TwoUpTwoDown Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 1 hour ago, DoleINGout said: Anyone an experienced videographer or film editor or producer of any level here that can concur with this take? Yeah you just shoot footage and use what looks best. The more to pick from the better the odds you get the shot you want. I don't think the Patriots did anything mischievous this time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 Curious, whens the last team another team besides the Patriots illegally filmed an opponents sideline? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 16 minutes ago, TwoUpTwoDown said: Yeah you just shoot footage and use what looks best. The more to pick from the better the odds you get the shot you want. I don't think the Patriots did anything mischievous this time. Documentary was long over before the game started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4L Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, ramssuperbowl99 said: I was thinking more along the lines of the South Park episode where all of the baseball teams are trying to lose. In this case Randy getting wasted and fighting people in the stands is just a metaphor for the entire state of Massachusetts. my girlfriend is from outside of Boston and she certainly doesn't fit the mold but Ive been there a bunch and there is a reason that they are called mass holes Edited December 10, 2019 by N4L Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 2 hours ago, theJ said: Same. Also hilarious. Because if they were cheating, they got caught cheating against a 1-12 team lol. This just means that they do it with every team and just got caught now. They didn't just start with the 1-12 Bengals. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theJ Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 1 minute ago, VanS said: This just means that they do it with every team and just got caught now. They didn't just start with the 1-12 Bengals. Oh i know. But of all teams to get caught doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 4 hours ago, HolmesPriest said: I just think this is hilarious. I don't know why. But man, again and again and again these guys doing these things lol. Well they keep winning at a historically unprecedented rate. How else do you think they do that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoUpTwoDown Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 19 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Documentary was long over before the game started. What does this mean? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 7 minutes ago, TwoUpTwoDown said: What does this mean? That there was zero reason to have the camera still on. So the trying to get the best shot excuse doesn’t work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 The Pats have been very systematic in their cheating efforts and Eric Mangini detailed a lot of it after he got fired. He didn't want BB doing the same thing to his Jets team and that's how the first round of Spygate was launched. Did you not wonder why all of the BB assistants sucked once they left the organization ? Those coaches spent untold hours learning from the Master, but once on their own, they couldn't replicate his success.. likely because they didn't cheat. Compare that to the Bill Walsh coaching tree and you'll note the stark difference - several Walsh assistants went on to win several Titles, BB assistants did not The most important thing BB learned from Ernie Adams was how the Wall Street guys handled the various rules and regs from the SEC. Ernie taught Bill how they would do the math to determine if the cheating was worth it. What are the chances of success, what is the reward, what are the potential penalties and is this specific case worth the risk incurred ? For example: If you have a 90 % chance of making a billion in profit by bending the rules ( insider info) then you weigh that against the chances of getting caught, say 33% and the ensuing fines, say $100 million. Plug all of that into the equation and you can decide if its worth the risk In the case of the NFL, the league is pretty toothless on these infractions. Who wouldn't trade a SB win for a measly draft pick or some meaningless fine ? The NFL also has to manage the integrity of the game, so while they do want to punish the cheaters, they are happy to bury evidence when it suits the greater goal - making money and keeping the public confidence in the NFL high: "Goodell tried to assuage his bosses: He ordered the destruction of the tapes and notes, he insisted, so they couldn't be exploited again. Many in the room didn't believe it. And some would conclude it was as if Goodell, Kraft and Belichick had acted like partners, complicit in trying to sweep the scandal's details under the rug while the rest of the league was left wondering how much glory the Patriots' cheating had cost their teams. "Goodell didn't want anybody to know that his gold franchise had won Super Bowls by cheating," a senior executive said. "If that gets out, that hurts your business." As far as the naive question of "what would they gain ? " - too many are discounting the value of filming from the lip- reading POV.Why do all coaches try to hide their mouths when they are making offensive/defensive calls ? Why do they all hide behind their call sheets ? Because they know the video is rolling. IF there was no value in the video, then why does the league forbid it ? Lots of conversations are going on and any info gleaned is quite useful when combined with the other collected data in terms of helping to win games. Don't think of the illegal video in isolation, think of it as one critical part of the overall puzzle. Yes, the bengals are 1-12, but they are also next weeks' opponent AND those coaches are likley to show up elsewhere over time. If you're building a dossier like the Pats have, it matters not what the current record is - what matters is having a full set of info on everybody. Brady even let it slip one time when talking about Aaron Rodgers: "Tom Brady once told an NFL coach, if Aaron Rodgers had Patriots' institutional knowledge on opposing defenses, "He'd throw for 7,000 yards every year. He's so much more talented than me." Its really a damn shame imo. Instead of being the greatest coach/dynasty in NFL history, all of their accomplishments are forever stained because Bill and Ernie took it too far. TL/DR: The Kraft / Belichick Pats are serial cheaters... and they know the anemic penalties will pale in comparison to the glory of another Title. So they keep on doing it. "Film" at 11 https://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nex_Gen Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 34 minutes ago, VanS said: Well they keep winning at a historically unprecedented rate. How else do you think they do that? By scoring more than the other team by the time the game ends... