Pugger Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 8 minutes ago, CWood21 said: You listen to the comments about "pattern of negativity" that he said in his interview, and that seems to hint that there are going to be changes. Yes, I sensed that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 18 minutes ago, Pugger said: Yes, I sensed that too. Yeah .. sounds like we might be in for substantial changes. MM also said he wanted to use these last couple weeks to take the emotion out of it. He's got changes in mind for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrimiv Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 On 12/20/2017 at 10:33 PM, spilltray said: It has absolutely nothing to do with that. None of those retreads are going to be great. Most of the time not even as good as their previous success. I want someone focused on maximizing what they have here not trying to run what has worked for them in the past. I want fresh ideas, not recycled. I want someone passionate about being great here, not settling for what they can get. Seems to me that it's common enough for good DC's to fail in their shot as HC, then fall back to becoming a good DC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 A nice scathing article on Capers and the failures of his assistants by Tom Silverstein. The drum beats are getting louder. http://www.packersnews.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2017/12/22/silverstein-packers-must-move-dom-capers/977755001/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 16 hours ago, Mazrimiv said: Seems to me that it's common enough for good DC's to fail in their shot as HC, then fall back to becoming a good DC. Then it's still not the job they want. I want a first time NFL DC who is excited to have the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 5 minutes ago, spilltray said: Then it's still not the job they want. I want a first time NFL DC who is excited to have the job. I just want an NFL DC who can get our players to play up to their potential and not have one of the worst defenses in the league every damn year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 minute ago, Pugger said: I just want an NFL DC who can get our players to play up to their potential and not have one of the worst defenses in the league every damn year. Sure but I don't think that's going to come from a retread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 hour ago, spilltray said: Then it's still not the job they want. I want a first time NFL DC who is excited to have the job. Why do you want someone whose got no proven track record as opposed to someone whose got a proven track record? If Wade Phillips was available this offseason and was willing to be the DC, would you not be ecstatic? I want the guy whose going to get the most out of his players. I could care less if he's been a DC before or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 No I wouldn't. It's obviously not the job he feels he deserves. I think "proven" is a joke. Rarely do coaches have greater success as coordinators after being HC than before. I think that hungry up and comer is going to look at this situation and adapt to it more than a guy who is already sure he knows what works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 The challenge with the up and comer is that if he hasn't done it before, you have to live with a lot of mistakes as he learns the ropes Being a position coach or asst coach is one thing, making the leap to DC is another. All coaches mature on-the-job, they all make mistakes and they mostly learn from them. What a vet DC brings to the table is that he's got game day management experience, and there's no way to get that without calling a defense and playing chess in real-time with the MM's, Sean Payton's, Shanahan's around the league. A vet also has the experience of attacking a Brady, Rodgers, Brees- level QB Could be a new guy or an older coach, but there are trade-offs and you have decide which ones you want to live with. Having some DC experience is critical in my view because not all of the position coaches can make the leap to DC, just like many coordinators flop as HC's The Steelers "new" DC is 61 years old and he had 14 years in their system - and there are many here lauding his results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Shanedorf said: The challenge with the up and comer is that if he hasn't done it before, you have to live with a lot of mistakes as he learns the ropes Being a position coach or asst coach is one thing, making the leap to DC is another. All coaches mature on-the-job, they all make mistakes and they mostly learn from them. What a vet DC brings to the table is that he's got game day management experience, and there's no way to get that without calling a defense and playing chess in real-time with the MM's, Sean Payton's, Shanahan's around the league. A vet also has the experience of attacking a Brady, Rodgers, Brees- level QB Could be a new guy or an older coach, but there are trade-offs and you have decide which ones you want to live with. Having some DC experience is critical in my view because not all of the position coaches can make the leap to DC, just like many coordinators flop as HC's The Steelers "new" DC is 61 years old and he had 14 years in their system - and there are many here lauding his results. That's a negative way of viewing things imo. That kind of thinking means you would've never hired someone of McVay calibre if such a person was available. Don't forget we already got a very experienced D Co-ordinator and how is that working out for us? All good coaches have to start somewhere so experience isnt the most important factor. Its about the person's traits such as personality, presence, smarts, knowledge and creativity. We ought to be looking out for someone like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 14 minutes ago, Chili said: That's a negative way of viewing things imo. That kind of thinking means you would've never hired someone of McVay calibre if such a person was available. I'm not being negative at all, I'm merely sharing some thoughts on the various trade-offs. There isn't one right answer here And for as much acclaim as McVay gets ( deservedly so) , he's been schooled a couple of times by veteran coaches, including Zimmer Advocating for the concept of a young guy is fine, but let's not pretend they come ready-made and are a sure thing. Raiders were all excited about the up and coming Ken Norton, solid pedigree and loaded with fresh and aggressive ideas. Fans rejoiced. 2 years later they fire him for sucking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 I've compiled a list of possible D co-ordinator candidates, are there any that interests you?: Defensive Co-Ordinator Search Possible HC Firings Age Team Todd Bowles 54 NYJ Chuck Pagano 57 Colts Vance Joseph 45 Broncos Steve Spagnuolo 57 NYG Jack Del Rio 54 Raiders John Fox 62 Bears Possible co-ordinator availablity Mike Smith 58 Buccs Greg Manusky 51 Redskins Vic Fangio 59 Bears Kacy Rodgers 48 NYJ Joe Woods 47 Broncos Paul Guenther 46 Bengals Lovie Smith 59 Illinois Experienced position coaches Perry Fewell 55 Jaguars Mike Nolan 58 New Orleans Karl Dunbar 50 Alabama Don Martindale 54 Ravens Jim Haslett 62 Bengals Raheem Morris 41 Atlanta Unemployed Ray Horton 57 Mike Pettine 51 Eric Mangini 46 Rex Ryan 55 Jeff Fisher 59 Dennis Thurman 61 In-House Candidates Winston Moss 51 Packers Darren Perry 48 Packers Joe Whitt Jr 39 Packers Mike Trgovac 58 Packers College Football co-ordinators Dave Aranda 41 LSU Jim Leonhard 35 Wisconsin Todd Orlando ~45 Texas Brent Venables 47 Clemson NFL position coaches Brian Flores 36 Patriots Al Holcomb ~47 Carolina Josh Boyer 40 Patriots Al Harris 43 Kansas Matt Eberflus ? Dallas Tony Oden 44 Detroit Aaron Glenn 45 Saints Micheal Barrow 47 Seattle Anthony Weaver 37 Houston John Butler 44 Houston Nick Eason 37 Titans Lou Spanos 46 Titans Jason Tarver 43 49ers Jerome Henderson 48 Falcons Ron Milus ? Chargers Mark Collins ? Jaguars Adam Zimmer 33 Vikings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrimiv Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Regardless of who the DC is next season, the defense is going to have a tough time if Perry and Matthews continue as the team's primary edge rushers. As a pair, they just aren't good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Just now, Mazrimiv said: Regardless of who the DC is next season, the defense is going to have a tough time if Perry and Matthews continue as the team's primary pass rushers. As a pair, they just aren't good enough. That's because we're really an OLB short, even if you get those two completely healthy for the entire year. The problem is we've really never had our top 3 OLB healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.