Ravens place tag on QB Lamar Jackson; Jackson requests trade (Page 52)

[ramssuperbowl99]

5 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Because Baker has a good marketing agent. His contract agent, who knows, probably still a good agent since Baker's still getting so many opportunities.

Are these not the same thing? Or at least in the same shop?

My understanding was you get one agent and they would handle marketing, contract, a publicist, a social media person, etc. (maybe not directly, but it's all at the same company).

[MWil23]

7 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Because Baker has a good marketing agent. His contract agent, who knows, probably still a good agent since Baker's still getting so many opportunities.

Yeah that was my point, I just didn’t do a good job explaining it 😂 

[seminoles1]

1 hour ago, ET80 said:

Even outside of the legal situation, there are facets of the Watson situation that created the deal he received:

1. Watson had a no-trade clause in his deal, so any team that wanted his services needed to meet his needs. He would reject any offer if it didn’t meet his financial needs.

2. The Texans leveraged that NTC to create a market of a few teams (Atlanta, New Orleans, Carolina, Cleveland) who had to court Watson as a pseudo FA; Remember, Watson originally eliminated Cleveland as a destination and was originally leaning towards Atlanta and New Orleans, which is what prompted Cleveland to come in with its mega deal.

Lamar Jackson doesn’t have those two things working in his favor - and I highly doubt anyone is going to give out NTCs anymore following this whole debacle.

Is that different than Jackson's situation? I mean, a team needs to meet Jackson's needs for him to sign like #1 and he's in pseudo-free agency just like #2.

Jackson just isn't as sought after as Watson, which is wild to me.

[ET80]

2 minutes ago, seminoles1 said:

Is that different than Jackson's situation? I mean, a team needs to meet Jackson's needs for him to sign like #1 and he's in pseudo-free agency just like #2.

I guess the difference here is the Texans we’re motivated sellers in all of this, too. Ravens really don’t seem to mind one way or another. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

12 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

If you’re smart enough to pull a Gronk/Burrow/Greg Oden and live only off of advertising money while putting away your contract, that’s plenty for most.

Not having that revenue stream or branding is something else. Look at MJ. Off the top of my head:

Sneakers

McDonalds

Gatorade

Rayovak Batteries

Hot dogs

Movie(s)

Hanes underwear

…and I feel like I’m missing a few obvious ones.

My overall point was that Baker is still doing commercials and getting that additional revenue because he has a good agent working to get him those deals. Lamar isn't doing any of that, which is just bizarre for someone of his notoriety.

12 minutes ago, ramssuperbowl99 said:

Are these not the same thing? Or at least in the same shop?

My understanding was you get one agent and they would handle marketing, contract, a publicist, a social media person, etc. (maybe not directly, but it's all at the same company).

Nope, at least from my experience talking to my GF who works with marketing agents for virtually every major NFL player. The marketing guys just control endorsements, appearances, commercials, etc. etc. while the contract guys handle...well contracts. Completely different buckets from what I understand. It might be the same company (although from what I've gathered, it's not) but definitely different agents. 

Or maybe it differs from player to player, but I know for certain that one of the players she's really tight with specifically has a marketing agent and contract agency and they're totally separate. Same with Baker, who she's worked with as well.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

8 minutes ago, ET80 said:

I guess the difference here is the Texans we’re motivated sellers in all of this, too. Ravens really don’t seem to mind one way or another. 

The Ravens have been adamant about wanting to keep Lamar a Raven, actually. Whether or not that's just PR speak, who knows. I imagine they're not exactly thrilled about the idea of starting over trying to find a franchise QB when they've invested so much in Lamar and made him the face of the franchise.

[MWil23]

4 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

The Ravens have been adamant about wanting to keep Lamar a Raven, actually. Whether or not that's just PR speak, who knows. I imagine they're not exactly thrilled about the idea of starting over trying to find a franchise QB when they've invested so much in Lamar and made him the face of the franchise.

