MikeT14 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 15 hours ago, Skins212689 said: This is not the NFL, top picks in the NBA aren't guaranteed to turn into Stars or Superstars like in the NFL. Oh my. Just recently... 2013 - Fisher (1, finally okay), Joeckel (2), Jordan (3), Mingo (6), Cooper (7), Austin (8), Milliner (9), Warmack (10), Fluker (11), Hayder (12), Manuel (16) 2014 (the best draft in awhile maybe) - Greg Robinson (2), Blake Bortles (3), Justin Gilbert (8) 2015 - Winston (1), Mariota (2), Fowler (3), White (7), Flowers (9, lol), Shelton (12), Parker (14), Johnson (16) 2016 - Conklin (8), Apple (10), Joseph (14), Coleman (15) Bunch of non superstars there. Same as NBA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 (edited) It's probably fair though. I think we were all happy too with the Caps continuously making the playoffs and getting bounced in the 2nd round. Maybe if we hold on to Wall and Beal they'll eventually get past too. Edited July 16, 2019 by MikeT14 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 1 minute ago, MikeT14 said: Oh my. Just recently... 2013 - Fisher (1, finally okay), Joeckel (2), Jordan (3), Mingo (6), Cooper (7), Austin (8), Milliner (9), Warmack (10), Fluker (11), Hayder (12), Manuel (16) 2014 (the best draft in awhile maybe) - Greg Robinson (2), Blake Bortles (3), Justin Gilbert (8) 2015 - Winston (1), Mariota (2), Fowler (3), White (7), Flowers (9, lol), Shelton (12), Parker (14), Johnson (16) 2016 - Conklin (8), Apple (10), Joseph (14), Coleman (15) Bunch of non superstars there. Same as NBA. I love how everyone ia so caught up on my post. The Skins got Kerrigan at 16, Payne at 13, Allen at 17, Haskins at 15, and Sweat at 26 yet everyone is gonna act like they dont understand what I was saying. Also Brady was selected in the 6th round, Antonio Brown selected 6th round, Terrel Davis selected 6th round, Richard Sherman 5th round, Kirk Cousins 4th round, Jared Allen 4th round, and I could name more but it's no need because I understand what I'M talking about. Also have backed my statements up with #FACTS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 14 minutes ago, Skins212689 said: I love how everyone ia so caught up on my post. The Skins got Kerrigan at 16, Payne at 13, Allen at 17, Haskins at 15, and Sweat at 26 yet everyone is gonna act like they dont understand what I was saying. Also Brady was selected in the 6th round, Antonio Brown selected 6th round, Terrel Davis selected 6th round, Richard Sherman 5th round, Kirk Cousins 4th round, Jared Allen 4th round, and I could name more but it's no need because I understand what I'M talking about. Also have backed my statements up with #FACTS What did I do then? Kuzma - 27th overall, Siakam 27th overall, D Murray 29th overall, Harrell 32nd overall, Nance Jr 27th overall, Capela 25th overall, etc - all extremely solid players to build your future lottery picks around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, MikeT14 said: What did I do then? Kuzma - 27th overall, Siakam 27th overall, D Murray 29th overall, Harrell 32nd overall, Nance Jr 27th overall, Capela 25th overall, etc - all extremely solid players to build your future lottery picks around. Can you give me 20 guys picked 20th or lower in the NBA? That was 6. I definitely can give you 20 outside of the first three rounds of the NFL draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 56 minutes ago, MikeT14 said: It's probably fair though. I think we were all happy too with the Caps continuously making the playoffs and getting bounced in the 2nd round. And that "getting bounced in the 2nd round repeatedly" resulted in the GM getting fired. So, no, I don't think the fans were all too happy about that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 16 minutes ago, Skins212689 said: Can you give me 20 guys picked 20th or lower in the NBA? That was 6. I definitely can give you 20 outside of the first three rounds of the NFL draft. Number of players per team in the NBA: 15 Number of teams in the NBA: 30 Number of players in the NBA: 450 (not counting G-League) Number of draft spots in the NBA: 60 Number of players per team in the NFL: 53 Number of teams in the NFL: 32 Number of players in the NFL: 1696 (not counting practice squads) Number of draft spots in the NFL: 256 So, yeah, you probably can find 20 outside of the first three rounds. There's also a lot more chances to see it happen than in the NBA. Also, you're assuming that: Whomever the Wizards traded Beal to would be 20 to 30. There's no guarantee of that (especially out in the West). That even if they were good now that they wouldn't get hit by the injury bug or get cap strapped and lose by the time the pick(s) were transferred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 14 minutes ago, Skins212689 said: Can you give me 20 guys picked 20th or lower in the NBA? That was 6. I definitely can give you 20 outside of the first three rounds of the NFL draft. I guess it would help if the NBA had a draft that went past 2 rounds. Hadn't really dipped into the 2nd yet. But I could look for the undrafted guys like Bazemore and Curry. Thomas Bryant, Malcolm Brogdan, Zubac, Harrell, Looney, J Grant, Joe Harris, Dinwiddie, J Clarkson, Jokic, Gobert, Crowder, D Green, Fournier, Middleton, Faried, Jackson, J Butler, Bogdonovic, Mirotic, I Thomas, Parsons, Whiteside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 Just now, Woz said: Number of players per team in the NBA: 15 Number of teams in the NBA: 30 Number of players in the NBA: 450 (not counting G-League) Number of draft spots in the NBA: 60 Number of players per team in the NFL: 53 Number of teams in the NFL: 32 Number of players in the NFL: 1696 (not counting