SteelKing728 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 53 minutes ago, vikingsrule said: What was KOC expecting with the Donatell hire? He had to know his scheme wasn’t known for being particularly aggressive. Obviously the current defense isn’t sustainable, doubt a change is made in season but it absolutely has to be on the table if KOC is calling out his DC for lack of aggression. And his pressure packages aren’t even getting the job done. Would think we’d get more from the pass rush with a duo of Hunter and Smith. I just hope KOC doesn't feel like he's tied to the guy and keeps him for next season for continuity's sake. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, vikingsrule said: What was KOC expecting with the Donatell hire? He had to know his scheme wasn’t known for being particularly aggressive. Obviously the current defense isn’t sustainable, doubt a change is made in season but it absolutely has to be on the table if KOC is calling out his DC for lack of aggression. And his pressure packages aren’t even getting the job done. Would think we’d get more from the pass rush with a duo of Hunter and Smith. Donatell has never had a defense this bad. Last year in Denver they were 8th in yards allowed and 3rd in points allowed. In a division with the Chiefs and Chargers and an anemic offense. im fine with a change if they decide to go that way, but let’s not pretend that the Fangio/Donatell scheme hasn’t been very successful around the league. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingsrule Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 34 minutes ago, JDBrocks said: Donatell has never had a defense this bad. Last year in Denver they were 8th in yards allowed and 3rd in points allowed. In a division with the Chiefs and Chargers and an anemic offense. im fine with a change if they decide to go that way, but let’s not pretend that the Fangio/Donatell scheme hasn’t been very successful around the league. Not talking about the success of the defense but the philosophy. Seems you must have an elite DL and edge players to make the defense work from the standpoint of not regularly bringing extra pass rushers. We don’t have the DL and the edge players simply aren’t getting it done by themselves. At least with Zimmer’s defense, there was the threat of bringing pressure or disguising where it’s coming from. Just not seeing it with this kind of defense. And again, KOC had to know what the expectations are with a Fangio/Donatell defense. Think KOC is realizing that the talent level isn’t there to make it work, hence KOC’s desire to be more aggressive, which is contrary to the DC’s approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 7 minutes ago, vikingsrule said: Not talking about the success of the defense but the philosophy. Seems you must have an elite DL and edge players to make the defense work from the standpoint of not regularly bringing extra pass rushers. We don’t have the DL and the edge players simply aren’t getting it done by themselves. At least with Zimmer’s defense, there was the threat of bringing pressure or disguising where it’s coming from. Just not seeing it with this kind of defense. And again, KOC had to know what the expectations are with a Fangio/Donatell defense. Think KOC is realizing that the talent level isn’t there to make it work, hence KOC’s desire to be more aggressive, which is contrary to the DC’s approach. Right! I agree that the DL doesn’t have the personnel right now, and I don’t think that they thought they would be in this position earlier this season. The scheme has produced some of the best defenses in the league in recent memory, the Vikings just don’t have the horses to run it effectively right now. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Relax Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 9 hours ago, JDBrocks said: Donatell has never had a defense this bad. Last year in Denver they were 8th in yards allowed and 3rd in points allowed. In a division with the Chiefs and Chargers and an anemic offense. im fine with a change if they decide to go that way, but let’s not pretend that the Fangio/Donatell scheme hasn’t been very successful around the league. I'd be fine with the scheme if the Vikings had the players to execute it. Except for Z Smith, no one has had much experience in a 3-4 defense, much less the Fangio/Donatel scheme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vike daddy Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Cook's fumble prior to Mundt streaking open in to the endzone a few yards away... Hock's drop on 3rd down... Detroit's fake punt rush for 40+ yards.... situational football. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 5 hours ago, Captain Relax said: I'd be fine with the scheme if the Vikings had the players to execute it. Except for Z Smith, no one has had much experience in a 3-4 defense, much less the Fangio/Donatel scheme. We don’t have the players to run an effective 4-3, either. 2020 and 2021 showed that. The transition to the 3-4 was never going to be a one year fix. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swede700 Posted December 12, 2022 Author Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 13 minutes ago, SemperFeist said: We don’t have the players to run an effective 4-3, either. 2020 and 2021 showed that. The transition to the 3-4 was never going to be a one year fix. It's all Mike Hughes' fault. (Not being serious) His failure to develop into a quality starter CB led to the pick of the late Jeff Gladney (what a tragic turn he took). In combination with the loss of Marcus Epps on the waiver wire, it's led to a turnstile in the secondary outside of Harrison Smith. And then on top of that, the inability to develop anyone on the DL into solid rotational players (most notably the failures of Jalyn Holmes and Jaleel Johnson) has led to this. They hopefully will finally be able to do with Wonnum, Lynch and Jones (and maybe Esezi eventually), but those lost drafts defensively from 2017-2019 put them in this position. Edited December 12, 2022 by swede700 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikeManDan Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 19 hours ago, Morlee said: Who would you feel better about facing, potentially? The Bucs or the Lions? We can't play TB in the wildcard, or whoever wins the NFCS, since they're a division leader. Our most likely opponents, are going to be the ; Commanders, Giants, Seahawks, or Lions. All of these teams are fighting for the 6 and 7 seeds. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikeManDan Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 I can't say that I'm surprised we lost, Lions are an absolute buzz saw right now. Defense was absolutely atrocious but the offense needs to find a way to put up more than 23 points against the now 31st ranked defense. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Cousins’ throw to Osborn for the touchdown isn’t going to be talked about nearly enough. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Totally makes sense that Cousins would have his best and most complete game of the season in a losing effort. The reason they lost (outside of the defense) is that they took the ball out of his hands at the goal line. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingsrule Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 minute ago, JDBrocks said: Totally makes sense that Cousins would have his best and most complete game of the season in a losing effort. The reason they lost (outside of the defense) is that they took the ball out of his hands at the goal line. Thought we were getting away from the grind it out approach when we fired Zimmer. Baffles me that we ran Cook so much when it clearly wasn’t there and getting chunks through the air was working. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 minute ago, JDBrocks said: The reason they lost (outside of the defense) is that they took the ball out of his hands at the goal line. On what was gonna be a pass, no less. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Just now, vikingsrule said: Thought we were getting away from the grind it out approach when we fired Zimmer. Baffles me that we ran Cook so much when it clearly wasn’t there and getting chunks through the air was working. They had to do it to slow down the blitz. they were working the OL up the middle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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