2022 Pro Days

[Packerraymond]

11 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

Biased much?

 

Devin Lloyd had 22 TFLs, 7 sacks, 4 INTs, 6 passes deflected and two TDs, oh and 111 total tackles.

Chad Muma lead college football in total tackles with 142 and lead all college football with 85 solo tackles and had 3 INTs and 2 TDs.

Damone Clark was 3rd in college football with 136 total tackles and 5.5 sacks and 1 INTs.

Nakobe Dean had 10 TFLs, 6 sacks, 2 INTs 1 TD and 5 passes deflected and 2 forced fumbles.

 

Malcolm Rodriquez had 129 total tackles, 3 sacks, 4 passes deflected and 4 forced fumbles.

Troy Andersen had 147 total tackles, 83 solo tackles, 14 TFLs, 2 sacks, 2 INTs, 7 passes deflected.

 

 

 

Chenal had good pass rush success but so have many Wisconsin backers.  The issue with him in his lack of instincts and most of that would be in the passing game, he has 1 pass deflected in a three year college career playing in 25 games.  That is not exactly a well aware linebacker, sure it is not everything and Dean did not have a ton of tackles but Dean has ridiculous range and instincts on the field.  Someone as athletic as Chenal should have similar range and instincts one would think which is my point especially if his change of direction is so good.  Also he should of had way more tackles considering that athletic ability as well, one would think he could get off blocks and make plays more than he did.

Did he have a very good season?  Sure but so did many other top rated ILBs.  Will be curious where they rank in the draft and who goes where.   

 

 

We didn't drop him much, we dropped Sanborn. Can't fault a guy for not making coverage plays who doesn't play in coverage. You have one coverage backer in the NFL, it's so rare to drop 2 of them, shouldn't be an issue. Any team who drafts him is playing him on the attack.

[Ozzy]

12 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

We didn't drop him much, we dropped Sanborn. Can't fault a guy for not making coverage plays who doesn't play in coverage. You have one coverage backer in the NFL, it's so rare to drop 2 of them, shouldn't be an issue. Any team who drafts him is playing him on the attack.

True but if they drop Sanborn instead of you in coverage that is pretty sad because Sanborn is not great at it either.  Also most 3/4 defenses do not blitz the opposite ILB on every play.  So you need instincts to be able to read and react and you will be asked to coverage regardless and teams will find you if you cannot cover.  

 

But yeah he has a good chance to be picked 2nd round by the Dolphins, but teams like Washington, Dallas, Seattle want a ILB with far more range and all do not really even play a 3/4 anyway, Ravens I have going with Clark who again I like his overall ability better and his general feel for the position and playmaking more.  Green Bay maybe could get Leo Chenal late 2nd if teams pass on him because of his lack in coverage ability but I have him going to the Dolphins to play opposite Jerome Baker who is the ILB with more range anyway.  

[Ozzy]

There is also the fact that here are the top sack guys in the NFL from the ILB position, and that includes the top 120+ players who are the sack leaders in the entire NFL.  

Jerome Baker 5.5
Eric Kendricks 5
Devin White 3.5

 

 

So the NFL is not Wisconsin and do not typically blitz the ILB in a 3/4 defense play in and play out, so the Leo is going to have to cover people at one point or another.  So he either does that or switches positions to 3/4 OLB if he has the skills or the bend and not sure he does but will see.    

[jebrick]

I asked this question before the combine.  Is Chenal a 2 down ILB?  Why don't we see this athleticism on film more?  Perhaps it is the Wisconsin system but to never drop into coverage would make me worried.  If he is going to be a thumper ILB that is fine.  I would expect him to make reads running plays.   Basing the draft on the combine is dangerous but the draft if a crapshoot to begin with.  

[lark25]

31 minutes ago, jebrick said:

I asked this question before the combine.  Is Chenal a 2 down ILB?  Why don't we see this athleticism on film more?  Perhaps it is the Wisconsin system but to never drop into coverage would make me worried.  If he is going to be a thumper ILB that is fine.  I would expect him to make reads running plays.   Basing the draft on the combine is dangerous but the draft if a crapshoot to begin with.  

Weaponised to terrorise with power plays. The few times he dropped in coverage he was not a liability  i called this you could see the burst and explosion blowing up the back field.

Also @Ozzyit's a fallacy that Sanborn isn't good in coverage. He put up decent coverage grades, instincts off the charts and his athleticism is not terrible just not great in this draft full of crazy athletes.

Sanborn tested slightly better than Joe Schobert who is an ok not great athlete who is also decent in coverage. comparable players but id say Sanborn is more instinctive for that position.

Edited March 10, 2022 by lark25

[Jeezla]

Not sure i buy those Wisconsin 3 cone times. Everyone killed it. 

[THE DUKE]

2 minutes ago, Jeezla said:

Not sure i buy those Wisconsin 3 cone times. Everyone killed it. 

Every single pro day time is viewed with skepticism by me.

[Jeezla]

6 minutes ago, THE DUKE said:

Every single pro day time is viewed with skepticism by me.

Literally every Wisconsin player has great agility numbers. Even Seltzner, for 310 lbs, had a great time. I call bs. Never watched Chenal and thought "those are some loose hips" or "wow he's agile". He looked like LVE in coverage when he changes directions. 

Edited March 10, 2022 by Jeezla

[jrry32]

7 minutes ago, Jeezla said:

Literally every Wisconsin player has great agility numbers. Even Seltzner, for 310 lbs, had a great time. I call bs. Never watched Chenal and thought "those are some loose hips" or "wow he's agile". He looked like LVE in coverage when he changes directions. 

LVE coming out of Boise State was extremely agile for a big LB. I still remember him shutting Alvin Kamara down when the Saints seemed unstoppable on offense in 2018.

