Cwood is a nerd and so are all the Packer Favorite Prospects: 2023 Draft Discussion Thread

[Rainmaker90]

43 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

It is ridiculously high for Hyatt.  Only two guys at WR for that pick.  JSN and QJ.

Every draft sim I run, Washington is there in the second, along with a few other good TE's.  When I take Washington (as I should), it gives me a C+ score.  Like that is too high for Washington.

I don't care about the score, I care about the fit to GB and that pick looks like a good pick to take a TE or EDGE.

I’m 100% in on Hyatt. I think people get too hung up on being an all around route runner or whatever . The guy knows how to beat a defense. He doesn’t need to be good at everything. 
 

I think Washington is the best TE fit for us 

[R T]

13 minutes ago, Mr. Fussnputz said:

This is sports. It's supposed to be fun. There are plenty of things to be serious about, cancer, war, poverty. To me, sports is a place to go to escape all that and have some fun. I joke a round a lot on here. You may want to skip over my posts.

Fans endless bitching about trivial **** isn't fun. You may want to skip over my post. 

[Mr Bad Example]

6 hours ago, vegas492 said:

I gotta go back to 2016 to find a passable player for GB in the third round and that is Fackrell.

After him?  Montravious Adams, Oren Burks, Jace Sternberger, Deguara, Amari Rodgers, Rhyan.

Okay, maybe Deguara is a passable player as well.

Once Amari Rodgers got out of GB he started producing....either he just needed opportunity, he was too far into in his own head here, or the Texans are a mess and anyone would look good in that desperate situation.

[MrBobGray]

Not sure I understand the general desire for JSN on this squad.  He's a solid prospect, but there are people talking about being willing to trade up for him which is crazy to me.  I would have a hard time taking him in the 1st at any slot (again, assuming we're specifically talking this Packers team, not as a general prospect).  Doesn't have the size to be a movement blocker, doesn't have the speed to threaten deep, not sure I believe he has the ability to shake his man at the line on the perimeter consistently.  Packers want to run a lot of 12/21 personnel and for a guy who projects best as a slot (at the very least as he's learning the pro game) where do you put him?  Do you really want to spend a 1st round pick on a 20% improvement over Romeo Doubs? 

Now if you're talking somebody like the Rams who run 11 personnel to an almost fanatical level, sure, he'd be a great pick-up.  Just don't really get where people see him fitting in here.

[Leader]

42 minutes ago, MrBobGray said:

Not sure I understand the general desire for JSN on this squad.  He's a solid prospect, but there are people talking about being willing to trade up for him which is crazy to me.  I would have a hard time taking him in the 1st at any slot (again, assuming we're specifically talking this Packers team, not as a general prospect).  Doesn't have the size to be a movement blocker, doesn't have the speed to threaten deep, not sure I believe he has the ability to shake his man at the line on the perimeter consistently.  Packers want to run a lot of 12/21 personnel and for a guy who projects best as a slot (at the very least as he's learning the pro game) where do you put him?  Do you really want to spend a 1st round pick on a 20% improvement over Romeo Doubs? 

Now if you're talking somebody like the Rams who run 11 personnel to an almost fanatical level, sure, he'd be a great pick-up.  Just don't really get where people see him fitting in here.

Blame @packfanfb - he's been the one pushing JSN on everybody

[packfanfb]

1 minute ago, Leader said:

Blame @packfanfb - he's been the one pushing JSN on everybody

Don't have the 2022 numbers on me but the Packers ran 11 personnel 61% of the time in 2021. In fact, there was one team in the entire NFL who didn't run a majority of their plays from 11 personnel. Even if MLF kicks that number down a tad, it's naive to think we aren't running at least 50% in 11. 

That, coupled with the fact that JSN would easily be our No. 2, if not No. 1 WR in terms of targets (and probably receptions), even as a rookie...I really don't get the argument whatsoever for why you wouldn't love to add him to this team. But then again, our fan base has been conditioned over the years to think WRs don't matter and we can basically put anyone out there and be fine. If nothing else, I thought that narrative would disappear now that 12 is gone. 

[Leader]

2 minutes ago, packfanfb said:

Don't have the 2022 numbers on me but the Packers ran 11 personnel 61% of the time in 2021. In fact, there was one team in the entire NFL who didn't run a majority of their plays from 11 personnel. Even if MLF kicks that number down a tad, it's naive to think we aren't running at least 50% in 11. 

That, coupled with the fact that JSN would easily be our No. 2, if not No. 1 WR in terms of targets (and probably receptions), even as a rookie...I really don't get the argument whatsoever for why you wouldn't love to add him to this team. But then again, our fan base has been conditioned over the years to think WRs don't matter and we can basically put anyone out there and be fine. If nothing else, I thought that narrative would disappear now that 12 is gone. 

I was just busting on ya. T'sall good.

[packfanfb]

1 minute ago, Leader said:

I was just busting on ya. T'sall good.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I'm not trying to convince anyone about JSN. He's my "run to the podium in 5 seconds" guy but others may not see it that way. At the end of the day, I don't expect the Packers to trade up for him nor do I expect him to be there at 15. I'll be surprised if he's a Packer. 

[beekay414]

People forget that when he was healthy in 2021, on a team with Garrett Wilson and Chris Olave, JSN was the talk of the WR room. He's not a "20% improvement" on Doubs. He's a significantly more talented prospect than Doubs. 

[PackFan13]

1 hour ago, Mr Bad Example said:

Once Amari Rodgers got out of GB he started producing....either he just needed opportunity, he was too far into in his own head here, or the Texans are a mess and anyone would look good in that desperate situation.

