2019 Draft Talk

[Guest]

43 minutes ago, vikestyle said:

You're not wrong, but for me personally I enjoy watching the defense. If we weaken that and marginally improve the offense then I won't particularly enjoy either unit. So it's for selfish reasons more than anything. 

I don't think building the team around Cousins is the thing to do. I think build the team as if we have a bad QB and try to win in spite of him. Keep the defense a strength, invest in the OL, but not at the expense of the defense. Run the ball, throw using play action, and play great defense. I think that's our only realistic recipe.

I agree with everything you've said here.  However, I believe that investing in the OL will mean that some other unit (defense or offense) will pay the price.  Frankly, and in my opinion, there are more quality resources on defense than offense presently.  Maybe getting rid of vets like Sendejo, Richardson, Barr, Griffen and perhaps Rhodes is the way to go to free up resources to invest in the offensive line...and letting some of the young tigers develop! 

[Boda]

58 minutes ago, Heimdallr said:

So what are the best sites to research prospects and get an idea where people are ranked? I used to use CBS but that site is a hot mess now. 

The Draft Network does a good job

Otherwise @CalhounLambeau does a good job

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bu7VCs3ld5efCR3fDjj_vM09KjYbY_SBDkdJHRJPOew/htmlview#

[Boda]

22 minutes ago, Virginia Viking said:

I agree with everything you've said here.  However, I believe that investing in the OL will mean that some other unit (defense or offense) will pay the price.  Frankly, and in my opinion, there are more quality resources on defense than offense presently.  Maybe getting rid of vets like Sendejo, Richardson, Barr, Griffen and perhaps Rhodes is the way to go to free up resources to invest in the offensive line...and letting some of the young tigers develop! 

I don't know why people are so ready to just move on from Barr. IMO thatd be a bad move. Out LB corps would be worse then when we had Chad Greenway throughout his entire career & Greenway was a better LB than Kendricks is, we were never able to put a good LB with him.  LB is already the weak link on the defense & I see no reason to worsen it without having something there other than unknowns & Wilson isn't going to do what Barr does.  I think with that strategy we're just creating holes for the sake of having this money to spend on the OL just so then everyone can complain about the Defense

[vikingsrule]

Just now, Boda said:

I don't know why people are so ready to just move on from Barr. IMO thatd be a bad move. Out LB corps would be worse then when we had Chad Greenway throughout his entire career & Greenway was a better LB than Kendricks is, we were never able to put a good LB with him.  LB is already the weak link on the defense & I see no reason to worsen it without having something there other than unknowns & Wilson isn't going to do what Barr does.  I think with that strategy we're just creating holes for the sake of having this money to spend on the OL just so then everyone can complain about the Defense

I think it's the anticipated asking price of Barr. I'm guessing most assume that he is expecting $14m +. 

Just doesn't seem worth it. This is the the task the every good team has to deal with, good players will leave. Unfortunately, we've got $28 million invested in a QB that needs much more help around him than the front office anticipated.

[milanb]

Quite honestly, I think the Vikings need to go OL in the first two rounds. If they need to move up or down to get the player(s) they want they should do it.

The OL has been broken for a long time now and the Vikings are not likely to fix it with free agents, trades or late round "gems".

The window is closing for this generation of players, and waiting around for the OL to magically get better is not an option.

[Boda]

1 hour ago, milanb said:

Quite honestly, I think the Vikings need to go OL in the first two rounds. If they need to move up or down to get the player(s) they want they should do it.

The OL has been broken for a long time now and the Vikings are not likely to fix it with free agents, trades or late round "gems".

The window is closing for this generation of players, and waiting around for the OL to magically get better is not an option.

I could get behind this as Ive thought about it a lot however there is one prospect if available who could change my mind LB - Devin White  even if we brought back Barr i'd still take White if he was available, he could completely change our defense.  I think some people were talking about him in here a little while back but maybe that was some place else.  The only other non OL that I would want if he was available in the 3rd(not likely, although that would still fit with your taking OL in rounds 1 & 2) would be Marquise "Hollywood" Brown.  I really believe our offense is also missing someone who can just take the top off a defense.  I haven't gotten into a lot of players yet so I asked around to someone I trusted to see if there was a mid to late round WR who could do this & he said not very likely.

[The Gnat]

Matthew Coller had an interesting article on 1500 ESPN about why going for OL might not be the best, and I don't completely agree with him, but on't completely disagree. If I remember correctly from my numbers, going OL can be solid, but I know that the numbers now will likely have changed with more OG's going early in the NFL draft than they were before. But in terms of production, if we draft OL now, and high OL, they likely won't make a huge impact this year, mid round OG's tend to do as well as high round OG's, I think going away from late round OG's is where it would make a lot of sense and going for a higher round OG and then probably a mid-round OG while keeping the defense strong as well..

