NudeTayne Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 hour ago, Kiwibrown said: Clever. Not moral. Not clever or moral IMO. Trading for and the signing of leshaun is one of the very worst singular GM moves in NFL history. Berry sucks in every way. He's a politician. 1 hour ago, Kiwibrown said: The dumbest thing they could do is draft a Kizer, role with McCown or a Kessler. They could move off any of those guys and did not invest major draft assets so it's apples to oranges. They could have let Baker heal. They knew what they were doing letting Baker go out there every week with his shoulder falling off. 1 hour ago, Kiwibrown said: Imo they weren't wrong to move off Baker. Agree to disagree, of course. IMO Baker was the scapegoat. Stef and Berry should have been fired after that season. 1 hour ago, Kiwibrown said: He stacked some bad decisions. Not really. He played injured, which was on Stef alone to keep putting him in. He was scapegoated. Lo and behold he just had a nice season and is so believed in that he got that extension. Let me know how leshaun does. Landry and Beckham are divas. Baker never has been a me guy like them. I'd rather take the wager on the Bucs making the playoffs next year over the Browns. We'll see. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 hour ago, NudeTayne said: Not clever or moral IMO. Trading for and the signing of leshaun is one of the very worst singular GM moves in NFL history. Berry sucks in every way. He's a politician. I didn't like it at the time. Imo he was wrong in practice not theory. If he was less injury prone it would have been an OK trade. 1 hour ago, NudeTayne said: They could move off any of those guys and did not invest major draft assets so it's apples to oranges. They could have let Baker heal. They knew what they were doing letting Baker go out there every week with his shoulder falling off. I think there were a lot of problems with Baker and he was never going to work here. He can be very arrogant, the best thing that has happened to him is us getting off him. 1 hour ago, NudeTayne said: Agree to disagree, of course. IMO Baker was the scapegoat. Stef and Berry should have been fired after that season. Disagree. Americans are obsessed with firing. 1 hour ago, NudeTayne said: Not really. He played injured, which was on Stef alone to keep putting him in. He was scapegoated. Lo and behold he just had a nice season and is so believed in that he got that extension. Let me know how leshaun does. He is often mediocre. 1 hour ago, NudeTayne said: Landry and Beckham are divas. Baker never has been a me guy like them. I'd rather take the wager on the Bucs making the playoffs next year over the Browns. We'll see. The bucs make the playoffs because they are in a weak division, not because of Baker. For Baker to be successful you need more than what is realistic. Great coaching. Two great wr. Offensive line Runnjng game. Great defense. Weak division. To date his best year was under Kevin not anyone else. If Stefanski gets his qb we win a superbowl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NudeTayne Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 (edited) On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: I didn't like it at the time. Imo he was wrong in practice not theory. If he was less injury prone it would have been an OK trade. Fair point. If Watson was healthy and playing great then we'd have a different history to be discussing. I just thought he'd get injured, based on the past, and that baggage is all-time stuff. But maybe he's healthy next year and balls out. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: I think there were a lot of problems with Baker and he was never going to work here. He can be very arrogant, the best thing that has happened to him is us getting off him. We see Baker very differently, and that's the major divide between your camp and us "Baker bros". I guess years from now we'll have enough data to see who was correct. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Disagree. Americans are obsessed with firing. Lol I don't think this is it, but maybe 🤔🤷. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: He is often mediocre. If we take out his injury-plagued season I'd say there was a lot to be excited about in Cleveland, that the media built a narrative that propagated into the mind of viewers. Folks mostly think Mike Tomlin is a great guy--should have been suspended a year for cheating in the playoffs--and that Bellichik is one of the greatest coaches of all time, though he's a cheater too, that Mixon just defended himself etc. Folks listen to the media and don't believe their lying eyes. Baker has always been about winning and his teammates. IMO Baker is a whipping boy for the NFL. Perception is starting to turn, though. We'll see. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: The bucs make the playoffs because they are in a weak division, not because of Baker. For Baker to be successful you need more than what is realistic. The Bucs are poorly-coached and don't have a lot of talent. Sure, they went 9-8 and Baker was up and down. He had a nice season, though, and it was quite a situation to walk into in year one. I'm optimistic that year two will be even better. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Great coaching. Lol no. Every Bucs game wants the coach gone. They are Americans, though, so what do you expect? 😏 On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Two great wr. Yes, this is the most talented part of the team. Evans and Mayfield is a thing. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Offensive line Nuh uh. Their line is not good. Baker sometimes gets happy feet, but I watched all the games and that line is definitely below average outside of Wirfs. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Runnjng game. IMO it was improved because of Baker. It's been near dead last in the league and they need an RB1. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Great defense. I wouldn't say great, but they have some pieces. