JDD Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: I wasn’t trying to change anyone’s mind, nor did I say they were the same person. But the allegations are similar and either someone cares, or they don’t, or they’re a hypocrite. These type of allegations either concern you, or you’re clutching pearls (not you specifically). Didn't think this was a particularly controversial statement tbh. Oh I was just talking **** My biggest issue with this trade is that it doesn't make sense for what this FO has preached. I guess they wanted him bad enough and went and got their guy and overlooked the issue with his personal stuff. I think my biggest question is does this trade make the Browns a contender in the NFL for years to come? If the Browns miss the playoffs in 2 of the 5 years he is here and don't get to / win a SB is that a good move? What are the expectations? Seems like the FO thinks this team is ready to win, can the D hold up? Can they find another pass rusher who compliments Myles? Can they find good to great players for the offense in the draft over the next 5 seasons when 3 of those years they don't have a 1st? It's possible but I think its more likely this team becomes a middle of the road team like most teams that have to much money for their cap to the QB. Watson isn't going to give the Browns a hometown discount on the next contract either, so is he as good as Aaron Rodgers? Can he put the team on his back and win games when his supporting cast isn't as good because they can't bring in the talent like other teams? Say Chubb and the RB room ends up not being as good, will he still win 12 games a year? When the defense doesn't get stops will he be driving the team down the field to win games with 40 seconds and no timeouts? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candyman93 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 (edited) 15 minutes ago, JDD said: Can he put the team on his back and win games when his supporting cast isn't as good because they can't bring in the talent like other teams? Say Chubb and the RB room ends up not being as good, will he still win 12 games a year? When the defense doesn't get stops will he be driving the team down the field to win games with 40 seconds and no timeouts? In my opinion, yes. He has the 2nd highest QB rating of all time. Edited March 21, 2022 by candyman93 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candyman93 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 I think people forget how good Watson is. Look at his 2020 stats. https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/3122840/deshaun-watson We just traded for a Aaron Rodgers caliber of talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawgX Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 7 minutes ago, candyman93 said: I think people forget how good Watson is. Look at his 2020 stats. https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/3122840/deshaun-watson We just traded for a Aaron Rodgers caliber of talent. I do have a concern that he played in a really weak division and now he's going to play in the cold in a very tough division. I think he'll still play at a very high level, but it does concern me a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReggieCamp Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 27 minutes ago, JDD said: My biggest issue with this trade is that it doesn't make sense for what this FO has preached. This was definitely one of my first reactions also. Trading 3 FRP's plus doesn't seem like an analytics move at all. That said, these guys have been shown to move away from some of the analytics "mantras" when they need to. Things like spending big money on guards, taking a LB with a high pick, giving a RB a 2nd contract, etc. Above all else, these guys are masters of game theory. They take all things into consideration (including the current landscape in the AFC). I love lots of things about Baker, but we were most likely never gonna win the AFC with him versus this current group of competitors. Unless we wanted to wait for all these great young QB's to go away, we had to make a big move. And we made it. Not guaranteeing that it's gonna work or anything like that, but I completely get it. Watson's contract is really quite reasonable, but I'm sure the nerds winced and held their noses as they gave away the picks. ** This post has nothing to do with ethics. That's a different discussion imo. ** 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BooyaCS09 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: welcome back. well that’s your first mistake. Getting an arrest, let alone an indictment or conviction doesn’t happen nearly as much as it should. Agreed, the league is full of bad guys. I mean, ok, let’s see where this goes.. Fishy that rich guys tend to live near other rich guys? Idk, that’s definitely how it works where I live. At times like this I can become a condescending arse, so don’t take it personally, but is this like your first experience in following a sexual assault case? They’re notoriously difficult to prosecute. Many boil down to something as simple as one party saying they were assaulted and the other saying it was consensual. Like, how would a DA proved he purposefully moved his junk so it would touch the masseurs in court? It’s his word vs hers. I hate to be the one to break it to you, but any “fun” in a massage parlor that isn’t a massage is illegal my man. They call that prostitution. There’s one key word in that last sentence. Can you show me an example of this ever happening? Let’s say 10+ women (lower the bar significantly for you to make it easier) who have accused a man of sexual assault and it came out later it was all just an orchestrated money grab by a lawyer. And while you’re looking, compare the number of those individuals you find (or don’t find) to the number of people who’ve been convicted (since that’s your standard) of serial sexual assaults and tell me which one you found to be more likely, at least statistically. Politicians, happens a lot. Last POTUS had 28 accusations against him. Current one has 8. Kavanaugh had 3 Also the RAINN stats are completely misleading. It is a viral graphic sent to show shock value that doesn't hold up to scrutiny. [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2014/12/09/the-truth-about-a-viral-graphic-on-rape-statistics/[/url] Also, to be clear, I am not saying he didn't do something. If he did I want to see the evidence. Show me where he is guilty and this "unreported' (they are unreported and extrapolated stats from a sample size. The true numbers can be higher or lower). numbers are accurate and not just regret after consenting a few weeks later. Also you didn't answer the question is he guilty and should he be "unemployable" based on nothing more than accusations? