Commanders Mini-Camp

[turtle28]

11 hours ago, DCNative said:

I don't want a answer from you. I'd like @Thaiphoon to answer my question. 

 

 

😂 

[turtle28]

 

[Thaiphoon]

12 hours ago, Slappy Mc said:

https://commanderswire.usatoday.com/2022/01/11/brandon-scherff-reiterates-desire-to-finish-career-in-washington-football-team-free-agency/

Scherff always wanted to be here.

 

And yet, he left the first chance he got. After being offered a ton of $ to stay. 

 

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2022/02/washington-offered-brandon-scherff-top-guard-salary-sides-likely-to-part-ways#:~:text=Washington did try to lock,2021 season on the tag.

 

Quote

Washington did try to lock down Scherff last year, however, with Keim adding the team made the veteran blocker an offer to become the league’s highest-paid guard. Scherff instead opted to play the 2021 season on the tag. Particulars of Washington’s proposal are not known, only that the deal would have pushed Scherff past Joe Thuney‘s $16MM-AAV guard pact. Thuney and Joel Bitonio are the NFL’s highest-paid guards, each earning $16MM on average. Scherff can expect to top that in free agency, with the salary cap set to return after its COVID-19-induced reduction.

Seems like being the highest paid Guard in the league wasn't enough to keep him on a team he always wanted to return to. He knew he could possibly get even more $$ in FA. And took it. 

And in fact, he signed with the Jaguars for 3 years/ $49.5m ($30m guaranteed). Which is not much different than our offer of more than $16m AAV.

So no, he wasn't coming back. 

Now, I don't blame him for going the FA route. Just like I don't blame Cousins for it either. This is a business. But I'm simply saying that it's refreshing that we have a player who actually wants to be here.

[Thaiphoon]

13 hours ago, DCNative said:

Now with that being said, if they don't want him. Why aren't they trading him now? Or why would they do the same thing they did with Cousins and Schreff? As you stated he's saying he wants to  be here. No one knows what type of deal he would accept at this point. So no one can say this is about money. 

Because the Front Office is stupid. And has stupidly tanked his trade value. And with letting Ioannidas and Settle go, they need Payne to play this year. 

If they are going to trade him during the 2022 season, the best time to get good value for him is to wait until the year starts and then if a playoff hopeful team has a DT go down, they trade him then. Right now, if I'm another team, I'm not offering more than a 5th.

[turtle28]

11 minutes ago, Thaiphoon said:

I don't blame him for going the FA route. Just like I don't blame Cousins for it either. This is a business. But I'm simply saying that it's refreshing that we have a player who actually wants to be here.

I’m guessing the player you’re talking about is Payne & how he wants to be here. I had never thought about that angle before and it is refreshing that he wants to be here. That being said I’m not changing my stance they paying two DTs near or more than $20 mil per year is not wide allocation of their salary cap space.

[Thaiphoon]

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

I’m guessing the player you’re talking about is Payne & how he wants to be here. I had never thought about that angle before and it is refreshing that he wants to be here. That being said I’m not changing my stance they paying two DTs near or more than $20 mil per year is not wide allocation of their salary cap space.

Oh I agree with you. I'm not paying two DT's $20m AAV each. That's not good cap management. I'm just saying it's nice that a player has shown how much he wants to be here.

[RSkinGM]

18 minutes ago, Thaiphoon said:

Oh I agree with you. I'm not paying two DT's $20m AAV each. That's not good cap management. I'm just saying it's nice that a player has shown how much he wants to be here.

In thay case, tell his agent to look for a trade and end the drama .

[MKnight82]

2 hours ago, Thaiphoon said:

Because the Front Office is stupid. And has stupidly tanked his trade value. And with letting Ioannidas and Settle go, they need Payne to play this year. 

If they are going to trade him during the 2022 season, the best time to get good value for him is to wait until the year starts and then if a playoff hopeful team has a DT go down, they trade him then. Right now, if I'm another team, I'm not offering more than a 5th.

I'd like to see you provide a single historic comparable trade of a similar player to Payne getting a large compensation via trade. Teams don't trade for run stuffers on expiring deals.  Nothing they have done has impacted his trade value, because he never had any trade value. Getting another season of play out of him and then possibly recouping whatever comp pick from him leaving isn't stupid, its actually the best strategy they could of had with him. This isn't the same situation as Cousins and Scherff. Those players had actual value.  

[RSkinGM]

15 minutes ago, MKnight82 said:

I'd like to see you provide a single historic comparable trade of a similar player to Payne getting a large compensation via trade. Teams don't trade for run stuffers on expiring deals.  Nothing they have done has impacted his trade value, because he never had any trade value. Getting another season of play out of him and then possibly recouping whatever comp pick from him leaving isn't stupid, its actually the best strategy they could of had with him. This isn't the same situation as Cousins and Scherff. Those players had actual value.  