Also, would you, as a Vikings fan, consider Kyler Murray at QB if he was there in round two (or even round one)? I know personally round one QB is right out for me this season. However, Murray is an interesting prospect at QB, would be very different than Cousins, but I suspect we'll move on from Cousins in two years, not because he's horrible, but because we'll probably need to change cap space differently to really allocate for the team. Murray has some good speed which is interesting, especially if he checks out well at the combine on a few measurables because his height is going to be short.

[vikingsrule]

6 minutes ago, The Gnat said:

Matthew Coller had an interesting article on 1500 ESPN about why going for OL might not be the best, and I don't completely agree with him, but on't completely disagree. If I remember correctly from my numbers, going OL can be solid, but I know that the numbers now will likely have changed with more OG's going early in the NFL draft than they were before. But in terms of production, if we draft OL now, and high OL, they likely won't make a huge impact this year, mid round OG's tend to do as well as high round OG's, I think going away from late round OG's is where it would make a lot of sense and going for a higher round OG and then probably a mid-round OG while keeping the defense strong as well..

Also, would you, as a Vikings fan, consider Kyler Murray at QB if he was there in round two (or even round one)? I know personally round one QB is right out for me this season. However, Murray is an interesting prospect at QB, would be very different than Cousins, but I suspect we'll move on from Cousins in two years, not because he's horrible, but because we'll probably need to change cap space differently to really allocate for the team. Murray has some good speed which is interesting, especially if he checks out well at the combine on a few measurables because his height is going to be short.

I feel like the sweet spot for Guards is that 50-120 range in the draft. Mid second to mid fourth. 

I am generally against taking a Guard early, unless you're getting a true standout. But looking at the current state of the team, Guard makes the most sense, unless we lose Richardson. Then I'm supporting a DT at 18 in a strong class (might get a top 10 talent at 18).

[VIKINGS101011]

Sounds like Kyler Murray is gonna enter the draft now. It wont happen, but the Vikes should consider.

[VikeManDan]

6 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

But looking at the current state of the team, Guard makes the most sense, unless we lose Richardson. Then I'm supporting a DT at 18 in a strong class (might get a top 10 talent at 18).

I could get behind that, my stance has been BPA at a trench position. 

We say it every year, but a small trade down may not be a bad idea. The idea being a team would be trading up for a DL prospect that is falling. Gain an extra 2nd or 3rd and go to work.

[swede700]

29 minutes ago, VIKINGS101011 said:

Sounds like Kyler Murray is gonna enter the draft now. It wont happen, but the Vikes should consider.

A 5'9" QB (his stats say 5'10", but I've heard even that's a stretch) shouldn't be drafted before the 7th round.  I don't care how good he is, he doesn't stand a chance, unless he has the devotion to the game like Russell Wilson, which it doesn't appear that Murray has.

[VikeManDan]

Raekwon Davis returning to Bama.

https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/2019/01/raekwon-davis-passing-on-nfl-draft-returning-to-alabama.html

[wcblack34]

1 hour ago, swede700 said:

A 5'9" QB (his stats say 5'10", but I've heard even that's a stretch) shouldn't be drafted before the 7th round.  I don't care how good he is, he doesn't stand a chance, unless he has the devotion to the game like Russell Wilson, which it doesn't appear that Murray has.

Wilson was a baseball guy too. Hard to say Murray doesn’t have devotion to football. 

[vikestyle]

1 hour ago, swede700 said:

A 5'9" QB (his stats say 5'10", but I've heard even that's a stretch) shouldn't be drafted before the 7th round.  I don't care how good he is, he doesn't stand a chance, unless he has the devotion to the game like Russell Wilson, which it doesn't appear that Murray has.

He is paying back $4.66 million dollars to play football and played college football even after he was a high draft pick in the MLB. It sounds like Murray isn't devoted to baseball.

Questioning the devotion of a 19 year old kid who opted to play college football (for free) which could have put his baseball career in jeopardy seems silly to me. If you don't like him as a player, fine, but I don't really see where you're getting the lack of devotion. Unless I missed something.

[swede700]

 

 

 

22 minutes ago, vikestyle said:

He is paying back $4.66 million dollars to play football and played college football even after he was a high draft pick in the MLB. It sounds like Murray isn't devoted to baseball.

Questioning the devotion of a 19 year old kid who opted to play college football (for free) which could have put his baseball career in jeopardy seems silly to me. If you don't like him as a player, fine, but I don't really see where you're getting the lack of devotion. Unless I missed something.

It's just an observation.  I have no opinion on him as a player, other than the fact that a 5'9" player is still going to have a tremendous challenge to succeed in the NFL.