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 23 minutes ago, Shanedorf said: The Pats have been very systematic in their cheating efforts and Eric Mangini detailed a lot of it after he got fired. He didn't want BB doing the same thing to his Jets team and that's how the first round of Spygate was launched. Did you not wonder why all of the BB assistants sucked once they left the organization ? Those coaches spent untold hours learning from the Master, but once on their own, they couldn't replicate his success.. likely because they didn't cheat. Compare that to the Bill Walsh coaching tree and you'll note the stark difference - several Walsh assistants went on to win several Titles, BB assistants did not The most important thing BB learned from Ernie Adams was how the Wall Street guys handled the various rules and regs from the SEC. Ernie taught Bill how they would do the math to determine if the cheating was worth it. What are the chances of success, what is the reward, what are the potential penalties and is this specific case worth the risk incurred ? For example: If you have a 90 % chance of making a billion in profit by bending the rules ( insider info) then you weigh that against the chances of getting caught, say 33% and the ensuing fines, say $100 million. Plug all of that into the equation and you can decide if its worth the risk In the case of the NFL, the league is pretty toothless on these infractions. Who wouldn't trade a SB win for a measly draft pick or some meaningless fine ? The NFL also has to manage the integrity of the game, so while they do want to punish the cheaters, they are happy to bury evidence when it suits the greater goal - making money and keeping the public confidence in the NFL high: "Goodell tried to assuage his bosses: He ordered the destruction of the tapes and notes, he insisted, so they couldn't be exploited again. Many in the room didn't believe it. And some would conclude it was as if Goodell, Kraft and Belichick had acted like partners, complicit in trying to sweep the scandal's details under the rug while the rest of the league was left wondering how much glory the Patriots' cheating had cost their teams. "Goodell didn't want anybody to know that his gold franchise had won Super Bowls by cheating," a senior executive said. "If that gets out, that hurts your business." As far as the naive question of "what would they gain ? " - too many are discounting the value of filming from the lip- reading POV.Why do all coaches try to hide their mouths when they are making offensive/defensive calls ? Why do they all hide behind their call sheets ? Because they know the video is rolling. IF there was no value in the video, then why does the league forbid it ? Lots of conversations are going on and any info gleaned is quite useful when combined with the other collected data in terms of helping to win games. Don't think of the illegal video in isolation, think of it as one critical part of the overall puzzle. Yes, the bengals are 1-12, but they are also next weeks' opponent AND those coaches are likley to show up elsewhere over time. If you're building a dossier like the Pats have, it matters not what the current record is - what matters is having a full set of info on everybody. Brady even let it slip one time when talking about Aaron Rodgers: "Tom Brady once told an NFL coach, if Aaron Rodgers had Patriots' institutional knowledge on opposing defenses, "He'd throw for 7,000 yards every year. He's so much more talented than me." Its really a damn shame imo. Instead of being the greatest coach/dynasty in NFL history, all of their accomplishments are forever stained because Bill and Ernie took it too far. TL/DR: The Kraft / Belichick Pats are serial cheaters... and they know the anemic penalties will pale in comparison to the glory of another Title. So they keep on doing it. "Film" at 11 https://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart Great post. Its sad that cheating pays but I guess the NFL is like every other walk of life in that regard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanS Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Nex_Gen said: By scoring more than the other team by the time the game ends... No. They keep cheating which is why they win at a historically unprecedented rate. I'm personally done with the Patriots. Their 6 Super Bowl titles are invalid to me from this day on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony7188 Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 16 hours ago, AlNFL19 said: There is zero evidence linking this to Brady (or Belichick really). Oh they know what they were doing. Kraft, Belichick and Tom Brady had to know something was up. They shouldn’t be able to talk themselves out of this one. New punishment: Removal of 2020 1st Round Pick + 2020 3rd Round Pick. 1 million dollar fine for Kraft, 1 million dollar fine for Belichick + 1 million dollar fine for Brady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rivers Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 why do the pats need anyone at the bengals game anyways? Don't they have the all access 2-2 footage to study their opponents? This 'do your job ' series is nonsense 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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