What are the Falcons doing with Cousins and Michael Pennix Jr.?

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

2 minutes ago, Sad People said:

Theyre easily the favorites to win their division now and will get a home playoff game. After that anything can happen.

And i will go back to what @Soggust said "Is the idea that the difference between winning a SB with Cousins and not winning one, is whatever defensive guy they would have taken at 8?" (I dunno how to multi post so im quoting what he said)

And like I said it is a lot deeper than just the 8th overall pick. I am also mostly criticizing the process here and not necessarily the results.

I also don't think it is a forgone conclusion they just run away with that division. On paper are they the best team? Sure, but I think the Bucs and Saints got a lot better in the draft compared to what ATL did. I also don't think there is any chance they are beating multiple of the top teams in the NFC unless there are some massive injuries that shake up the conference. Like if I am looking at the Niners, Lions, Cowboys, and Eagles... you think they are beating two of those teams(likely with at least one game on the road) to make it to the SB? No shot.

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

13 minutes ago, FalconFan13 said:

While also possibly saving multiple 1sts and 2nd's in the next 2 years trying to trade back up to get Cousins replacement.    It's a you take it on the chin for 1 year to get a better prospect.  But reap the rewards later by saving alot of picks for a lesser QB class.    I think every person here even falcon homers understand it sucks not to get a edge and a player you need right away.  But the long term benefits on the team as a whole might be astronomically better if it actually works out.    I mean for the amount of 1sts and 2nd's you would need to move up for a QB in a year or 2.  You could legit get a pro bowler or 2 in a trade at the 1 position you would have taken a rookie at this year lol.

Then.... why the hell did the sign Cousins?????? Just go get the QB!

It is just so bad and shows the Falcons FO is completely inept. I can't defend it.

[Sad People]

Theres teams out there who still havent replaced their QBs. Dolphins still havent replaced Marino. (Tua is meh and more a byproduct of Mike McD imo) Broncos have never replaced Elway until they got Manning and had to go to FA in order to do so. Look at the QBs theyve drafted since hes left, it aint good. Pats were once a dynasty and now are a laughing stock of the NFL because their QB room isnt right. They were so bad it got who many people think is the greatest coach of all time let go.

Theres worse things you can do in the league then potentially solidifying your QB room for a decade plus.

 

 

Again the positives in all this should be so incredibly obvious to everyone.

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

Just now, Sad People said:

Theres teams out there who still havent replaced their QBs. Dolphins still havent replaced Marino. (Tua is meh and more a byproduct of Mike McD imo) Broncos have never replaced Elway until they got Manning and had to go to FA in order to do so. Look at the QBs theyve drafted since hes left, it aint good. Pats were once a dynasty and now are a laughing stock of the NFL because their QB room isnt right. They were so bad it got who many people think is the greatest coach of all time let go.

Theres worse things you can do in the league then potentially solidifying your QB room for a decade plus.

 

 

Again the positives in all this should be so incredibly obvious to everyone.

Ya let’s spend 100 Mil on a QB and then replace him before he has even suited up for us! Surely that won’t cause any issues!

It is all so ridiculous. 

[stl4life07]

From what I heard the Falcons werent prepared at all and just took Penix Jr. with the 8th overall pick. How can you go all in on Cousins but in the back of your mind be thinking as the draft approached that Penix Jr. would be the pick 8th overall? And like they structured Cousins contract in a way of showing that they had no idea what they were doing when they took Penix Jr. 8th overall. Its not like they could move off of Cousins after this year. This isnt an Alex Smith/Patrick Mahomes or what they are saying an Aaron Rodgers/Jordan Love situation. The Falcons screwed up, they didnt know what they were doing in the draft. And Im not really convinced Raheem Morris was all in. I think it was an owner situation that forced it to be that way and Morris had to go along with it. Possibly the GM too. But only time will tell if thats true or not. 

[ET80]

1 hour ago, scar988 said:

Listen, I don’t love the move. The signing of Kirk is more egregious at this point than the drafting of Penix tho. 

Ok... I agree with this.

If Penix is your guy and you have a top 10 pick, there is zero reason to sign Kirk Cousins. You do your homework on Penix, sign an actual bridge QB for a year (Ryan Tannehill is still waiting for a phone call) and put Penix in a position where he knows he's the guy in 2025. The actual pick of Penix isn't bad, it was the moves prior to picking Penix that makes this bad. 

@Daniel said it the best - this is either an egregiously bad draft pick or an egregiously bad FA signing. Either one is egregious, like this is something you fire a GM for if you end up worse than last season. If Atlanta is picking in the top 10 again, you have to fire Terry Fontenot - two of your biggest moves didn't move the needle, and those moves involved significant capital.

[FalconFan13]

10 minutes ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

Then.... why the hell did the sign Cousins?????? Just go get the QB!

It is just so bad and shows the Falcons FO is completely inept. I can't defend it.

I will say i find it funny that their really isn't many middle ground people on this subject.   this even includes pro players, gm's and high end analysts.   You have some people who love the idea of what they did and some people that think it's the stupidest thing ever.  On every level of person who is looking at it.   I think i am one of the few middle ground people and it looks like nabb might be as well.   Would i have preferred a edge 100% yes do i think we ended up with a better player and prospect at a more important position that could pay off much more in the long tun the answer is yes to that as well.   I don't love the pick but i understand the pick from the front office thought process.

[Sad People]

14 minutes ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

Ya let’s spend 100 Mil on a QB and then replace him before he has even suited up for us! Surely that won’t cause any issues!

It is all so ridiculous. 

Kirk got his feelings hurt that really seems to be the only issue thats arisen from all this outside the fans being upset by it.

So no so far it hasnt caused any issues.