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 57 minutes ago, JDD said: Oh I was just talking **** My biggest issue with this trade is that it doesn't make sense for what this FO has preached. I guess they wanted him bad enough and went and got their guy and overlooked the issue with his personal stuff. Yeah, it makes the smart and accountable parts of “tough, smart and accountable” seem rather optional. Quote I think my biggest question is does this trade make the Browns a contender in the NFL for years to come? If the Browns miss the playoffs in 2 of the 5 years he is here and don't get to / win a SB is that a good move? What are the expectations? Seems like the FO thinks this team is ready to win, can the D hold up? Can they find another pass rusher who compliments Myles? Can they find good to great players for the offense in the draft over the next 5 seasons when 3 of those years they don't have a 1st? It's possible but I think its more likely this team becomes a middle of the road team like most teams that have to much money for their cap to the QB. Watson isn't going to give the Browns a hometown discount on the next contract either, so is he as good as Aaron Rodgers? Can he put the team on his back and win games when his supporting cast isn't as good because they can't bring in the talent like other teams? Say Chubb and the RB room ends up not being as good, will he still win 12 games a year? When the defense doesn't get stops will he be driving the team down the field to win games with 40 seconds and no timeouts? I think football wise the modern game starts and ends at the QB position. No secret or wild take there. So if you even want to have a puncher’s chance year in year out you’re gonna need a guy who can trade punches with the top guys, and I think Watson is that guy. Will it work? Idk. But strictly from a football perspective I think it’s a home run and an easy win for the organization. The rest of it? We’ll see. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchdigger Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 8 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: Yeah, it makes the smart and accountable parts of “tough, smart and accountable” seem rather optional. Toughness is TBD. Might not play with one arm, though. Smart was evident when he hired Rusty Hardin. Playing devil's advocate here, but is there a greater measure of accountability than the justice system? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, BooyaCS09 said: Politicians, happens a lot. Last POTUS had 28 accusations against him. Current one has 8. Kavanaugh had 3 So in your mind now we’re up to about 60 women and they’re all lying? If that’s the stance it’s not a matter of what happened in your mind, you simply don’t believe women. And that’s…. a stance. Best I can say is you’re consistent lol. My issue is when people are clutching pearls for one and dismissing the other. Folks are free to feel how they like, but the hypocrisy is already tedious. “I refuse to believe 20 something women are all lying” also, “those 20 something women are all lying”. 16 minutes ago, BooyaCS09 said: Also the RAINN stats are completely misleading. It is a viral graphic sent to show shock value that doesn't hold up to scrutiny. [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2014/12/09/the-truth-about-a-viral-graphic-on-rape-statistics/[/url] paywalled 16 minutes ago, BooyaCS09 said: Also, to be clear, I am not saying he didn't do something. If he did I want to see the evidence. Show me where he is guilty and this "unreported' (they are unreported and extrapolated stats from a sample size. The true numbers can be higher or lower). numbers are accurate and not just regret after consenting a few weeks later. You’re back to evidence in situations that rarely produce concrete evidence. Which is why many don’t get indicted. And why less get convicted. And why many women don’t even bother reporting. 16 minutes ago, BooyaCS09 said: Also you didn't answer the question is he guilty and should he be "unemployable" based on nothing more than accusations? Me? When 20 something women all tell different versions of the same story, I tend to believe them. I also apply it universally and don’t put blinders on to people I root for because they’re on “my team”. So if I think he’s a sexual predator, I’m guessing you can figure out the second part of that question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Just now, ditchdigger said: Toughness is TBD. Might not play with one arm, though. this is true. Just now, ditchdigger said: Smart was evident when he hired Rusty Hardin. You son of a gun. Just now, ditchdigger said: Playing devil's advocate here, but is there a greater measure of accountability than the justice system? InB4 this goes straight over some folks heads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawgdish Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, JDD said: My biggest issue with this trade is that it doesn't make sense for what this FO has preached. I guess they wanted him bad enough and went and got their guy and overlooked the issue with his personal stuff. True. Tough - yes. Smart - in a football sense, certainly. In a 'think with your big head, not your little one' sense, not so much. Accountable - ummm.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawgdish Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 33 minutes ago, ditchdigger said: Playing devil's advocate here, but is there a greater measure of accountability than the justice system? In theory, no; in practice it depends on how rich and privileged you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 hour ago, BooyaCS09 said: [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2014/12/09/the-truth-about-a-viral-graphic-on-rape-statistics/[/url] Did you actually read the article that you linked to? Because that article is talking about a completely different graphic with incorrect information, and while debunking that other graphic, they verify everything in that RAINN graphic. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioG Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 On 3/18/2022 at 11:41 PM, NateDawg said: I’m not going to rob them of being a Browns fan Are you sure you love your children? 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke2056 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 5 hours ago, OhioG said: Are you sure you love your children? Ummmmm, what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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