Mastercheddaar Posted February 14, 2018 Share Posted February 14, 2018 17 hours ago, MWil23 said: I'm trying to figure out how to tell you thanks for your time but this is literally hilariously awful in all three situations. Truly horrible. OR Chase you out of here for blatantly trolling Lulz... Be nice. He is new to the boards. I kind of like Josey Jewell in the 4th. That is all Mastercheddaar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztec Hammer Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 Quenton Nelson is an incredible prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reginaldm9 Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 I have no clue as to why I feel this way, but I'm like 100% certain that if we don't pick up a FS in FA, we'll draft Justin Reid in the early second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 23 hours ago, Mastercheddaar said: Lulz... Be nice. He is new to the boards. I kind of like Josey Jewell in the 4th. That is all Mastercheddaar That would be a great idea, I like him. I would like any of these guys in the 4th Mike McCray Jack Cichy Tegray Scales Shaun Dion-Hamilton Nick Deluca 1 hour ago, Aztec Hammer said: Quenton Nelson is an incredible prospect. It always seems like my favorite prospects always go to teams other than mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 On 2/14/2018 at 2:19 AM, Aztec Hammer said: That's a very good point Kiwi. One I definitely agree with in general. You have to be careful not to mistake fantastic open field ability for an elite NFL RB. You are spot on in that regard. Where I personally differ is I don't think Barkley is in that McCaffrey/Bush category. They are/were 200lbs soaking wet whereas Barkley is in that wheelhouse athletically but supposedly 30lbs heavier. I think you have a valid argument though as one thing that does concern me a bit about Barkley is he doesn't always play with a ton of power. Earlier in the season I expressed the same concern as you about him being bottled up for no gains and then busting the big one to sort his ypc out. Generally I also don't like that because whilst it shows he can make the big play, it also can contribute to a lot of 3rd and longs. Watching him more though, I do lean towards him being a gamechanging, complete back rather than the glorified slot WR type. reading this little break down was interesting. See his tweet thread on this, so you can see where he compares over the past couple seasons. If I was on my computer I would post them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztec Hammer Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 The Bills are supposedly enamoured with Josh Rosen. I personally don't see how they get it done. The Giants seem like a good fit for him at 2. The Colts pick is really shaping up to be the swing pick. 1. Cleveland - Sam Darnold 2. NYG - Josh Rosen 3. Indy - ? If Indy take Saquon, that puts us in prime position to trade that 4th pick for the QB haul to a team needing to jump the Broncos and Jets. If Indy trade the pick for the QB haul themselves, Saquon is there for us. If Indy take Chubb, we have the option of taking Saquon or leveraging the 4th pick to drop back a touch and still get Saquon/Minkah/whoever your top guy is. If the draft falls as it should early on, we are in a really strong position of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappa13004 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 On 13/02/2018 at 11:45 PM, MWil23 said: I could at least live with that scenario. Could live with ? Cousins + Barkley + Chubb + Oliver + Kirk + change Harrison for an OT (Crosby for ex) and i think it would be a great off-season ! Great does not mean perfect. Cousins isn't Rodgers but good enough. Barkley isn't perfect, too much lateral runs looking for a big play and no gain ! But can make big plays inside and outside and can catch. Chubb is not Garrett (lol) and no Bosa but can rush the passer and defend the run. I prefer Chubb to Fitzpatrick or any player available at this point. A rotation Chubb/Ogbah would be great opposite of Myles, especially if the three young guys inside confirm promises showed last year next to Shelton. Oliver looks like to me a fairly good CB and we talk about a 2nd round pick so there is value for him there. I like Kirk but he is not the WR i'd covet for the team as id prefer a bigger one to play outside, not a slot's one but okay, end of the 