3.94 - Josiah Deguara [TE; Cincinnati]

[festiveonion]

1 minute ago, Kampfgeist said:

I think that's a bar that he's never going to approach.   Juszczyk has been to the Pro Bowl the last 4 years and averages 20-30 catches, 300 yards and a TD.   He's the pre-eminent "fullback" in the NFL right now.   I think Deguara's value is going to largely come in ways a statistician and/or casual fan just aren't going to appreciate, but his teammates that know his role and are the recipients of all the yardage/TD's he creates for them, will

And I’ll counter this by saying with all the chunk yardage in check downs, goal line opportunities, and an already apparent affinity for smart, gritty ball players that Deguara will be a fan favorite by the end of year two. 

[Kampfgeist]

12 minutes ago, festiveonion said:

And I’ll counter this by saying with all the chunk yardage in check downs, goal line opportunities, and an already apparent affinity for smart, gritty ball players that Deguara will be a fan favorite by the end of year two. 

By counter I assume you mean as in music: A melody added to an existing one, especially one added to provide harmony whilst each retains its simultaneous identity

vs a counter meaning an opposite point

I think we are in agreement re Deguara

[spilltray]

27 minutes ago, Kampfgeist said:

I think that's a bar that he's never going to approach.   Juszczyk has been to the Pro Bowl the last 4 years and averages 20-30 catches, 300 yards and a TD.   He's the pre-eminent "fullback" in the NFL right now.   I think Deguara's value is going to largely come in ways a statistician and/or casual fan just aren't going to appreciate, but his teammates that know his role and are the recipients of all the yardage/TD's he creates for them, will

Except I think Deguara is going to be used as more than a FB. I'm really hoping Chris Cooley is a good example as far as usage.

Cooley:

Height:6' 3.5"

Weight:265 pounds

Arm Length:30.88 inches

Hand Size:9.63 inches

NFL Combine Measurables

40 Yard Dash:4.86 seconds

Bench Press:22 reps (225 lb)

Vertical Leap:33.0 inches

Broad Jump:115 inches

20 Yd Shuttle:4.19 seconds

Three Cone:7.21 seconds

-----------

Degura

Height:6' 2"

Weight:242 pounds

Arm Length:31 5/8 inches

Hand Size:9 inches

40 Yard Dash:4.72 seconds

Bench Press: 25 reps (225 lb)

Vertical Leap:35.5 inches

Broad Jump:115 inches

20 Yd Shuttle:4.35 seconds

Three Cone:7.15 seconds

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by spilltray

[SAM]

30 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Honestly, I was talking more in terms of versatility.  Degaura is a guy who can literally line up all over the field.  You want him to line up in the backfield next to Aaron?  Sure.  You want him to split out wide?  Sure.  You want him to line up as an in-line blockers.  He's the anti-Marcedes Lewis in a way.  The guy is someone who is going to use in a multitude of ways.  Listen to LaFleur's vision of the offense.  He wants guys that you can't tell whether it's a run or a pass.  Degaura is exactly that.

Yes. By some of the comments, I don't think some of the people here know what a true H back is. If he's the right guy, he becomes is a true Swiss Army knife and keeps the defense guessing. The Packers tried Vitale and Steinbrenner but IMHO didn't work that well. LaFleur seems to think DeGaura might be the guy. This will be a big part of this offense if he does.

[festiveonion]

7 minutes ago, Kampfgeist said:

By counter I assume you mean as in music: A melody added to an existing one, especially one added to provide harmony whilst each retains its simultaneous identity

vs a counter meaning an opposite point

I think we are in agreement re Deguara

Maybe. I think we’re in agreement he’s going to set up his teammates for success.. that’s inherently the job of his position. 
 

If you think that statistically he approaches the same average as indicated in the post I quoted, then I disagree. He also isn’t a fullback. 

[coachbuns]

44 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

There's absolutely nothing wrong with being skeptical of a pick.  We as fans have every right to do so, as long as we have done the prerequisite research into the pick.  I mean, what percentage of posters here immediately after the pick was announced had to Google who Degaura was?  I'd venture a guess that percentage is north of 80%.  Even I didn't spend a whole lot of time on him.

Being skeptical is fine … saying he sucks/won't make it/waste of a pick thinking is another.  Nobody has any idea what MLF and Gute have in mind for this year's offense but one sure can read between the lines.  A good running game with play action off it can keep teams guessing.  This pick was made for that. 

[festiveonion]

3 minutes ago, SAM said:

Yes. By some of the comments, I don't think some of the people here know what a true H back is. If he's the right guy, he becomes is a true Swiss Army knife and keeps the defense guessing. The Packers tried Vitale and Steinbrenner but IMHO didn't work that well. LaFleur seems to think DeGaura might be the guy. This will be a big part of this offense if he does.

preach... sorta. 
 