What they’re doing is both 100% the right move and will likely 100% drive him away after this year because of how stubborn he is and how hurt his pride will be/he will be. Just my opinion.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

5 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

What they’re doing is both 100% the right move and will likely 100% drive him away after this year because of how stubborn he is and how hurt his pride will be/he will be. Just my opinion.

idk if it was me I'd still rather play for Baltimore where at least they want me vs. the other 31 teams that had a chance to come get me and chose to sign guys like Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold instead.

But that's just me. You're probably right that Lamar is scorned specifically by the Ravens for some reason and would rather go play elsewhere after this year.

[Ray Reed]

13 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

What they’re doing is both 100% the right move and will likely 100% drive him away after this year because of how stubborn he is and how hurt his pride will be/he will be. Just my opinion.

[BobbyPhil1781]

1 hour ago, ET80 said:

I mean… we just saw Tunsil negotiate a rather large deal, so it’s not IMPOSSIBLE. But - much like Watson - Tunsil had unique market factors (in this case, the stupidity that is Bill O’Brien) that worked in his favor. Tunsil’s first extension was with YOLO BoB, who had already given up a Watson-like haul for Tunsil. Extending him to that deal was a requirement because letting him walk after giving up two entire drafts would have been borderline negligent.

TL;DR - Negotiate against a desperate moron for best results.

Oh sure, it's definitely possible but not the best road to take IMO. Like you said, it requires the right situation that he wasn't in. He's shooting himself in the foot here. If he has another off year this season, or gets hurt and misses a decent amount of time, it's only going to get more difficult for him.

[AngusMcFife]

1 hour ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

https://stathead.com/football/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1=JackLa00&p1yrfrom=2021&player_id2=JackLa00&p2yrfrom=2022

I wouldn't really call it a "bounce back" season when it is extremely comparable to his 2021 season and there's simply no way you can say it was "better" on the whole.

I think I can say it's better. Lamar's 2022 passing stats are slightly better, and his 2022 rushing stats are much better. A full 1 yard/carry more.  

If you combine passing and rushing DYAR, the 2022 play is more than 2x as valuable as 2021:
2021: 282
2022: 592

His passing and rushing DVOA in 2021 were both below league average (-2.9% and -2%), while his passing in 2022 is above average (5.5%) and his rushing is elite (27.8%).  

But if you are arguing that the 2022 is about the same as 2021, then he still isn't regressing for 3 straight years. It would be regressing for 2 years and plateauing. 

[ronjon1990]

26 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

idk if it was me I'd still rather play for Baltimore where at least they want me vs. the other 31 teams that had a chance to come get me and chose to sign guys like Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold instead.

But that's just me. You're probably right that Lamar is scorned specifically by the Ravens for some reason and would rather go play elsewhere after this year.

In Baltimore, he has arguably his best shot. 

The team wants him, just not at his asking price. 

The offense has been tailored to him and they seem willing to commit to him long term despite his flaws. 

The fanbase largely likes him. 

With a healthy season and some tweaks here and there, Baltimore is a consistent contender and will likely remain so as time goes on. 

 

Does he not realize he's not getting what he's asking for and leaving would just wind up putting him in a situation where his shortcomings as a QB are probably even more highlighted with a fanbase that would quickly sour on him for not being a savior for a franchise that probably went and got him so they could hope to become competitive in the first place? He can't lack that much awareness, can he? 

[NYRaider]

1 hour ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

 

This guy has cost himself so many hundreds of millions by being stubborn/stupid it's actually insane. Even Mike Trout did Subway commercials.

Now I know why he's so committed to $250M fully GTD. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

7 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Now I know why he's so committed to $250M fully GTD. 

 

[NJerseypaint]

1 hour ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

My overall point was that Baker is still doing commercials and getting that additional revenue because he has a good agent working to get him those deals. Lamar isn't doing any of that, which is just bizarre for someone of his notoriety.

He has to be the only MVP in the last decade not doing national commercials. Someone needs to sit him down and explain to him how top athletes actually earn money and keeping earning it after they retire.