2nd i would not be mad. Harrison is a good safety but top of the second take an OT and id be really fine with these moves. Just an opinion. And a question : Who would like at #4 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Browns Sign: QB Kirk Cousins WR Jarvis Landry Browns Trade: #1 to the Jets for #6, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 2019 3rd. #4 to the Bills for #21, #22, 5th, 2019 5th. #6, 3rd to the Cardinals for #15, CB Patrick Peterson #21, 2nd, 2nd to the Redskins for #13. NFL DRAFT: 1-Jets-Rosen QB 2-Giants-Barkley RB 3-Broncos-trade up 4 Darnold QB 4-Bills-Mayfield QB 5-Colts-Chubb DE 6-Cardinals-Allen QB 7-Buccaneers-Davenport DE 8-Bears-Ridley WR 9-Raiders-Edmunds LB 10-49ers-Nelson OG 11-Dolphins-Ward CB 12-Bengals-Fitzpatrick DB 13-BROWNS----DERWIN JAMES FS Florida State 14-Packers-Evans MLB 15-BROWNS-JOSH JACKSON CB IOWA 16-Ravens-Smith MLB 17-Chargers-Williams OT 18-Seahawks-McGlinchey OT 19-Cowboys-Vea NT 20-Lions-Key DE 21-Redskins-Harrison SS 22-BROWNS--LAMAR JACKSON QB LOUISVILLE Browns Draft: #13--Derwin James FS Florida State #15--Josh Jackson CB Iowa #22--Lamar Jackson QB Loisville 2nd--Brian O'Neill OT Pittsburgh 2nd--Dorance Armstrong DE Kansas 3rd--Nick Chubb RB Georgia 3rd--Jerome Baker LB Ohio State 4th--Holton Hill CB Texas 4th--Skai Moore WLB South Carolina 5th--Antonio Callaway WR Florida 5th--Jester Weah WR Pittsburgh 5th--Kalen Ballage RB Arizona State 6th--Dimitri Flowers FB Oklahoma 6th--Braxton Berrios WR Miami Fl. 7th--Matthew Thomas MLB Florida State Browns Roster: QB: Cousins/Jackson/Kizer RB: Chubb/Johnson/Ballage FB: Flowers WR: Gordon/Landry/Coleman/Weah/Callaway/Berrios TE: Njoku/DeValve/Telfer LT: Thomas/O'Neill LG: Bitonio/Martin C: Tretter/Reiter RG: Zeitler/Drango RT: Coleman/Johnson LE: Ogbah/Nassib DT: Shelton/Ogunjobi/Coley/Brantley RE: Garrett/Armstrong WLB: Kirksey/Moore MLB: Schobert/Baker/Thomas SLB: Collins/Burgess CB: Peterson/Jackson/Boddy-Calhoun/Taylor/Hill/Wilson FS: James/McCourty SS: Peppers/Kindred K: Gonzales P: Colquitt KR: James/Peppers PR: Peterson/Peppers I know this won't happen, but this roster wins 9+ games. This defense would be as good as anyone's. Not the biggest Lamar Jackson fan, but he's a worthwhile wild-card. Oh, and for our nickel package, Peppers moves to the NCB role, James goes to SS, and McCourty comes in at FS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownLeader Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 On 2/13/2018 at 2:49 PM, Mastercheddaar said: Theoretical question- I'm sick of these talking head mocks where we pick Fitzpatrick at #4. They then say he is super talented and can play any position!!!! It seem lazy to me. My question is this: If Barkley and Chubb are both gone at #4. AND no one wants to trade with us. Would Fitz be BPA at that point or who would you rather we draft someone else? Personally I cannot justify using the #4 overall pick in the draft for a player that is a safety. It would be like drafting Nelson. That is all Mastercheddaar Since there aren't any sure things, and with a 2nd top five pick, I think you just go with what you think will be a really good player regardless of positional value. Since we just paid a **** ton for an interior OL last year and have a pretty good one on the other side, Minkah would probably be both BPA and a position of need. He'd line up at FS but he could wipe out most TE's man to man. He could blanket a slot or outside guy man to man. "Just a safety" is underestimating him. On 2/13/2018 at 7:13 PM, TheeRealDeal said: Plays high and tackles even higher. He wins with raw strength right now and that will not happen in the NFL. No doubt he looks dominant and makes a ton of plays but it is how he is doing it that has me more than concerned. He obviously gets the idea of stacking and shedding but he stands far too tall and peaks into the backfield to see what is going on and then powers the lineman off of him. In the NFL when an OL gets into his chest he is going to drive him back which actually already happens far too often for Vita Vea as it is as the college level. Once he does shed the blocker and sets sights on the runner he is almost always(at least 85% of the time) tackling heads and shoulders. Again in the NFL that is going to leads to a lot of missed tackles. There is no denying that Vita Vea possess the elite traits of strength, power, size and foot quickness to be a great NFL player. It