MWil23 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 I mean, considering it's impossible to test any individual who doesn't get a test or who is unaccounted for, that's not exactly accurate data, and I really don't have a dog in this fight. It's like two weeks ago when I had to evaluate testing data, and 1/3 of the students that I was evaluating weren't even in our building or learning in person because they opted to go virtual. (I'm not using the 1/3 as a 1:1 correlation, just an example) TL;DR UNVACCINATED individuals from anywhere/everywhere are contributing factors, as are politicians who have $10,000 a plate dinners in the hundreds sitting shoulder to shoulder completely unmasked, aside from their serving staff and caterers of course. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, NateDawg said: And as it relates to juvenile vaccinations, my wife works in the pharmacy department at the local university. Her boss, who might be the smartest person I know and is also in favor of both the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines, would not feel comfortable letting her child get the vaccination based off of the information out there right now. That could very well change, but for what it’s worth for those that want to rush to approval there. I’m not going to listen to the loudest person in the room on this. The most convincing people are the ones that are generally very thoughtful and make good decisions in life based off of reason and study. I mean if we’re doing the appeal to authority thing.. 96% of physicians are vaccinated. 92% of pharmacists are vaccinated (or had planned to be when the article was compiled in the spring). Oh and the head of the American Academy of Pediatrics has this to say. https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/pediatricians-plead-fda-move-quickly-covid-vaccine-kids-n1276191 There’s always some “incredibly brilliant guy” who disagrees with whatever topic is being discussed, but by and large that’s not the common view nor how they choose to care for themselves. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Hope- Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, BobbyPhil1781 said: You're asking for things you know I cannot provide and I'm not even the one that made the claim. Maybe "playing" was the wrong word to use...... if you know you can't provide evidence, then you probably shouldn't make that claim! and no, you didn't make it originally, but "How is it adding to the problem? You're kidding, right?" seems like an endorsement to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateDawg Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, -Hope- said: yes, i do. epidemiologists and public health departments track things like this. it is literally their job. you're not using "logic," you're making claims without a shred of evidence and acting like they're self-explanatory. they aren't! There are articles on both sides. You can use Google as well as I can. But I’m not going to send them back and forth with you because then we would continue to argue about a topic we are not supposed to be talking about. As explained, multiple times, I made a statement that clusters of unvaccinated people together spread Covid. That is not something I have heard denied by logical people. So I don’t really feel like there is further reason to argue this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateDawg Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: I mean if we’re doing the appeal to authority thing.. 96% of physicians are vaccinated. 92% of pharmacists are vaccinated (or had planned to be when the article was compiled in the spring). Oh and the head of the American Academy of Pediatrics has this to say. https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/pediatricians-plead-fda-move-quickly-covid-vaccine-kids-n1276191 There’s always some “incredibly brilliant guy” who disagrees with whatever topic is being discussed, but by and large that’s not the common view nor how they choose to care for themselves. My argument has nothing to do with adults being vaccinated, the medical world would agree on that. It was whether she would be fine with her 6 year old being vaccinated, which she would not. She conducts studies as part of her job and is head of an entire school’s pharmacy department. So she carries a lot of credibility. Of course in a perfect world I would want to be comfortable with giving all three of my kids the vaccine. Who wouldn’t want peace of mind there? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/203-doctors-told-us-actually-014519989.html?scrlybrkr=92a343a6 It's yahoo, but still. 203 out of 203 polled doctors recommended vaccination 12+. I'm tempted to share this with some people and then watch chaos unfold just for my own amusement. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyPhil1781 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 2 minutes ago, -Hope- said: if you know you can't provide evidence, then you probably shouldn't make that claim! and no, you didn't make it originally, but "How is it adding to the problem? You're kidding, right?" seems like an endorsement to me. B/c I don't think there's any damn chance they're testing every single person crossing the border and that's easy to prove b/c people cross the border illegally on a monthly basis. Please don't try to ask for data on that......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 4 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: I mean if we’re doing the appeal to authority thing.. 96% of physicians are vaccinated. 