Rank every division’s QB situations: NFC East

[notthatbluestuff]

Hoping to get some detailed discussion comparing the QB rooms in each division in the coming months, maybe one per week. Next up, the NFC East.

Dallas Cowboys: Dak Prescott, Andy Dalton, Clayton Thorson, Ben DiNucci
New York Giants: Daniel Jones, Colt McCoy, Alex Tanney, Cooper Rush, Case Cookus
Philadelphia Eagles: Carson Wentz, Nate Sudfeld, Kyle Lauletta, Jalen Hurts
Washington Redskins: Dwayne Haskins, Kyle Allen, Alex Smith, Steven Montez

How do you rank these rooms heading into the 2020 season?

[notthatbluestuff]

Cowboys: Assuming Dak signs, he's a good QB in a great situation with truly enviable weapons this year. Dalton is easily the best backup in the division. 

Eagles: Wentz is the best QB in the division, but expecting him to play a full season is borderline insanity at this point. Sudfeld ain't bad. Who knows how Hurts pans out?

Giants: These last two are really tough. I guess it comes down to who you prefer between Jones and Haskins. Jones started brilliantly and got worse; Haskins started terribly and got better. I'll give the slightest edge to NYG if only because I like their backup situation a tiny bit better. Colt McCoy has a lot of experience. 

Redskins: Haskins was in a truly terrible situation last year and managed to steadily improve his play. I'm eager to see what he can do in a more stable environment. If he's not ready, yikes. Kyle Allen looked dreadful last year and it'll be a miracle if Alex Smith ever plays again.  

[Hunter2_1]

Eagles: Wentz, when healthy, is a top QB. They've used a pretty high draft pick on a rookie QB - so the stocks there are high

Cowboys: Dak is good. He's not elite, but he's good. He'll sign for sure, something will happen to keep him there for another 5 years or so.

Giants: Jones has shown glimpses of being a very smart, accurate QB. He's shown the exact opposite of course as well

Redskins: Haskins may be better than jones, but I just didn't see enough of it. Smith is done.

Edited May 11, 2020 by Hunter2_1

[SkippyX]

If you are talking about winning playoff games then I don’t like any of these QB rooms.

Dak is a world class fail at leader. Not taking part in the offseason at QB is insanity. Greed over team 101. Name another real QB who did this. He’s also shown that he crumpled when facing difficult times. Dak’s MVP/LVP splits vs bad/good teams last year were incredible. Dalton is a decent regular season QB and bottom 10 all-time in the playoffs. 
 

Wentz is 0-4 at being good and healthy in the same season. Hurts needs to adjust to the NFL. Wentz’s 4 seasons are all over the place. Rookie - hot start big fade. Year 2 MVP until injury. Year 3 stat guy / team anchor. Year 4 incredible effort as his team melted around him. I want healthy + great but can’t count on it yet.
 

Danny Dimes is Jameis jr until he is not.

fumbles, picks, 4th down fails defined his rookie season. And lots of NY based over the top false hype.

 

No idea what DC has in Haskins and people who think 6 quarters in late December define him are smoking something.

[Matts4313]

Cowboys

Eagles

Giants

Skins (if Alex Smith was healthy they would jump the Giants)

 

And before any of you give me crap, even the Eagles own publication recognizes that Dak is better than Wentz. Hell, an Eagles poster came up with a ranking system and Dak was better than Wentz. Statistically, in virtually every category bulk or efficiency, Dak is better than Wentz. Every advanced analytical site has Dak better than Wentz. All that while Wentz having a consistently better passblocking OL and comparable passing targets (including TE/RB catching (Remember Dallas was rated dead last in the NFL in 2018)). 

Not to mention we have arguably the best back up QB in the NFL.

 

My expectation: This thread will overwhelmingly give Wentz undo praise and call Dak mediocre. Draft bias is a real thing. And FF.com is a circle jerk of Dak hate. Presented with every single factor that proves Dak is better, people will say "Eye Test" (lol) or "Surrounding Talent" (double lol, Wentz back up won the superbowl). 

Edited May 11, 2020 by Matts4313

[Matts4313]

3 hours ago, SkippyX said:

Dak is a world class fail at leader.

Lol. Dak is an incredible leader and has shown that for 4 years. Unlike Wentz, were his teammates complain to the press about him. 