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: Weak division. Definitely. It'll be interesting now that Cousins is in the division. Year two with Young on the Panthers, with the influx of offensive line spending, should be interesting. I'm pessimistic about that moving the needle for Carolina, but we'll see. On 3/13/2024 at 4:52 PM, Kiwibrown said: To date his best year was under Kevin not anyone else. If Stefanski gets his qb we win a superbowl. I dunno. The opposite could easily be said. That defense has consistently underperformed until very recently. They could easily come back down to earth. I think Cleveland finishes third in the AFCN this year. Edited April 9 by NudeTayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soggust Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 4 hours ago, Forge said: John Lynch can't be up for this. Look at all the talent he's had around him. Shanny, Peters, Demeco, Saleh, McDaniel, Mayhew, Carthon. And that's before you get to the actual players! Deebo, Aiyuk, Bosa, Warner, Kittle. @Soggust knows what I'm talking about If everybody is good, then nobody is good - Confucius, probably 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdrawkcab321 Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 (edited) It might not be Andrew Berry but there has to be an argument for him being in the top tier. He’s lead the browns to 2 playoff appearances. Imagine saying that 10 years ago… he also always has cap room despite the browns spending more than any other team in the last 3 years without having to cut any major players. He knows how to work contracts. Edited March 14 by sdrawkcab321 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 2 hours ago, Kiwibrown said: For Baker to be successful you need more than what is realistic. Great coaching. Two great wr. Offensive line Runnjng game. Great defense. Weak division. To date his best year was under Kevin not anyone else. If Stefanski gets his qb we win a superbowl. When the Browns made the playoffs with Baker (and won a playoff game) they had a bad defense. a great running game. An okay pass blocking line. No great WR. Strong division. Game plan was great that year, specifically in the 2nd half. It was garbage the following year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said: When the Browns made the playoffs with Baker (and won a playoff game) they had a bad defense. a great running game. An okay pass blocking line. No great WR. Strong division. Game plan was great that year, specifically in the 2nd half. It was garbage the following year. Surprisingly it was Woods best defense from a coaching perspective. Oppurtnistic. Woods 2 & 3 had more talent and more middling results. The next year Baker was the problem. He was missing easy throws and throwing bad ints. Their was a relational breakdown it was either stfanski or Baker. I'm on team stefanski, but don't have tons of evidence for who did what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 1 hour ago, Kiwibrown said: Surprisingly it was Woods best defense from a coaching perspective. Oppurtnistic. Woods 2 & 3 had more talent and more middling results. The next year Baker was the problem. He was missing easy throws and throwing bad ints. Their was a relational breakdown it was either stfanski or Baker. I'm on team stefanski, but don't have tons of evidence for who did what. It still wasn't a good or even average defense. It was okay, but then 3rd down happened and they were awful. Yeah Baker wasn't good in 2021. We all know the story. It did seem like Stef called plays in 2021 with an injured Baker to either make him prove he could be a gunslinger who carried the offense (bad timing with an injury) or he wanted to put him in a position to fail so he could move on from him. Or he is just stubborn and had a gameplan heading into the year (to be like Freddie Kitchens) and refused to deviate from it no matter what. I don't think their relationship was bad or that would have been everywhere. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wentz you dog you Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 9 hours ago, MonserinNC said: I may be biased but Im gonna say Ryan Poles....rolling over a #1 overall pick for another #1 overall pick was crazy lucky, but he still pulled it off. While also having a ton of cap space, AND putting himself in a position where he can pretty much do ANYTHING in the draft. I dont think Ive seen a GM make moves like this EVER. Lol Ryan Poles…. Hes done absolutely nothing and has botched the fields situation and then traded a second for a WR who shouldn’t even be in the NFL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 5 hours ago, Kiwibrown said: The bucs make the playoffs because they are in a weak division, not because of Baker. For Baker to be successful you need more than what is realistic. Great coaching. Two great wr. Offensive line Runnjng game. Great defense. Weak division. The Bucs had all those? Their run game was terrible, the OL wasn’t good, and the defense was good not great. They won one more game than they did the year prior with almost the exact same team, but you sub Baker for Tom Brady. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 3 hours ago, sdrawkcab321 said: It might not be Andrew Berry but there has to be an argument for him being in the top tier. He’s lead the browns to 2 playoff appearances. You’re comparing him to GMs that have won and been to multiple super bowls. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 Adam Peters career path: New England (2003-2008): 2x Super Bowls, 3x Conference Championships Denver (2009-2016): 1x Super Bowl, 2x Conference Championships San Francisco (2017-2023): 2x Conference Championships In 20 years in the NFL, his teams have won 3 Super Bowls and played for 4 more. Sure, there might be those who say he wasn’t the primary contributor to those championship caliber teams. To which I say poppycock. Stack Washington’s 2024 offseason up against the offseasons his former teams are having so far, and it’s plain as punch who the real talent is and was. Plus he gets the added “handsome” points, which settles the tiebreaker with guys like Veach and Roseman. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefer Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 Nice to see ol Veach the Reach getting some good pub. Helps when you GM a dynasty. his early days were a mixed bag but he’s really become very good at what he does as hes got some seasoning. He’s figuring out who the dawgs are, and it’s been a rolling success since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdrawkcab321 Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 4 hours ago, Soko said: You’re comparing him to GMs that have won and been to multiple super bowls. Sure. But he’s had to dig himself out of a hole they most of those guys haven’t. Again not saying he’s the best. Just saying he’s up there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 5 minutes ago, sdrawkcab321 said: Sure. But he’s had to dig himself out of a hole they most of those guys haven’t. Again not saying he’s the best. Just saying he’s up there. That’s fine and all, but it’s like saying a student who used to score F’s but now scores B’s is smarter than a student who always got straight A’s. If we were splitting hairs then that’d be worth considering, but comparing his resume (two appearances) to guys that are winning championships/consistently knocking at the door, the difference in results is just so vast. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.