Wheel of Time Season 2 (Sept 1 Amazon Prime)

[SMashMouthMike]

On 12/24/2021 at 1:51 AM, Deadpulse said:

it shouldn't rely on book knowledge to make it better for a season

BINGO and Amen.
 

I feel as though most of the useful information about this story has been gained by looking on the internet. We’re just going to have to have a book reader explain that episode to us? Instead of another dark friend I guess? This makes our protagonists look stupid. The bad guys appear as though they’re explaining their evil plans to the good guys. Smfh. They should have cut Perrin’s dumb head off. 

Spoiler

Why did they leave the dagger behind for a bad guy to get instead of using magic to destroy it? And it appeared the peddler just sliced the ogier with it? Good going.

They knew they were being followed in the ways, or should have, and they know they’re going to the eye of the world to battle the dark one, yet they never ask for this horn? The king never thinks to get ahold of it, but worries about his armor? Moraine even warns that dumb king that something bad is coming iirc.

A city that close to the eye and the blight, which houses this horn, only has about 100 archers and a wall, and doesn’t seem manned at all times? Cmon writers! Edit, once again I paused and it showed about 10 guys there from the satellite’s view.

mats character already in shador logoth? When it took about 35 days at least to get from there to tar valor?(maybe he’s not there, but it sure looked like it to me). Edit-I guess that really was tar valon after rewatching it and pausing it, I saw the temple. Not something that should have to be done.

I guess that broken rock at the end somehow signifies something, releases bad magic from the eye? Moraine seems to suspect this, yet lets Rand just disappear on his own, wandering further into the blight that he shouldn’t touch. Where’s the regret? She doesn’t chase him down??? What are these characters doing? What are they actually learning, if anything? Why is there so little explanation of dreams and the enemies? Why do the “good guys” NOT seem to worry about dying at the end of the world and in battles, but worry more about their romantic relationships to the women they are supposed to be protecting? 

Good grief...

Who was that bad guy? Does any viewer know he is a forsaken and not the dark one? What is a forsaken? Did this forsaken guy channel Moraine stupid? Lol.

Why is the prologue in a different language? Why is that scene in a nursery? I had to pause this after every sentence then look at the characters to fully grasp what they were arguing about. Why not show Lews Terrin killing his family or the WORLD, so that Rand’s decision at the end makes more sense? It’s way too confusing for a prologue. And wtf was that epilogue tsunami? Out of nowhere? 

Tell a story writers!

”Dont touch anything here.” In a corrupted jungle? Okay, I’m out. Rand doesn’t question this? Just forays ahead, proceeds to touch stuff, takes a nap...dozing off to dreamland?

 

”what is this place?” Asks Rand at the eye of the world.

”We have no idea.” WTF Moraine!?!This is the last episode of the first season and u don’t know what this place is? Think how the viewers feel about this statement. It’s Comical. If she doesn’t know what this place is, then why are we here? Obviously she knows something! But I thought she couldn’t lie! What tf is going on here?

How in the world did Nyneve track Moraine’s tell? They were all on horses followed by a horde of trollocs! Maybe she just followed the damn trollocs!?! What a Ridiculous explanation, when a much easier one was right there for them.

But then how would Lan track Moraine through the blight? Why not make him good at something? Why are all the men inept, dumb, emotional and incompetent?

Some of these complaints are little, but some of these are  huge holes in basic storytelling. I can forgive some shoddy cgi, but it man, that episode was hot garbage melting on cow dung.

 

 

 

Edited December 26, 2021 by SMashMouthMike

[Xenos]

9 hours ago, Deadpulse said:

That was such a THUD oh my

Like Moraine had to ask because much like the audience, who the F knew what happened. They made... really weird choices. They wrapped up the entire Dark One threat (or at least thats what we are told. If he comes back later, irrelevant, it shouldn't rely on book knowledge to make it better for a season finale) with a dream sequence about how love is beyond your wants and some crazy beach going full kamikaze on a horde of drones. 