Started producing? He averaged 2 catches for less than 30 yards in 6 games. He had a guy fall for a wide open TD. He also fumbled. He's horrible.

Edited April 5, 2023 by PackFan13

[ThatJerkDave]

1 hour ago, MrBobGray said:

Not sure I understand the general desire for JSN on this squad.  He's a solid prospect, but there are people talking about being willing to trade up for him which is crazy to me.  I would have a hard time taking him in the 1st at any slot (again, assuming we're specifically talking this Packers team, not as a general prospect).  Doesn't have the size to be a movement blocker, doesn't have the speed to threaten deep, not sure I believe he has the ability to shake his man at the line on the perimeter consistently.  Packers want to run a lot of 12/21 personnel and for a guy who projects best as a slot (at the very least as he's learning the pro game) where do you put him?  Do you really want to spend a 1st round pick on a 20% improvement over Romeo Doubs? 

Now if you're talking somebody like the Rams who run 11 personnel to an almost fanatical level, sure, he'd be a great pick-up.  Just don't really get where people see him fitting in here.

Fair points.  I see him being Greg Jennings.  Jennings was a very, very good player for us for a long time.  And if we had a re-draft, he would have definitely gone in the first round that year.  I will even go as far as to say, if Michigan hadn't pulled his scholarship in favor of Manningham, he would have gone in the first round.  I think that would be a great add to our team.  

Now trading up is not what I would do in this draft.  Not in the first, and not for a receiver.  But I think you are underselling JSN as much as Krause seems to be overselling him.

[MrBobGray]

6 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

People forget that when he was healthy in 2021, on a team with Garrett Wilson and Chris Olave, JSN was the talk of the WR room. He's not a "20% improvement" on Doubs. He's a significantly more talented prospect than Doubs. 

I disagree he's a significantly more talented prospect than Doubs; a more consistent one maybe.  Playing the slot when you have two future 1st round picks on the boundary is going to open up the field in a way he'll likely never see again.  If you put Doubs on that same team instead of JSN, I personally don't think his production would have been that different.

That being said, my comment on a 20% improvement over Doubs was more about the next two seasons.  Doubs is a similar style of player who will be in year 2 next year and played four years in college; JSN will be a rookie with one year of significant experience in college.  I don't see rookie JSN as likely to provide a big boost over Doubs until that experience difference is equalized.  Doubs is on a dirt cheap contract for the next three years; does it really make sense to spend a 1st and a decent sized contract on a guy if he's only a little better for most of that cheap contract? 

[MrBobGray]

11 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said:

Fair points.  I see him being Greg Jennings.  Jennings was a very, very good player for us for a long time.  And if we had a re-draft, he would have definitely gone in the first round that year.  I will even go as far as to say, if Michigan hadn't pulled his scholarship in favor of Manningham, he would have gone in the first round.  I think that would be a great add to our team.  

Now trading up is not what I would do in this draft.  Not in the first, and not for a receiver.  But I think you are underselling JSN as much as Krause seems to be overselling him.

See the difference to me is that Jennings had true deep speed; JSN ran a 4.52 at his pro day, while Jennings ran 4.46 at the combine.  Jennings definitely played closer to 4.4 than he did to 4.5, with the big play resume to prove it.  JSN looks and plays like a guy who runs a pretty legitimate 4.5.  Nothing about JSN's tape looks to me like a guy who has the ability to separate from boundary coverage in the NFL the way greg could. 

Greg also played four years in college and had three straight seasons with 1000+ yards, 10+ TDs, so he was both experienced and very polished in his game.  JSN is very technically sound, but he just hasn't played that much football above the high school level.  I mean the guy had 110 catches in his entire college career, which was only 23 games in total. 

I just think people get caught up in that five game stretch to end 2021 and aren't looking at the whole picture with him.  I mean just imagine he's the same player but you remove that Rose Bowl game from the resume; what about that guy would excite you?  The one year of starting experience?  The solid but unspectacular measurables?  The six career 100+ yard games?  The 7 career TDs in college?

 

Edited April 5, 2023 by MrBobGray

[MantyWrestler]

19 minutes ago, PackFan13 said:

Started producing? He averaged 2 catches for less than 30 yards in 6 games. He had a guy fall for a wide open TD. He also fumbled. He's horrible.

PackFan13… that was posted by “Mr Bad Example” lol

[incognito_man]

4 minutes ago, MrBobGray said:

See the difference to me is that Jennings had true deep speed; JSN ran a 4.52 at his pro day, while Jennings ran 4.46 at the combine.  Jennings definitely played closer to 4.4 than he did to 4.5, with the big play resume to prove it.  JSN looks and plays like a guy who runs a pretty legitimate 4.5.  Nothing about JSN's tape looks to me like a guy who has the ability to separate from boundary coverage in the NFL the way greg could. 

Greg also played four years in college and had three straight seasons with 1000+ yards, 10+ TDs, so he was both experienced and very polished in his game.  JSN is very technically sound, but he just hasn't played that much football above the high school level.  I mean the guy had 110 catches in his entire college career, which was only 23 games in total. 

I just think people get caught up in that five game stretch to end 2021 and aren't looking at the whole picture with him.  I mean just imagine he's the same player but you remove that Rose Bowl game from the resume; what about that guy would excite you?  The one year of starting experience?  The solid but unspectacular measurables?  The six career 100+ yard games?  The 7 career TDs in college?

 

I view WR as mayyybe we consider Quentin Johnston at 15 if the board falls badly, but otherwise it looks like a day 3 position to address in this draft.

I don't think JSN has a ceiling where you are excited about using a top 15 pick on him.