Think it’s clear the reason the packers didn’t bring Vitale back is because they were targeting this position in the draft. 
 

Stern can play Hback. That’s what makes you like this pick that much more 

[Kampfgeist]

1 minute ago, festiveonion said:

Maybe. I think we’re in agreement he’s going to set up his teammates for success.. that’s inherently the job of his position. 
 

If you think that statistically he approaches the same average as indicated in the post I quoted, then I disagree. He also isn’t a fullback. 

If you look at my post you'll see I wrote "fullback" with quotations, connoting fullback in positional name only - just like Juszczyk.   If you look at previous posts of mine in this thread you'll see I've made that the same point you are making.   We are in agreement.

[festiveonion]

2 minutes ago, Kampfgeist said:

If you look at my post you'll see I wrote "fullback" with quotations, connoting fullback in positional name only - just like Juszczyk.   If you look at previous posts of mine in this thread you'll see I've made that the same point you are making.   We are in agreement.

Already noted, understood why you were doing. 
Just tired of seeing that word here is all. Think some posters are confused and wanted to reiterate what he’s going to be in this offense.
 

 

[deathstar]

PFF has Charles Clay as a good comp in their draft guide.

[Chili]

Just watching highlight videos of Deguara, Asiasi, Moss and Bryant. All similar sized prospects. The highlight videos will never show them doing the dirty work so it's hard to compare. However as receivers if i were to sort from best to worse I probably would put Asiasi first then Deguara, Bryant and finally Moss.

Asiasi looks more athletic especially with his long arms so he pops out on tape more than the other guys but I did not get any FB vibes from him even though he has the size for it. Deguara I thought played very clean with minimal fuss to his game. Moss looks a bit heavy footed but shows good body control by adjusting to difficult catches. Bryant is more nimble but he lacks power in his game.

The body types were all quite different. Bryant is fairly muscular but looks a bit skinny in his lower half and that's not great when you want a FB to be strong enough to block. Asiasi got some stockiness to him and he stands out with long arms. Moss definitely has the right body type for a full back- he's a stocky dude. Deguara is quite muscular and probably falls between Moss and Bryant but closer to Moss body type on the spectrum. I think that gave Deguara the best of both worlds and allows him to be truly versatile.

I noticed some people in various places saying we stole Deguara from the Patriots but that couldn't be further from the truth as the Patriots chose Asiasi over Deguara just three picks earlier!! 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Chili

[deathstar]

12 minutes ago, Chili said:

 

I noticed some people in various places saying we stole Deguara from the Patriots but that couldn't be further from the truth as the Patriots chose Asiasi over Deguara just three picks earlier!! 

They picked two TEs in round three I believe.

[Lieker]

1 minute ago, deathstar said:

They picked two TEs in round three I believe.

Yep! Dalton Keene. He and Deguara were guys I consistently mocked to the Packers this offseason. H-back types, versatile, high character and worth ethic, high RAS scores. Keene might have had the highest of all TE’s this Draft.

[craig]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

Honestly, I was talking more in terms of versatility.  Degaura is a guy who can literally line up all over the field.  You want him to line up in the backfield next to Aaron?  Sure.  You want him to split out wide?  Sure.  You want him to line up as an in-line blockers.  He's the anti-Marcedes Lewis in a way.  The guy is someone who is going to use in a multitude of ways.  Listen to LaFleur's vision of the offense.  He wants guys that you can't tell whether it's a run or a pass.  Degaura is exactly that.

Yup, I think your reference to Lewis is helpful, CWood.  They hired MLF with this concept of run-pass uncertainty and heavy use of TE's; I instinctively thought "run" and "heavy use of TE" equated to big, physical TE's.  But two drafts in, instead they've added two small TE's instead.  Lewis may not at all be the profile they prefer; anti-Mercedes Lewis may really be the goal.  

Lewis played ~500 snaps last year; I wonder whether that will change in either direction?  

 

 

[Chili]

2 minutes ago, Lieker said:

Yep! Dalton Keene. He and Deguara were guys I consistently mocked to the Packers this offseason. H-back types, versatile, high character and worth ethic, high RAS scores. Keene might have had the highest of all TE’s this Draft.

I've noticed that Dalton Keene did not produce much as a receiver in college. So based on his player bio his game is all about blocking.

Watching his highlight tape he clearly has the size and body type of a traditional TE and whilst he does run north/south quickly he looks a little bit stiff and awkward doing it. If you want a blocker with the odd receiving ability then he's your man.

But if you want a receiver with the capablity to block then Deguara is your man.