

I just don’t believe in creating holes because we can turn those players into more picks as the years move.  I just have a hard time moving guys that actually preformed here and are apart of this team trending up. And yes while we’re going to lose those DL as the years go on, moving them for picks allows us to replace them with younger talent and we will still have our natural picks to keep building up the roster. Trust me man I just like Mond he could bust just like any other. I just see something and it seems like nobody media or scouting sites even mention him they literally talked about every other QB on Chris Russell’s pod for the senior bowl recap. Idk trust me I’m tired of mentioning him as well but I just have a idea that I see work for teams that continuously seem to be relevant year in and year out and that system doesn’t involve trading two of your top 5 players and your best picks this year and next. Trading a first and a 3rd one year is one thing. Trading all these players and picks and I just can’t see how with all the leg injuries our QB’s have suffered here were so willing to trade for one on strike 2

We’re going to get nothing for those players if we lose them in free agency but maybe a compensatory pick. We certainly won’t get a franchise QB back in return by trading them and some picks.

I’d rather package which ever DL we can get away with trading - hopefully it’s not Chase or Sweat - and some picks for Watson.
 

Boom! Super Bowl contender as long as we keep Scherff, Darby, sign a #2 WR and upgrade MLB.

[offbyone]

4 hours ago, lavar703 said:

But that doesn’t really matter. You could turn the 8th pick into so much more than what they got. They took on a terrible contract and got most likely two late first rounders, one of which is three seasons from now. It was an bad trade by both teams just much worse on the Rams so they’re getting hammered for it. 

I agree, but there is a counter argument...

The counter argument about this trade for these future 1st rounders is the 2022 and 2023 drafts will be much better than this one because there will likely be a college football season next year.  The draft is already a crapshoot and this year a lot of draftees are a full season short or at least a partial season on what we would usually be able to evaluate.  

This is not a year I want massive draft capital.  Outside of some of the clear well known entities, it is a crapshoot.  The result is there will be a lot of pressure to trade up this year to get these known entities.  Outside of those top players, the scouting staff is working with less information to evaluate with.

[ripsean21]

10 hours ago, turtle28 said:

We’re going to get nothing for those players if we lose them in free agency but maybe a compensatory pick. We certainly won’t get a franchise QB back in return by trading them and some picks.

I’d rather package which ever DL we can get away with trading - hopefully it’s not Chase or Sweat - and some picks for Watson.
 

Boom! Super Bowl contender as long as we keep Scherff, Darby, sign a #2 WR and upgrade MLB.

Maybe you don’t get a franchise QB but good teams draft theirs. You trust your scouts and your GM your coaching staff will have input and when they agree you will generally find your guy. But next year we have Allen on the 5th year option. Say you move that guy to a Denver for say maybe a Noah Fant. Maybe Albert O grows this year with whichever QB they roll with and this guy and they still need a interior player we upgrade our TE room and we get more cap flexibility because he will have another year on his rookie deal but that keeps us strong at DL and upgrade the TE room. This isn’t a real scenario I just mentioned a name at a position and I mean you maybe get a little lesser of a player but you upgrade a spot that we could use another impactful player that was basically what I was saying don’t play the comp game with your top end guys try to actually make more aggressive movers for other young guys who help round out a weaker spot on the roster

[turtle28]

10 hours ago, ripsean21 said:

Maybe you don’t get a franchise QB but good teams draft theirs. You trust your scouts and your GM your coaching staff will have input and when they agree you will generally find your guy. But next year we have Allen on the 5th year option. Say you move that guy to a Denver for say maybe a Noah Fant. Maybe Albert O grows this year with whichever QB they roll with and this guy and they still need a interior player we upgrade our TE room and we get more cap flexibility because he will have another year on his rookie deal but that keeps us strong at DL and upgrade the TE room. This isn’t a real scenario I just mentioned a name at a position and I mean you maybe get a little lesser of a player but you upgrade a spot that we could use another impactful player that was basically what I was saying don’t play the comp game with your top end guys try to actually make more aggressive movers for other young guys who help round out a weaker spot on the roster

How are we going to get a good QB while remaining mediocre and drafting in the late teens? This is a major problem for this organization and has been almost every year for nearly 30 years. Staying in mediocrity is not helping us build a Super Bowl contending team. We need a QB. We can figure the rest out after that as other franchises have done over and over after getting their franchise QB.

I’ll be shocked if Rivera traded Jon Allen. I’ll continually say that. I don’t see that happening unless it’s in a package to get a pro bowl caliber QB.