92% of pharmacists are vaccinated (or had planned to be when the article was compiled in the spring). Oh and the head of the American Academy of Pediatrics has this to say. https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/pediatricians-plead-fda-move-quickly-covid-vaccine-kids-n1276191 There’s always some “incredibly brilliant guy” who disagrees with whatever topic is being discussed, but by and large that’s not the common view nor how they choose to care for themselves. For the record, I know her and trust her, and will be doing what she says. The entire premise of what she said was "With the current trial and where the data stands now..." ...meaning when it becomes safe without the current risk factors she mentioned, she'll get her 6 year old vaccinated, as will we. Until then, we won't. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Hope- Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, NateDawg said: There are articles on both sides. You can use Google as well as I can. But I’m not going to send them back and forth with you because then we would continue to argue about a topic we are not supposed to be talking about. As explained, multiple times, I made a statement that clusters of unvaccinated people together spread Covid. That is not something I have heard denied by logical people. So I don’t really feel like there is further reason to argue this. i'm not disputing that, generally speaking, clusters of unvaccinated people spread covid. you seem to be leaving out the part of your claim that i am disputing- that "unvaccinated floods herding through the border," in your words, are contributing to this spread. you are also refusing to provide any credible evidence to justify this claim. if there are "articles on both sides," show me. we have seen one article that stated that general procedure is to covid test and quarantine migrants as necessary. show me evidence that that procedure is being bypassed en masse, and show me evidence that this is leading to significant spread of covid. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramssuperbowl99 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 3 minutes ago, MWil23 said: UNVACCINATED individuals from anywhere/everywhere are contributing factors, as are politicians who have $10,000 a plate dinners in the hundreds sitting shoulder to shoulder completely unmasked, aside from their serving staff and caterers of course. If the politician and everyone there are vaccinated those are entirely separate categories of spreading events. I don't begrudge vaccinated people for living their lives like nothing is wrong at this point. They've done their part. It's on the rest of society to recognize there is a segment of people who are willing to die of a preventable disease in order to avoid being vaccinated, and remove the societal safety net so the rest of us can move on. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glen Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 2 hours ago, NateDawg said: If you think there is a single politician that actually cares about any one of us and isn’t just playing politics, we have no starting point. They preach vaccinations while allowing unvaccinated floods to herd through the border. Nobody on either side that has power actually cares about anyone of us. They care about the next election. It’s really that simple. This isn’t about politics, it’s about how this problem is not going away. The sooner people accept that this is here to stay, the sooner we can make rational decisions on what the new normal is. Bark bark bark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateDawg Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 Just now, -Hope- said: show me evidence that this is leading to significant spread of covid. Nah, I’m good bud. I’ve already explained my reasoning for not doing so. What you are trying to get me to do is not going to work and it’s run its course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Hope- Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, BobbyPhil1781 said: B/c I don't think there's any damn chance they're testing every single person crossing the border and that's easy to prove b/c people cross the border illegally on a monthly basis. Please don't try to ask for data on that......... "please don't try to ask for data" has been your entire argument to this point, so it's not like we're changing course here. unfortunately, i don't find that terribly convincing. people certainly cross the border illegally with relative frequency. but how many people cross illegally on a monthly basis? do those people make up a significant portion of the unvaccinated in the communities that they enter? there's just no direct line here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, ramssuperbowl99 said: If the politician and everyone there are vaccinated those are entirely separate categories of spreading events. I don't begrudge vaccinated people for living their lives like nothing is wrong at this point. They've done their part. It's on the rest of society to recognize there is a segment of people who are willing to die of a preventable disease in order to avoid being vaccinated, and remove the societal safety net so the rest of us can move on. I also don't begrudge them for it IF they are also vaccinated; but then don't mandate universal masks if the rest of us have. Flying on planes unmasked and working unmasked shouldn't be a luxury for politicians any more than it should be for me at this very second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyPhil1781 Posted August 27, 2021 Share Posted August 27, 2021 1 minute ago, ramssuperbowl99 said: If the politician and everyone there are vaccinated those are entirely separate categories of spreading events. I don't begrudge vaccinated people for living their lives like nothing is wrong at this point. They've done their part. It's on the rest of society to recognize there is a segment of people who are willing to die of a preventable disease in order to avoid being vaccinated, and remove the societal safety net so the rest of us can move on. Curious, what are your thoughts on people suggesting vaccinated people must wear masks, even outdoors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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