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Not taking part in the offseason at QB is insanity.

..... there has been absolutely nothing that has happened yet. Cmon man. Everyone is on their own right now. 

Offseason training starts mid-July - - So if you are going to Bash Dak... Base it on reality. Dont just make stuff up. 

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Greed over team 101. Name another real QB who did this.

100% of every QB in NFL history has taken time off when, ya know, there are no team activities and its their time off...

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He’s also shown that he crumpled when facing difficult times. Dak’s MVP/LVP splits vs bad/good teams last year were incredible. Dalton is a decent regular season QB and bottom 10 all-time in the playoffs. 

Dak is #3 in the NFL in wins against teams with a winning record last 4 years. Dallas had a +113 points and lost a 6 (?) games by a TD or less. Many of them by a fieldgoal or less. That happened while having a horrible defense and the worst special teams in the NFL. And would we like to talk about coaching or nah? 

Remember that time Tavon Austin was told not to return a punt that he could have possible scored on? 

Edited May 11, 2020 by Matts4313

[Matts4313]

For comparison sake, the 4 starters and 2 most tenured back ups:

Quote

						Passing															Rushing					Receiving
Rk	Player	From	To	AV	G	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	Rate	Lng	Int	Sk	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	NY/A	ANY/A ▼	Att	Yds	TD	Y/A	Lng	Rec	Yds	TD	Y/R	Lng
1	Dak Prescott	2016	2019	60	64	40-24-0	1363	2071	65.8	15778	97	97.0	90	36	136	826	7.6	7.77	6.77	6.92	241	1221	21	5.1	42	0	0	0		0
2	Carson Wentz	2016	2019	45	56	32-24-0	1311	2055	63.8	14191	97	92.7	73	35	129	807	6.9	7.08	6.13	6.30	206	785	3	3.8	24	2	11	0	5.5	7
3	Andy Dalton	2011	2019	98	133	70-61-2	2757	4449	62.0	31594	204	87.5	86	118	278	1738	7.1	6.82	6.32	6.06	394	1221	22	3.1	25	2	14	1	7.0	18
4	Daniel Jones	2019	2019	9	13	3-9-0	284	459	61.9	3027	24	87.7	75	12	38	295	6.6	6.46	5.50	5.38	45	279	2	6.2	26	0	0	0		0
5	Colt McCoy	2010	2019	14	39	7-21-0	560	923	60.7	6080	29	78.4	71	27	89	540	6.6	5.90	5.47	4.85	130	497	2	3.8	20	2	8	0	4.0	13
6	Dwayne Haskins	2019	2019	3	9	2-5-0	119	203	58.6	1365	7	76.1	75	7	29	204	6.7	5.86	5.00	4.25	20	101	0	5.1	23	0	0	0		0

Wentz is closer to Dalton than he is Dak... 

(⌐■_■)–︻╦╤─ @EaglesPeteC

Edited May 11, 2020 by Matts4313

[Turnobili]

Eagles - Wentz is the best, with big health concerns. Hurts isn't better than Dalton now, but is the most valuable backup QB asset in the division.

Cowboys - Dak is in the average tier of NFL starters, but he is a bona fide NFL starter, which is something they can say with a lot more certainty than the two reamining teams. Dalton is also a high end backup QB and currently the best in the division if not the league.

Giants - Daniel Jones was a roller coaster, but in the aggregate he looked better than Haskins in his limited time. He looked more ready, comfortable, and poised than Haskins did.

Redskins - I'm not writing off Haskins at all, I was of the opinion that coming out of Ohio State he needed a redshirt rookie year, but was thrust into action he wasn't ready for, and that's exactly what it looked like. He still showed pretty good accuracy but I don't think we can judge his rookie campaign much like we couldn't judge Goff, who was similarly a trainwreck in his rookie appearances.

[Nabbs4u]

On 5/11/2020 at 11:24 AM, SkippyX said:

Dak is a world class fail at leader. Not taking part in the offseason at QB is insanity. Greed over team 101

I hate you for having me defend Dak in any way shape or form, but I disagree. 

 

If anything he proved the complete and utter opposite last year when 5 other players were getting paid huge money and holding out in Cabo. He played the good little solider,  showed up, said everything positive you'd want out of your FQB via the media. All in "HOPES" of being taken care of after the season while 🙏🙏 you don't suffer as major injury during that season. Especially after having your best "statistical year" to boot.

