Trubisky 2019 season development & growth thread

[TB 1]

6 hours ago, G08 said:

Gabbert: 53.3%, 22 TD/24 INT 5.6 YPA 66.4 rating

Ponder: 59.2%, 31 TD/25 INT 6.2 YPA 77.1 rating

Weeden: 55.9%, 23 TD/26 INT 6.5 YPA, 71.8 rating

Manuel: 58.6%, 16 TD/12 INT 6.4 YPA, 78.5 rating

Lynch: 61.7%, 4 TD/4 INT 6.2 YPA, 76.7 rating

Locker: 55.5%, 14 TD/11 INT 7.2 YPA, 78.4 rating

 

Trubisky: 66%, 29 TD/14 INT 6.8 YPA, 92 rating

 

Hope that helps

What is Trubisky's rating after pulling out two games from last year against Tampa Bay and Detroit where he had 9 TD's and 0 INT's? His numbers are inflated by 2 great games. It also appears he is regressing and getting worse.

[TB 1]

6 hours ago, WindyCity said:

I am not sure they bring in a sure fire starter. Mitch will be on the team, but Foles/Bridgewater are not being signed/paid to compete with Mitch they are replacing him.

 

Are we sure Pace is not an idiot? Really sure?

Watching Mitch suck, Shaheen suck, Miller do nothing, Roquan struggle, Burton cash checks and disappear, his highly paid OL struggle, it is becoming harder and harder to stand up for Pace.

Pace is overrated as he only had a winning record because of getting Mack last year. I agree with you on everything but still wont give up on Roquan because  he can still be good.  Pace also traded away extra picks for Trubisky, Miller, Floyd and Montgomery. Not any of those players have shown to be worth trading extra picks for. This is why the Bears never have any picks. He could have stayed at 3 and took Watson without trading picks.

[TB 1]

6 hours ago, G08 said:

I get the sarcasm but this doesn't have to be mutually exclusive.

This offense takes time: it is not the same **** he was running in college (minus a handful of RPOs). There is precedent in the NFL that this scheme takes time; Patrick Mahomes is the outlier/the exception, not the rule.

Fans can bail on him, nobody will care, but I just don't know how to do that as a die-hard fan of this team. You support your QB -- always -- until you see that every rock has been turned over, every option tried and failed, and then you move on. But to boo the kid or find enjoyment in 'being right' that the kid was a bust is, to me, disgusting.

I hope Trubisky works out but the problem is he is getting worse the more he plays when he should be getting better with experience.

[TB 1]

6 hours ago, G08 said:

These are valid but anyone can see this offense is broken and doing him no favors. Get the run game going, hit a couple of deep shots and that average will spike. Only been 4 full games for the kid thus far this season. Let it breathe.

The Nagy/Reid scheme is not built on running the ball it is a passing scheme. Neither coach likes to run the ball at all. I agree the Bears should let him play the rest of the season as they aren't likely to make the playoffs with Hicks out.

[WindyCity]

Right now the Bears have

-no cap space

-no picks

-no QB

 

Pace deserves whatever heat comes his way.

[soulman]

Here's just one more thing to consider after reading a comment the Chargers HC made.  Coming out of college he and others compared Mitch to Aaron Rodgers as far as his basic tools and upside was concerned.  I admit to seeing some of the same and said so then.

As ridiculous as it may sound at the moment it may be worth asking are we once again attempting to force a QB to play in a "box" in which he does not fit well?  We do have a habit of doing just that even most recently with Cutler.

Some QBs do not function as well in a system that constrains their basic instincts.  That was a concern in GB when LaFleur took over bringing with him a scheme that had more motion and complexity that required his QB to freelance less.  Initially Rodgers seemed to balk at that but obviously they've worked it out well enough to balance out what LaFleur prefers with what Rodgers prefers.  For this I'll give credit to Rodgers talents and his experience as far as knowing how to give a little without losing himself in the changes.