is his poor form and terrible technique that has me second guessing him as a prospect. Too often guys like him who have always relied on their own abilities too much never seem to break that trend once in the league. I do not have time to break down the film play by play for you but honestly I don't think I need too. Anyone with youtube and an unbiased opinion with see exactly what his flaws are after watching 5 minutes of him. Chris Jones, Dontari Poe, Danny Shelton would disagree. Vea doesn't always play high and undisciplined. He's shown just about everything you want to see at one time or another. He's a freak specimen. He's already got a jump on most guys because of his physical advantage. It's up to coaching to prompt to him play with better technique all the time. I'll wager heavily he's more Haloti Ngata/Dontari Poe than Broderick Bunkley/Amobi Okoye. On 2/14/2018 at 2:09 AM, Kiwibrown said: I am completely off Barkley at 4. this is due o his lack of contact balance. I really love excellent RB's. Adrian Peterson, Zeke Elliot and Todd Gurleys are worth top picks no doubt. But guys that don't finish runs, Bush, McFadden, Chris johnson and McCaffery are not worth high picks in my mind. they are great utility players, but if you can't put the team on their back they are not worth it. If they are not good in the A and B gaps and not good to enough to turn 1 yard runs into 2 yarders then they are not worth it IMO. they are basically glorified slot WR's. a stat line of runs of 1,2,2,3,4,2,1, -1 and then 40 yards that lead to a good YPC are still good for the offence IMO. you need guys that consistently get 3-4 yards. Barkley as a true freshman. If you want him to push a pile he will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheeRealDeal Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 The video showed absolutely nothing good or bad when it comes to contact balance. And pushing a pile? Barkley gains 1 entire yard after contact. If that is what gets you excited about football then maybe we should just bring back the good ole wing T. We can also draft a lumbering TE at #33 and run exclusively out of double tight and we'll shorter our splits down to foot to foot. Ricardo Louis could be the 4 back he's explosive with the ball in his hands and we wouldn't have to worry to much about running routes or catching passes anymore. Duke Johnson would be the 2 back and Saquan Barkley would be the main attraction at the 3 back. It eliminates the need for a WR and heck we could even pass on a QB at #1. Haloti Ngata and Dontari Poe are not even close to on the same level. I can very easily see Vita Vea having a Dontari Poe type career. I would agree with that 100% because Poe is extremely inconsistent. In now way to I think Vita Vea is going to bust out and I never once said he would, but he is far far from an elite prospect like some what to believe. He has clear issues that jump right off the screen. I do think he is going to have a long career in the NFL because of his off the charts effort. He will do good things in his career as well but the he is no sure fire stud prospect and in no way should we ever consider him at #4 or even in a trade down in the Top 10. I'd also seriously consider Da'Ron Payne over him if I were a team in need of a DT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 6 hours ago, BrownLeader said: Barkley as a true freshman. If you want him to push a pile he will. What are you seeing that I’m not? He picked up one additional yard after contact. I didn’t see anything there that literally every running back in the nation couldn’t do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 On 2/14/2018 at 2:09 AM, Kiwibrown said: I am completely off Barkley at 4. this is due o his lack of contact balance. I really love excellent RB's. Adrian Peterson, Zeke Elliot and Todd Gurleys are worth top picks no doubt. But guys that don't finish runs, Bush, McFadden, Chris johnson and McCaffery are not worth high picks in my mind. they are great utility players, but if you can't put the team on their back they are not worth it. If they are not good in the A and B gaps and not good to enough to turn 1 yard runs into 2 yarders then they are not worth it IMO. they are basically glorified slot WR's. a stat line of runs of 1,2,2,3,4,2,1, -1 and then 40 yards that lead to a good YPC are still good for the offence IMO. you need guys that consistently get 3-4 yards. He has