Im not even saying it was all bad. I am saying that it is a crap ending to a season. Yes, most season finales have setup for future stories, but this entire episode was that. This wasnt a finale this was episode 8 of 10. That big set up episode that creates intrigue.  

Yeah they really messed up the finale. Like people like yourself already mentioned, another couple of episodes may have helped especially the pilot and finale. Here’s one tidbit that was only hinted at in episode 5 but never got fully explained in the finale.

Spoiler

That wasn’t the Dark One. It was one of his powerful lieutenants. What they call a Forsaken.

Big things like the above seem to get brushed over because of the episode constraints. 
 

Looking back I appreciate the world building but it came at the expense of the story and The Two Rivers five especially Rand.

[Xenos]

Also looking back on the season, they definitely tried to sprinkle character moments but the execution ended up inconsistent to say the least. Rand, for example, was more Frodo than Luke Skywalker or Anakin. All he wanted was a simple life and a family in The Two Rivers. Egwene was the one who wanted more out of life.

[Broncofan]

I really enjoyed the season, after very low expectations.   But I'd agree that S1 suffered from being only 8 eps, in that they really took illogical leaps of character growth, and sudden plot jumps, that don't make sense to anyone unless you've read the books.

There's a LOT to work with, but I can understand the frustration if you haven't read the books.    Frankly, they mess around with the sequence of events for readers, too.   But I believe this is due to the competing interests of wanting to draw the reader crowd in with key moments, but also make it interesting enough for the non-reader crowd.  

Spoiler

It's definitely quite the leap to get to the Seanchan, and even the hint that there are races that can control channelers, like the last scene inferred.  If you hadn't read the books, you might think those were zombie channelers lol.  Including the Seanchan is a strong move overall - but wow, talk about a plot jump.

The mistakes in S1 don't doom WoT - but hopefully if S2 can be more organic and organized so non-readers can get more of a feel and appreciation for the events.   Much like action hero ensemble movies - if you don't build the foundation to establish the characters, and make them "earn" their key actions, it won't resonate with viewers.  

WoT has a TON of material to work with now - hopefully the writers can tighten this into a more cohesive package.   I will say as much as I had very low expectations, WoT actually has me hooked - but I read the series.    That's a mistake if it's a requirement to be excited to see the next season, one I hope the writers learn from.

[Deadpulse]

2 hours ago, Xenos said:

Looking back I appreciate the world building but it came at the expense of the story and The Two Rivers five especially Rand.

The world building is what keeps me around, honestly. Im frustrated with the character work, pace, and plotting but I'm curious all the same. 

[Fresh Prince]

8 minutes ago, Deadpulse said:

The world building is what keeps me around, honestly. Im frustrated with the character work, pace, and plotting but I'm curious all the same. 

Agreed if it wasn’t for the world building I would’ve gave up on the show. The season as a whole just wasn’t  very good.

[Xenos]

7 minutes ago, Fresh Prince said:

Agreed if it wasn’t for the world building I would’ve gave up on the show. The season as a whole just wasn’t  very good.

I would disagree with this. I think the pilot and to a really bigger extent the finale, dragged this season down. But I enjoyed everything in between and felt that each episode got better after the pilot, except the finale of course. It just needed at least two more episodes to breathe.

[Fresh Prince]

24 minutes ago, Xenos said:

I would disagree with this. I think the pilot and to a really bigger extent the finale, dragged this season down. But I enjoyed everything in between and felt that each episode got better after the pilot, except the finale of course. It just needed at least two more episodes to breathe.

There were 1-2 episodes I enjoyed but for the most part I seemed bored throughout the season. IGN gave the season finale a 9 lol. 

[SMashMouthMike]

3 hours ago, Xenos said:

 

  Hide contents

It was better on second viewing pausing frequently. But a 9/10 is ridiculous. 