Mitch lacks that same degree of experience to any degree that would allow him to push back against Nagy and his system but clearly he's not "getting it".  His execution has gotten worse as his confidence and his mechanics fail and he currently plays like a raw rookie who simply can't handle this offenses complexities and options.  He's regressed badly and we now realize he was regressing all summer long as Nagy pushed more and more of his scheme on him.  So is he simply the wrong guy for Nagy or is Nagy's scheme wrong for him?

I'm putting this out there because I believe any time you see a QB with his basic physical skills and abilities struggling this badly I also believe you have to question the fit of that QB in that scheme.  Nagy turned Alex Smith into a very successful game manager but also a QB with a very different skill set than say an Aaron Rodgers whom he was drafted ahead of.  But whose been the far more successful NFL QB?  Is Nagy asking Mitch to play against his natural tendencies and by doing so only adding to his problems?

Mitch is young and wants to be coached.  He needs to be coached.  But are we coaching him correctly?  Is he being coached to use his own unique skill set to be the best he can be and having an offense built around that as Rodgers had the benefit of for so long or is he being coached to fit into Nagy's concept of what his QB should play like and ignoring Mitch's instincts to play his own way?  If so IMHO that becomes a recipe for the exact kind of mess we're seeing right now.  It's a full on train wreck without a foreseeable end.

Once again I'll use my musical experience to compare.  Some musicians are highly technical players.  They play well only within a tightly built box they've learned to perform in and lose their virtuosity quickly if asked to perform more freely and intuitively.  They simply don't know how to do that well.  Conversely there are also very talented intuitive musicians who can only perform well by drawing on their instincts and the "feel" they derive from the music.  Put a written musical score in front of them and it's like a foreign language they can't read or speak fluently.  Instead you give them a bare outline of the music and they will improvise better than what might be written.

Is it possible this is what we have happening with Mitch?  It's not that he lacks instincts or intuition.  He's shown plenty of it in college and even some degree of it as a pro.  It's more like he's being asked to apply those instincts to a system he doesn't understand well enough yet to use them and may never get to that point in this scheme without some kind of major transformation.  The same kind it would take for an intuitive musician to learn to how to read and perform from a written score precisely the way it's written.  Some may be able to eventually do that while others will not and will give up even trying due to frustration.  It's simply not a fit for them or their skills.

I'm looking for answers just like everyone else so this is just something that popped into my head and I thought I'd throw it out there.

[G08]

8 hours ago, topwop1 said:

I believe it's true that this offense can take time to master but unfortunately this team doesn't have 5 years to wait for Mitch to do that.  If he showed more signs of progress and the offense was at least serviceable then I could see there being more patience given but patience is wearing thin now and you have to make a decision on this guy soon for his 5th year option.  Are you telling me that if you're Ryan Pace and you see this type of poor offensive/QB play keep up for the rest of this season then you'd be confident with exercising the 5th year option on Mitch's contract this coming off season?  The answer for me is heck no.

If I see this same level of performance form Trubisky the rest of this season, no I would not exercise his 5th year option. 

[G08]

I'd rather give appropriate time to a potential franchise QB than panic and bail on him early because of an "elite defense". 

Same defense that couldn't stop the Eagles in crunch time last year in the playoffs. 

Same defense that got ***** slapped by the Saints and Raiders in back to back games. 

[TB 1]

26 minutes ago, G08 said:

I'd rather give appropriate time to a potential franchise QB than panic and bail on him early because of an "elite defense". 

Same defense that couldn't stop the Eagles in crunch time last year in the playoffs. 

Same defense that got ***** slapped by the Saints and Raiders in back to back games. 

I would say that the Bears defense is more good than elite but Trubisky has to start playing better to be the future. Tru could become above average but i don't see a franchise QB even at his best.

The defense had 2 poor games in a row but the Bears offense has not played one good game at all this season and that does take a toll on a defense as they went over 2 quarters without a first down Sunday.