Edited April 28 by Sad People

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

2 minutes ago, Sad People said:

Kirk got his feelings hurt, that really seems to be the only issue thats arisen from all this outside the fans being upset by it.

So no so far it hasnt caused any issues.

This is an insane read on the situation but I am just going to assume you don’t like Kirk Cousins with how you are speaking on this topic. 

[Soggust]

Just now, ET80 said:

Ok... I agree with this.

If Penix is your guy and you have a top 10 pick, there is zero reason to sign Kirk Cousins. You do your homework on Penix, sign an actual bridge QB for a year (Ryan Tannehill is still waiting for a phone call) and put Penix in a position where he knows he's the guy in 2025. The actual pick of Penix isn't bad, it was the moves prior to picking Penix that makes this bad. 

@Daniel said it the best - this is either an egregiously bad draft pick or an egregiously bad FA signing. Either one is egregious, like this is something you fire a GM for if you end up worse than last season. If Atlanta is picking in the top 10 again, you have to fire Terry Fontenot - two of your biggest moves didn't move the needle, and those moves involved significant capital.

Is there an argument that learning from Kirk Cousins is more valuable than learning from Ryan Tannehill?

And while it's obv not worth 100m more, perhaps if you think that Cousins makes you a contender in the interim (and Ryan wouldn't and would cost something) that maybe the gap gets smaller?

Again, I'm on team anti-Falcons for the record, but when I steelman the opposing case, this is what I start thinking lol.

 

2 minutes ago, Sad People said:

Kirk got his feelings hurt, that really seems to be the only issue thats arisen from all this outside the fans being upset by it.

So no so far it hasnt caused any issues.

[FalconFan13]

1 minute ago, ET80 said:

Ok... I agree with this.

If Penix is your guy and you have a top 10 pick, there is zero reason to sign Kirk Cousins. You do your homework on Penix, sign an actual bridge QB for a year (Ryan Tannehill is still waiting for a phone call) and put Penix in a position where he knows he's the guy in 2025. The actual pick of Penix isn't bad, it was the moves prior to picking Penix that makes this bad. 

@Daniel said it the best - this is either an egregiously bad draft pick or an egregiously bad FA signing. Either one is egregious, like this is something you fire a GM for if you end up worse than last season. If Atlanta is picking in the top 10 again, you have to fire Terry Fontenot - two of your biggest moves didn't move the needle, and those moves involved significant capital.

Now this one right here i might be the only Falcon fan who agrees with you on this one.  Not because the cousins signing or the penix pick im fine with both honestly.  It's that you didn't use any other means to go get a elite edge rusher when available in FA.  You still had money you could restructure in Grady, Lindstrom, Matthews etc...   They literally already put 25 mil aside for Hunter and offered it to him at 3 yrs 75 mil.  He took the Texans because of it being is home area and better state tax situation.   But that doesn't mean you literally do nothing else with that money trying to get a edge rusher with it being your #1 need.  The list of capable edge rushers in FA was massive compared to what we had last year and even more so right now.   Then you could have taken a 3rd round pick or 4th and got Reddick which is easily better than anything on the roster the last decade since abraham.     Instead they wasted that 3rd round pick to go up and get Ruke at a position we are already loaded at.  

The Ruke tradeup and lack of pushing for a edge rusher in FA  is way more egregious than the penix move to me.   The penix move i actually understand the other 2 i can't understand at all and it pisses me off.   How the heck was using a 2nd and 3rd to get Ruke a better move than using a 2nd and 4th to outbid for Burns?  The 25 mil was already set to the side for Hunter so i know for a fact it was there.

It seems we tried to trade back into the teens from 43 for Latu which i would have loved that was my #1 edge guy but that failed as well.

[Sad People]

Just now, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

This is an insane read on the situation but I am just going to assume you don’t like Kirk Cousins with how you are speaking on this topic. 

lol Youre getting upset because i have a different opinion than you.

What ACTUAL issues have arisen from this outside of Kirk getting his feelings hurt? Fans on the internet being upset about this pick doesnt count.

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

1 minute ago, Sad People said:

lol Youre getting upset because i have a different opinion than you.

What ACTUAL issues have arisen from this outside of Kirk getting his feelings hurt? Fans on the internet being upset about this pick doesnt count.

I am upset? News to me. 
 

You’re ignoring all the points to hyper focus on a tiny part of the argument. Nothing to discuss here. 

[BroncoSojia]

43 minutes ago, Sad People said:

And when Kirk is let go in 2 years and they have a guy whom theyve been grooming for 2 years and extends their window at winning, Will it still be a bad allocation of resources? No.

I can understand paying Kirk and spending the 8th pick on other positions. I can understand drafting Penix at 8 and spending the money you spent on Kirk on other positions. I cannot understand paying Kirk and drafting Penix 8th overall.

[scar988]

39 minutes ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

I don't agree with this, but just factually speaking JJ is 3 years younger, plenty athletic, has a live arm, and is healthy. Is he a project? Sure, but there is obvious things to like in the skillset. I think saying he projects as a 3rd is an extremely negative view of what he brings to the table long term.

Penix is a 5 year college player who has had 3 major injuries and is 24. He is supposed to be ready to play this year and the injury concerns are valid. Penix was also in the absolute best situation to show out in CFB last season outside of Daniels I guess. JJ clearly was on the better team, but the talent at WR in Washington was absurd.

And this isn't to say Penix isn't better than JJ long term. He might be. I just don't get it. If you view Penix as the guy long term.... why even sign Kirk at all? Just go get your guy lol.

Literally the thing I said about Kirk. 
 

however, McCarthy is somewhere between Zach Wilson and Chad Pennington. I don’t see this live arm. I actually think his arm strength is barely passable.