mse326 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 Just now, jrry32 said: Yes. He's at 12 effing games and has one less sack. LOL. Wasn't aware sacks are the only criteria. Of course he is also on pace to be behind in TFL which I guess aren't as good as sacks for...reasons. He'll be no where close in PDs. He'll have some more FF and likely have faced a higher double team percentage. Like I said pros and cons for both, with seasons on par with each other. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 5 minutes ago, mse326 said: Wasn't aware sacks are the only criteria. Of course he is also on pace to be behind in TFL which I guess aren't as good as sacks for...reasons. He'll be no where close in PDs. He'll have some more FF and likely have faced a higher double team percentage. Like I said pros and cons for both, with seasons on par with each other. Donald is putting up a historic season from the interior DL while being doubled on roughly 70% of his snaps. Let's stop underselling that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mse326 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 7 minutes ago, jrry32 said: Donald is putting up a historic season from the interior DL while being doubled on roughly 70% of his snaps. Let's stop underselling that. Not underselling anything. Watt's 2015 was pretty freaking great you know. You're underselling Watt's season if you think it is so ridiculous to say they are on par. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 Let's ignore the goose egg he's put up so far this game and assume he'll be back on track in the second half Donald is on pace for 26 tackles for loss. He's on pace for 22 sacks. He's on pace for 1 PD. That's 48 negative plays for the offense. Watt had 29 tackles for loss, 17.5 sacks, and 8 PDs. That's 55 negative plays for the offense. You give Donald something for his extra forced fumbles and that might put him ahead, but to pretend like it isn't a legitimate debate is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 1 hour ago, pwny said: Let's ignore the goose egg he's put up so far this game and assume he'll be back on track in the second half Donald is on pace for 26 tackles for loss. He's on pace for 22 sacks. He's on pace for 1 PD. That's 48 negative plays for the offense. Watt had 29 tackles for loss, 17.5 sacks, and 8 PDs. That's 55 negative plays for the offense. You give Donald something for his extra forced fumbles and that might put him ahead, but to pretend like it isn't a legitimate debate is laughable. Updating these Donald is on pace for 24 tackles for loss, 20 sacks, and 1 PD. Now sitting at a projected 45 negative plays. Don't see why it's laughable to say those two seasons could be ranked either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSURacerDT55 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, pwny said: Who said it did? I was dubunking your stupid claim that only a Watt fanboy could think he was that great. Try not to move the goalpost too far. You missed the original point why you are trying to cherry pick but, K....... Edited December 10, 2018 by MSURacerDT55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
showtime Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 This guy is better than JJ Watt when Watt was in his prime. Numbers don't lie, boys. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 32 minutes ago, showtime said: This guy is better than JJ Watt when Watt was in his prime. Numbers don't lie, boys. I think it's fair to say that Watt's best year or two were slightly better. Had Donald broken the sack record, I might have come in here and pounded the table for it being as good or better, but he didn't. However, what's clear from previously posting in this thread is that some will ignore context and try to argue purely by the numbers to push their agenda that Donald isn't on the same level as prime Watt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
showtime Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 1 minute ago, jrry32 said: I think it's fair to say that Watt's best year or two were slightly better. Had Donald broken the sack record, I might have come in here and pounded the table for it being as good or better, but he didn't. However, what's clear from previously posting in this thread is that some will ignore context and try to argue purely by the numbers to push their agenda that Donald isn't on the same level as prime Watt. Def on the same level. I heard someone on TV a few days ago say that Donald shouldn't be in consideration for MVP because the Rams weren't a top tier defense. But isn't that even more impressive for a guy to do it on a defense that wasn't statistically the best. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter2_1 Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 Well, no defensive player should win MVP - unless they get about 80 sacks to make up the Win Above Replacement % - a fancy way of saying they'd need those kind of sack numbers to equal the consequential plays a QB makes toward winning games. If Watt didn't win it in 2014/15 and Donald didn't win it this season, I'd argue it's impossible for a defensive player to win. You just can't get much better than those 2 players in their respective dominant seasons. Not with current nano-technology anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 He's on the same level as Watt. Plain and simple. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckweath Posted January 15, 2019 Author Share Posted January 15, 2019 17 hours ago, MrOaktown_56 said: He's on the same level as Watt. Plain and simple. He's not. Watt was an absolute monster. He was a defense by himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 5 hours ago, Buckweath said: He's not. Watt was an absolute monster. He was a defense by himself. It's insight like this that make me want to leave this site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tex Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Watt's peak was higher. I mean if Donald plays even better than the did this season next season then sure he could have a case. Right now? Nope. Watt is underappreciated around these parts and people have some short term memory. To each their own though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 On 1/15/2019 at 7:06 PM, MrOaktown_56 said: It's insight like this that make me want to leave this site. The Texans were a top 5 defense with Watt... and a broken Brian Cushing, a broken Jadevion Clowney (who played a whole five quarters that season, I think) a secondary with an aging Jonathan Joseph and a slow Kareem Jackson, no S worthy of note and Whitney Mercilius (who would follow up a three sack performance with a 0/0/0 for about a month). It's not as far fetched as you're trying to make it out to be. Donald has his run with Suh, Peters, Talib, Brockers, Dante Fowler Jr - not the BEST supporting cast, but better than what Houston had during Watt's peak. Yet, Houston turned out top 3-5 defensive seasons like clockwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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