[beardown3231]

45 minutes ago, G08 said:

I'd rather give appropriate time to a potential franchise QB than panic and bail on him early because of an "elite defense". 

Same defense that couldn't stop the Eagles in crunch time last year in the playoffs. 

Same defense that got ***** slapped by the Saints and Raiders in back to back games. 

They got beat by Oakland and had a bad game. They got crushed by NO because the offense would literally give the Saints the ball back every 2 minutes. They gave up 16 points to the Eagles and who knows how that goes if O'Donnell hadn't saved his worst punt of the year for that moment.

Look man, I'm all about a franchise QB but I just don't know how you can back Trubisky to this degree still.

[G08]

1 hour ago, beardown3231 said:

They got beat by Oakland and had a bad game. They got crushed by NO because the offense would literally give the Saints the ball back every 2 minutes. They gave up 16 points to the Eagles and who knows how that goes if O'Donnell hadn't saved his worst punt of the year for that moment.

Look man, I'm all about a franchise QB but I just don't know how you can back Trubisky to this degree still.

There's a difference between 'backing' and 'supporting'. I'm not backing the garbage I've seen from him this season, but I am supporting a 25 year old QB with 19 full games in this system.

I've watched enough football to know each QB develops at their own pace, especially when you're functioning derivatives of this West Coast offense.

[yomyyo]

3 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Right now the Bears have

-no cap space

-no picks

-no QB

 

Pace deserves whatever heat comes his way.

Well, they have no cap space in part because they have to sign Pace's successful draft picks...

[beardown3231]

51 minutes ago, G08 said:

There's a difference between 'backing' and 'supporting'. I'm not backing the garbage I've seen from him this season, but I am supporting a 25 year old QB with 19 full games in this system.

I've watched enough football to know each QB develops at their own pace, especially when you're functioning derivatives of this West Coast offense.

Wouldn't he be in the vast minority if he came out of this funk and ended up being good enough? Has there ever been a QB who went from below average to decent to bad who eventually became good or better than good? Surely that list can't be long

Edited October 25, 2019 by beardown3231

[G08]

24 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

Wouldn't he be in the vast minority if he came out of this funk and ended up being good enough? Has there ever been a QB who went from below average to decent to bad who eventually became good or better than good? Surely that list can't be long

This is the part that confuses me because development in sports isn't linear. Look at Jared Goff as a recent example. We have a 4 game sample size of Trubisky this season (I'm throwing out the Vikings game because of him only having 3 passing attempts). He's played terribly but I think if one is being honest they can see that the entire offense is playing terribly, and that Nagy is coaching terribly as well. Our line can't block consistently, our receiving targets can't catch routine passes, Anthony Miller can't run proper routes, Trubisky can't execute basic RPOs, our RBs are fumbling the ball, etc. The whole entire offense is awful and it's horrible to watch, even more irritating because we were all expecting this team to be on a Super Bowl run this season.

That being said, we are 3-3 right now. I'm of the opinion this offense is in a rut because they have no idea who or what they are; I think we will snap out of this before the season is over. Just have to be patient and look for signs of progress.

I get that a lot of fans want to jump ship and call the kid a bust, and then thump their chests at the end of the year or the end of Trubisky's contract and boast that they were right. I'll never be that guy. I see promise, I see someone who is overwhelmed right now, but I also see a tireless worker and those are athletes that I'll never give up on as a fan. It'll click at some point, question is when.

Edited October 25, 2019 by G08

[abstract_thought]

He's never shown the potential to be a franchise QB. I wouldn't exclude it from the realm of possibility, but we've not seen him play at that level.

The issue with the way fans (and some NFL people) evaluate QBs is that they assume that any QB with the physical tools can simply develop the mental aspects of the game that are paramount to successful QB play. That's simply not the case. The ability to process information and make accurate decisions are to some degree inherent. And Mitch has not displayed those abilities outside of an unsustainably simplistic offensive structure.