practice squads) Number of draft spots in the NFL: 256 So, yeah, you probably can find 20 outside of the first three rounds. There's also a lot more chances to see it happen than in the NBA. Also, you're assuming that: Whomever the Wizards traded Beal to would be 20 to 30. There's no guarantee of that (especially out in the West). That even if they were good now that they wouldn't get hit by the injury bug or get cap strapped and lose by the time the pick(s) were transferred. Dude who did I say I would trade Beal for? Not lower level picks but young proven guys on the rise and 1 Vet! So this is pointless. You would trade him picks I wouldn't want to go that route and you just proved why, It's less likely we would get fair value for him even with accumulating multiple draft picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 I'm confused. Yesterday you wrote: 17 hours ago, Skins212689 said: This is not the NFL, top picks in the NBA aren't guaranteed to turn into Stars or Superstars like in the NFL. At which point, @MikeT14 pointed to lots of busts at the top of the draft. Today, you wrote: 51 minutes ago, Skins212689 said: I love how everyone ia so caught up on my post. The Skins got Kerrigan at 16, Payne at 13, Allen at 17, Haskins at 15, and Sweat at 26 yet everyone is gonna act like they dont understand what I was saying. Also Brady was selected in the 6th round, Antonio Brown selected 6th round, Terrel Davis selected 6th round, Richard Sherman 5th round, Kirk Cousins 4th round, Jared Allen 4th round, and I could name more but it's no need because I understand what I'M talking about. Also have backed my statements up with #FACTS which is a bunch of players who were drafted later in the draft that turned into stars. So, now you're saying you can find stars later in the draft? Guys like Draymond Green, Khris Middleton, Rudy Gobert, Nikola Jokic, and Malcolm Brogdon (wahoowa!)? That would mean trading Beal would not be a bad idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, MikeT14 said: I guess it would help if the NBA had a draft that went past 2 rounds. Hadn't really dipped into the 2nd yet. But I could look for the undrafted guys like Bazemore and Curry. Thomas Bryant, Malcolm Brogdan, Zubac, Harrell, Looney, J Grant, Joe Harris, Dinwiddie, J Clarkson, Jokic, Gobert, Crowder, D Green, Fournier, Middleton, Faried, Jackson, J Butler, Bogdonovic, Mirotic, I Thomas, Parsons, Whiteside Beal is better than how many of those guys? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 Just now, Skins212689 said: Dude who did I say I would trade Beal for? Not lower level picks but young proven guys on the rise and 1 Vet! So this is pointless. You would trade him picks I wouldn't want to go that route and you just proved why, It's less likely we would get fair value for him even with accumulating multiple draft picks. You were arguing that there's no point in taking draft picks because they would not be stars because they bust unlike the top of the NFL draft. You're all over the map. Also, If you want young proven guys + 1 vet, you're still in a short time horizon. Wall's contract will mean all of those guys will be gone in three years time due to the salary cap. You're not getting young and proven guys PLUS a vet for Beal. You can get maybe a proven guy and a vet, or a bunch of young guys with upside, but you aren't getting this magical deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 Just now, Skins212689 said: Beal is better than how many of those guys? You asked for 20 guys drafted after pick #20 who were stars. He gave you a list of stars who were drafted after pick #20 to show you that you can find players later in the draft. Chances are none of those players are available in exchange for Beal, so it doesn't really matter how they compare. What matters is that you can improve your team (and your salary cap situation) by getting younger and cheaper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Woz said: I'm confused. Yesterday you wrote: At which point, @MikeT14 pointed to lots of busts at the top of the draft. Today, you wrote: which is a bunch of players who were drafted later in the draft that turned into stars. So, now you're saying you can find stars later in the draft? Guys like Draymond Green, Khris Middleton, Rudy Gobert, Nikola Jokic, and Malcolm Brogdon (wahoowa!)? That would mean trading Beal would not be a bad idea. I would trade Beal for those particular guys Head Ups but not a pick heading into a draft looking to get them late in a draft. It's like had the Skins traded Cousins for a 2nd round pick it's more likely you could still get a All Pro player but trading Beal for a 2nd round draft pick your REALLY gambling that a Draymond Green, Khris Middleton, Golbert, Jokic, or Brogdon is gonna turn into a AllStar in the NBA. The Redskins had a shot at JuJu Smith and Zack Cunningham instead of Ryan Anderson in the 2nd round of the 2017 draft. Both are AllPro type guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, Woz said: You asked for 20 guys drafted after pick #20 who were stars. He gave you a list of stars who were drafted after pick #20 to show you that you can find players later in the draft. Chances are none of those players are available in exchange for Beal, so it doesn't really matter how they compare. What matters is that you can improve your team (and your salary cap situation) by getting younger and cheaper. That's what matter to you! What matters to me is who is the better player. Beal is the better player compared to alot of those guys. I could give a damn about the money because in the NBA players get paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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