If anything, it's a lack of Management that is the issue,  not the QB who has bent over backwards for your Organization. The one that was severely underpaid for years, allowed you to spend Millions elsewhere while your intent all along was to give him the Kirk Cousins treatment afterwards.

Damn you for making me type that.🙉🙊🙈

Edited May 13, 2020 by Nabbs4u

[Gmen]

Matts vs. Eagles posters is about to spill over into NFL General

[TOUCAN]

I find myself consistently wondering if Dak was the quarterback for any other franchise would he have the same perception that he's getting negatively or is it because he's a Cowboy.

Here's the QB situations ranked btw:

Dallas- Operating under all the pretenses of Dak being there, he's right there as the best starter (and in my opinion the best of them) in the division. Best ability is availability, and he's got that in spades. Also Dalton is easily the best backup. You can say whatever you want about Dallas' past falters, but I really put a ton of that on the coaching. Garrett was consistently outmatched.

Philadelphia- Again, availability. When he's healthy, Carson Wentz has the ability to be a top 5 QB in the league, but, we need to be fair. There's always some semblance of an injury every year. While it hasn't cost him an abundance of games, it's cost him important games. Wentz is great against awful teams, but very pedestrian against good ones. Doesn't have the best weapons but has the best coaching in the division as of this moment. Lack of depth after Wentz goes down.

Washington/New York: These 2 teams are the same, they have QBs going into their second year. Daniel Jones looked better last year, but it's hard to judge Haskins on the situation he was thrown into. Furthermore, Jones weaponry and line was definitely better. He benefits from having someone like a Saquon Barkley or an Evan Engram. McLaurin was good but outside of that, not a ton to write home about as far as receivers go and the line was just bad. Daniel Jones had the better last season for sure, but these 2 are still on the same level.

[Elky]

Wentz is the most overrated quarterback in the league. He's nowhere near top 5.

[August4th]

cowboys

Eagles

Giants

Redskins

[Matts4313]

22 minutes ago, Gmen said:

Matts vs. Eagles posters is about to spill over into NFL General

I think almost all of them have conceded that Dak and Wentz are at least the same tier QB. I have beaten them into submission. (jk)

18 minutes ago, JoshstraDaymus said:

I find myself consistently wondering if Dak was the quarterback for any other franchise would he have the same perception that he's getting negatively or is it because he's a Cowboy.

I echo this from @matt79511

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 It is incredibly obvious people want him to fail and would still find a way to discredit him if he wins three straight Super Bowls. There's nothing else to say, the virulent hate for him well exceeds that of Romo

There is more to the quote, but probably not wise to post it in NFL Gen. It would just kick over a hornets nest. 

Edited May 11, 2020 by Matts4313

[RamblinMan99]

1.  Dak Prescott's going to get his long term deal and he's only going to improve from here on out.  He's got the tangibles and intangibles to be the franchise QB for Dallas.  They have a very solid insurance policy with Andy Dalton as the backup, so they are in really good shape.  

2. Drafting Jalen Hurts was a great decision for Philadelphia given how injury prone Carson Wentz really is, and who knows whether or not Hurts will actually end up being the long term answer for them.  Nonetheless, I'm not sold on Hurts being long term due to his strong tendency to run the football.  He's nowhere near as fast as Lamar is, so I don't think that approach is going to work for him in the NFL.  Regardless, Philadelphia has something to experiment with if Wentz gets hurt again.  

3. Daniel Jones didn't have a bad rookie season by any means, but he's going to have to become more comfortable.  I don't like the idea of QBs needed mother wings on the sidelines to mentor them as they make their way to the starting role.  Jones has had a whole season to become comfortable at New York.  And, now he's in the driver's seat with Eli Manning walking out the door forever.  New York has some experienced backups in Colt McCoy and Alex Tanney.  But for Jones, there's no excuse not to be much better going into this season.  

4.  Forget about Hasbeen Haskins.  He's not going to be a starting QB in the NFL long term.  He's like the Jamarcus Russell 2.0. And, Alex Smith just needs to retire. He'll never even have another shot at a postseason game for the rest of his remaining years.  Acquiring Kyle Allen was "okay", but how good of a backup is he?  Their situation doesn't make any sense.