A bit harsh of an assessment . He had the most by far QB hits in his career ( 15 ) Previous best was 8 . He had 4.5 sacks , 61 tackles with 35 solo and 6 for a loss.  Pretty good stats . Guess I'd have to do too much research for comp players but he had a good year. 

With that said, J Allen doubled his production in hits/ sacks so he's NOT in that category .

[turtle28]

3 hours ago, Thaiphoon said:

Because the Front Office is stupid. And has stupidly tanked his trade value. And with letting Ioannidas and Settle go, they need Payne to play this year. 

If they are going to trade him during the 2022 season, the best time to get good value for him is to wait until the year starts and then if a playoff hopeful team has a DT go down, they trade him then. Right now, if I'm another team, I'm not offering more than a 5th.

Sheehan said they shopped Payne this off-season, they must not have liked the offers they got back in return bc they chose not to move him.

[Thaiphoon]

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

Sheehan said they shopped Payne this off-season, they must not have liked the offers they got back in return bc they chose not to move him.

I know Turtle. I heard his program and you've posted this multiple times. My point is that whatever value he might have had got tanked even more after we didn't pick up his 5th year. Then you had Matt and Tim leaving and they drafted Mathis. Which kinda forces us to keep him unless a team tries to give us an outrageous deal. Which no team will.

[Thaiphoon]

1 hour ago, MKnight82 said:

I'd like to see you provide a single historic comparable trade of a similar player to Payne getting a large compensation via trade. Teams don't trade for run stuffers on expiring deals.  Nothing they have done has impacted his trade value, because he never had any trade value. Getting another season of play out of him and then possibly recouping whatever comp pick from him leaving isn't stupid, its actually the best strategy they could of had with him. This isn't the same situation as Cousins and Scherff. Those players had actual value.  

A) If you want to do the research, have at it. 

B) Payne has value. How much is the big question. The biggest blow to his value came when we didn't pick up his option.  

C) The question put to me is why aren't they trading him now (the compensation - little or a lot - wasn't placed as part of the question put to me). When we let Matt and Tim go and draft his replacement while also not picking up his 5th year, that kinda forces us to keep him unless we get an awesome trade offer. Hence, we boxed ourselves into having to keep him IMHO. 

D) It's the best strategy we have now, yes. Which is why I pointed out that if we still wanted to trade him now is not the time to try to do it. You play him and then if anyone needs a DT in mid-season and are willing to pony up for him (and give him a new deal most likely) that is when you trade him. But as soon as we declined to pick up his 5th year, it was pretty much a done deal.

[Thaiphoon]

2 hours ago, RSkinGM said:

In thay case, tell his agent to look for a trade and end the drama .

Problem is that this advice is about a year too late. He's on the last year of his contract after we declined to pick up the 5th year. If his agent tries to look for a trade, after FA and the draft have happened, we'd get peanuts for him. All of that put together means we need to keep him on the roster and play him this year.

[RSkinGM]

Any of this go back to the blow up between Allen and Payne? Maybe Allen blamed Payne for giving up the 4th down run for a TD. Payne poiked his finger against Allen's head and Alen retaliated with that big swing .

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, RSkinGM said:

Any of this go back to the blow up between Allen and Payne? Maybe Allen blamed Payne for giving up the 4th down run for a TD. Payne poked his finger against Allen's head and Alen retaliated with that big swing .

Well the play/game/argument was an isolated incident. As they both said, brothers fight sometimes & they’re brothers. I do think it was Payne’s fault on the play & Allen let him know.

It wouldn’t shock me though if Payne is jealous that Allen got paid but, that was always going to happen bc Allen was the first up of the 4 first round DL so if it’s jealously then it’s ridiculous. 
 

I do think that Payne isn’t happy that he hasn’t gotten a new deal and he probably doesn’t want to do the franchise dance like Scherff had to. He seems mad, he put the hashtag out of #mosthated for a reason bc currently he feels like he’s the one who’s being hated or not getting the respect the most of anyone on the team from the front office.

Payne’s grope seems mostly with knowing he won’t be re-signed here/given an Allen type deal by the franchise and, he probably would rather be traded & get a new deal from another team than have to play this year on what essentially is the first of  franchise tags for first round draft picks (the 5th year option) but, it’s obvious the team isn’t going to just trade him away for nothing and they shouldn’t.

Like Thai said, they should wait to see if an injury happens to a Super Bowl contender team and then see if that team wants to trade for him either in August or before rtg trade deadline. 

Edited May 27, 2022 by turtle28