a lack of contact balance? Seen him make some great plays breaking the tackles from a run play or a pass play. This past season Barkley wasn’t great running inside but that was more so because his interior offensive line was garbage. There G-C-G was complete garbage. Usually when they were able to execute a blocking scheme he lit it up. He might of never been known as a RB to finish off a run but I don’t think he was ever coached up to do that. With the speed Barkley has and how nasty his jump cut is, he always tried to make the tackler miss instead of just running them over. I posted a tweet earlier in this thread and says Barkley over the past three years had the highest miss tackle forced rate. If you are a stud at making ppl miss, why punish yourself. Heck means he has taken less true punishment and could have a longer shelf life. I also love the fact that over the past 3 years he is rated as the 2nd best Pass blocking RB at 93%. Zeke was at 94% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownLeader Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 13 hours ago, TheeRealDeal said: The video showed absolutely nothing good or bad when it comes to contact balance. And pushing a pile? Barkley gains 1 entire yard after contact. If that is what gets you excited about football then maybe we should just bring back the good ole wing T. We can also draft a lumbering TE at #33 and run exclusively out of double tight and we'll shorter our splits down to foot to foot. Ricardo Louis could be the 4 back he's explosive with the ball in his hands and we wouldn't have to worry to much about running routes or catching passes anymore. Duke Johnson would be the 2 back and Saquan Barkley would be the main attraction at the 3 back. It eliminates the need for a WR and heck we could even pass on a QB at #1. Haloti Ngata and Dontari Poe are not even close to on the same level. I can very easily see Vita Vea having a Dontari Poe type career. I would agree with that 100% because Poe is extremely inconsistent. In now way to I think Vita Vea is going to bust out and I never once said he would, but he is far far from an elite prospect like some what to believe. He has clear issues that jump right off the screen. I do think he is going to have a long career in the NFL because of his off the charts effort. He will do good things in his career as well but the he is no sure fire stud prospect and in no way should we ever consider him at #4 or even in a trade down in the Top 10. I'd also seriously consider Da'Ron Payne over him if I were a team in need of a DT. Kiwi was arguing specifically that Barkley doesn't finish his runs. He can and has. There's nothing exciting about that video, he runs over a guy in the hole and gains 1 to 2 extra yards. Agreed pretty much on Vea then. And I don't why the Browns should be considering him at all. After your critique of Vea I'm surprised you'd consider Payne over him. I think Payne is a 3 Tech rusher in the body of a 0 NT. He's not the run defender he looks like he should be and gets clobbered vs the double. If both guys played with proper technique I'm easily taking Vea first. 6 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: What are you seeing that I’m not? He picked up one additional yard after contact. I didn’t see anything there that literally every running back in the nation couldn’t do. Again...Kiwi was arguing specifically that Barkley doesn't finish his runs. He can and has. There's nothing exciting about that video, he runs over a guy in the hole and gains 1 to 2 extra yards. Barkley can run behind his pads. He just chooses to jump cut a lot and often gets too high through the hole. I think it's a coaching thing. He's shown remarkable balance and power at times, he just prefers to Barry Sanders around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Boy you guys are picky. We don't want Saquon Barkley at #4 but are going to accept Bradley Chubb or Minkah Fitzpatrick at those slots? Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 24 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said: Boy you guys are picky. We don't want Saquon Barkley at #4 but are going to accept Bradley Chubb or Minkah Fitzpatrick at those slots? Wow. Not me. I want to trade it for a boatload of picks, and maybe a player. That's the highest value of the pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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