Edited December 24, 2021 by SMashMouthMike

[Xenos]

36 minutes ago, Fresh Prince said:

There were 1-2 episodes I enjoyed but for the most part I seemed bored throughout the season. IGN gave the season finale a 9 lol. 

Yeah a 9 for the finale is ridiculous. I would give it no more than a 5.

[PrplChilPill]

I don't think non readers are confused. I just think the finale was mediocre, and Rand is boring.

[Xenos]

15 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

I don't think non readers are confused. I just think the finale was mediocre, and Rand is boring.

Mediocre is being nice. That was disappointing even for someone like me.

[Xenos]

2 hours ago, Broncofan said:

I really enjoyed the season, after very low expectations.   But I'd agree that S1 suffered from being only 8 eps, in that they really took illogical leaps of character growth, and sudden plot jumps, that don't make sense to anyone unless you've read the books.

There's a LOT to work with, but I can understand the frustration if you haven't read the books.    Frankly, they mess around with the sequence of events for readers, too.   But I believe this is due to the competing interests of wanting to draw the reader crowd in with key moments, but also make it interesting enough for the non-reader crowd.  

  Reveal hidden contents

It's definitely quite the leap to get to the Seanchan, and even the hint that there are races that can control channelers, like the last scene inferred.  If you hadn't read the books, you might think those were zombie channelers lol.  Including the Seanchan is a strong move overall - but wow, talk about a plot jump.

The mistakes in S1 don't doom WoT - but hopefully if S2 can be more organic and organized so non-readers can get more of a feel and appreciation for the events.   Much like action hero ensemble movies - if you don't build the foundation to establish the characters, and make them "earn" their key actions, it won't resonate with viewers.  

WoT has a TON of material to work with now - hopefully the writers can tighten this into a more cohesive package.   I will say as much as I had very low expectations, WoT actually has me hooked - but I read the series.    That's a mistake if it's a requirement to be excited to see the next season, one I hope the writers learn from.

Not sure how much Amazon interfered or if it was the showrunner’s decision but messing up the finale and to a lesser extent the pilot really hurts. I know that they wanted to make the first season’s focus be Moiraine. Which is fine since Pike is probably their best actress. But I can’t help feeling that there’s an imbalance in characterization that hurt the other protagonists especially Rand and Perrin. That’s why the pilot was so important. It should have been more about the Two River five. The showrunner sort of made up for it in episode 7 but we should have more of those moments sprinkled throughout the show especially the beginning. As it is, we know and care more about the Aes Sedai and their Warders than the five.

[Broncofan]

10 hours ago, Xenos said:

Yeah they really messed up the finale. Like people like yourself already mentioned, another couple of episodes may have helped especially the pilot and finale. Here’s one tidbit that was only hinted at in episode 5 but never got fully explained in the finale.

  Reveal hidden contents

That wasn’t the Dark One. It was one of his powerful lieutenants. What they call a Forsaken.

Big things like the above seem to get brushed over because of the episode constraints. 
 

Looking back I appreciate the world building but it came at the expense of the story and The Two Rivers five especially Rand.

Absolutely.  It’s a mistake franchises like the DCEU make time and again.  Hopefully with a TV series the writers get this.  Build up the characters and then deliver the big blows.   With the storyboard laid out it’s time to focus on the ta’veren.  Hopefully they hear that message loud and clear.  Having said that…

Spoiler

I’m looking forward to seeing Rand meet the people he came from, and Mat start to embrace the Lord of Luck and other skills he grows into.  

 

Edited December 25, 2021 by Broncofan

[Forge]

Never read the books... Finished the show today and I'm going to say.... Underwhelmed? 

Haven't read the posts for the series, but my own thoughts are that they tried too hard to keep it entertaining with hitting plot points faster, moving the story rapidly, etc. 

Characters never really developed much, and things happened quickly. Not accounting for the ridiculous plot points of late season GoT, it reminded me a lot of those last two years in terms of getting to things as quickly as possible whereas I think the show would have benefitted from being more like early season GoT. 

It wasn't bad, but left me wanting