[Ozzy]

7 hours ago, Jeezla said:

Not sure i buy those Wisconsin 3 cone times. Everyone killed it. 

I was surprised by that as well.  Scott Nelson would have been 2nd best safety 3 cone at the combine.

There is no way Noah Burks has a better 3 cone agility than Nik Bonitto but whatever I guess.

 

 

 

Gerrit Prince TE UAB

Height: 6′ 4 1/2″

Weight: 241

Bench press: 14

Vertical jump: 32 1/2″

Broad jump: 9′6″

40-yard dash: 4.68

 

I think Prince has a chance to be a late round pick, is a good playmaking TE who is a natural pass catcher who can stretch the field and had an outstanding season this past year.  

 

[Packerraymond]

12 hours ago, jebrick said:

I asked this question before the combine.  Is Chenal a 2 down ILB?  Why don't we see this athleticism on film more?  Perhaps it is the Wisconsin system but to never drop into coverage would make me worried.  If he is going to be a thumper ILB that is fine.  I would expect him to make reads running plays.   Basing the draft on the combine is dangerous but the draft if a crapshoot to begin with.  

Players in college do what's best for the team to win, not what helps their pro stock. We heard this with AJ Dillon, PFF graded him a UDFA because he had no pass game reps at BC. He's come here and been a great addition to our pass game, he's got great hands and is an excellent blocker. 

UW doesn't ask Chenal to drop, that will never be his strong suit, doesn't mean he can't do it. The scouts that are watching him in the drills at the Combine, pro day and private workouts will have to make that decision for their clubs. The athletic profile says he should be able to be league average at worst there.

[Ozzy]

2 hours ago, Packerraymond said:

Players in college do what's best for the team to win, not what helps their pro stock. We heard this with AJ Dillon, PFF graded him a UDFA because he had no pass game reps at BC. He's come here and been a great addition to our pass game, he's got great hands and is an excellent blocker. 

UW doesn't ask Chenal to drop, that will never be his strong suit, doesn't mean he can't do it. The scouts that are watching him in the drills at the Combine, pro day and private workouts will have to make that decision for their clubs. The athletic profile says he should be able to be league average at worst there.

Not sure AJ Dillon is the comparison, PFF is stupid by the way if they said that and any idiot that did not think AJ Dillon is a tank in college and could be an extremely solid pro is an idiot.  And sure he had no pass reps because he ran the ball constantly, Jonathan Taylor on Wisconsin in comparison had 22.5 carries a game in his three year college career, AJ Dillon had 24.1 carries a game in his three year college career, less games though played for AJ total but he was with a worse offensive line and had worse talent around him in general.  

 

So again not sure that is a good comparison at all.  And yes players are asked to do what is best for the team to win in college but Leo was not put in coverage for a reason.  Wisconsin is 13-7 over the past two years, and in major college football is that really winning all that much?  They obviously love interior ILB pressure and bring their ILBs more than almost anyone.  So unless a team builds their scheme around Wisconsin's scheme, Leo being a great blitzing ILB might not be that important but will see what team he goes to and if any team plays with him playing more edge potentially.  Again not many NFL ILBs lead the league in sacks or are even top 50 in the league in sacks.  

It might not be the worst idea to put him potentially in a hybrid edge position and see how he does, even if that is in a 4/3 or 3/4.  What is the current comparison for Chenal in the NFL?  I do not know exactly to be honest.  And back again to his instincts or lack there of, Chris Borland, supposedly on paper less athletic then Leo but that dude was crazy aware of his surroundings, reacted very quickly to the football, read plays well and had very good range.  Had a great start to his pro career also before the injury ended his career.  Leo never has shown that type of quickness in processing or reaction time despite these fine workout numbers and there is the question of why is that?  If you are that quick and athletic and nimble then get to the football even when it is not in a straight line.  

[jebrick]

10 hours ago, Packerraymond said:

Players in college do what's best for the team to win, not what helps their pro stock. We heard this with AJ Dillon, PFF graded him a UDFA because he had no pass game reps at BC. He's come here and been a great addition to our pass game, he's got great hands and is an excellent blocker. 

UW doesn't ask Chenal to drop, that will never be his strong suit, doesn't mean he can't do it. The scouts that are watching him in the drills at the Combine, pro day and private workouts will have to make that decision for their clubs. The athletic profile says he should be able to be league average at worst there.

I am not saying he can't do it.  He has just not shown this athleticism on tape.  A ILB that can read/process quickly is a project.  If he had Shazier combine numbers and game tape, you take him in the 1st and hope he learns.  Otherwise, 2nd or 3rd round. 

[Packerraymond]

2 hours ago, jebrick said:

I am not saying he can't do it.  He has just not shown this athleticism on tape.  A ILB that can read/process quickly is a project.  If he had Shazier combine numbers and game tape, you take him in the 1st and hope he learns.  Otherwise, 2nd or 3rd round. 

He absolutely shows that athletic ability attacking upfield. Shazier was a do all LB, with tape of him having success across the board. Chenal is a 2nd/3rd rounder because you're left to project the other aspects of his game.

I'm not saying he deserves to go any higher than he will, but it was easy to see he was going to be freaky explosive from watching him play. I'll be interested to see what the finished product looks like at the pro level. 

[THE DUKE]

15 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Gerrit Prince TE UAB

Height: 6′ 4 1/2″

Weight: 241

Bench press: 14

Vertical jump: 32 1/2″

Broad jump: 9′6″

40-yard dash: 4.68

 

I think Prince has a chance to be a late round pick, is a good playmaking TE who is a natural pass catcher who can stretch the field and had an outstanding season this past year.  

More of an H Back/FB at that size that a true TE.