Which QB gives you the best chance to win a SB in the next 5 years? Russell Wilson or Lamar Jackson

[mdonnelly21]

Which QB do you think gives you the best chance to win a SB in the next 5 seasons? 

JUST LOOK AT THEM AS A QB, not based on their team, coaching and organization. 

Strictly based on them as a QB. 

[JAF-N72EX]

Just QB alone, I'm taking Wilson. Has more playoff experience and I don't believe the 3 TE set that helped Jackson last year is sustainable from year to year.

Also, the old top dog QB's who have ran the league for years are in the back end of their careers and are now in the NFC (Brady, Brees, Rodgers) . For now. Until Rodgers goes to a AFC team in 2 years. Which by then, I suspect, both Brady and Brees to be retired.

 

[Soko]

Even at 31, this is Russell Wilson. Rather decisively, tbh.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

I'm taking Russell Wilson because he's proven again and again you only need him on the field and you're a playoff contender. You can surround him with garbage at RB, OL, WR, and sometimes even defense and he will still carry you and make you a contender.

I love Lamar and think he's gonna be great and in no way is picking Russell in this thread a slight to him, it's just that Wilson might be the most truly valuable QB in the NFL right now.

[LieutenantGains]

Wilson is better, but Jackson has the way better team right now

[y*so*blu]

As a quarterback, Jackson has yet to win a playoff game. Wilson has proven clutch in the postseason time and again, and has a ring besides. On that basis alone, I'm taking Wilson.

[AntonChigurh]

Wilson, just a couple tiers better as a qb. Probably top 20 of all time already and still in his prime. 

 

[TakeTheBallDeep]

5 hours ago, AntonChigurh said:

Wilson, just a couple tiers better as a qb. Probably top 20 of all time already and still in his prime. 

 

He's borderline Top 10 for me, now that is just guys who I have seen play (late 1980s+) I think hes one of the best players I've ever seen play the game, but I know I am a little biased

[SpacemanSpiff]

If I'm strictly looking at the QB, give me Wilson all day. I think he'd be a yearly MVP candidate if he played for a team like New Orleans that was committed to featuring him on offense. Not that I necessarily disagree with the way Pete Carroll runs his football team, mind you. The guy clearly has a philosophy that has served him well over his career and he's won the highest honors in both college and pro football. I'm not gonna hate. 

[diamondbull424]

I feel like this isn’t the best hypothetical. In what scenario could we ever see this play out? How do I posit their chances of winning if I don’t know what kind of team they’re playing on? Like Wilson is locked up and same with Jackson for the next few years. Why not just ask, “who wins in their current scenario?” Or if the goal is to see who is simply the better QB “who is the superior QB in the league?”; Or if we operate under the assumption that Wilson is the better player currently; “will Jackson be a superior player to Russell Wilson in the next 5 years?”

Because if we’re asking who would you take to give you the greatest chance at a ring, over a 5 year span no less, you have to factor in situations IMO. In the “who would you rather have scenarios” you can generally factor in “x team as YOUR team” and thus their are natural tactical advantages that can be gleaned from adding the two hypothetical players. Their roster fit, how you can utilize their talent, if there is a talent surplus (and thus a law of diminishing returns) at one player’s position and not at the other players position, etc.

In this instance however there is no situation where these guys exist within a vacuum independent of external organizational influences or teammates. Even if I crafted a “neutral” team compiled of average talents/coaches conceptually, how can I quantify their chances of “winning a Super Bowl” if I don’t know what division they have to make it out of or the competency of the players around them.

I mean if I remove their coaches and team from the equation, I think the only obvious answer is that NEITHER gives me the best chance to win a SB... because they haven’t a “team” to get me there.

But in a hypothetical devoid of any details whatsoever you would essentially be forced (not that it’s a “bad thing”) to have to take Russell Wilson simply because not all coaches will WANT to make use of what Lamar brings to the table. Some coaches want a player to adapt to their system and not the other way around. You COULD put him in a more traditional QB role and he COULD over the next five years POTENTIALLY surpass Wilson’s level, but there is no guarantee that he would, while we already know what Wilson’s peak is and that he’s currently a more versatile piece.

However if I have a coach noted for his offensive mind such as a Sean Payton or Kyle Shanahan? Give me Lamar Jackson over the next 5 years, easy. I think they could put together an offense that incorporates a deep carving of passing, running, play action, roll outs, etc that would make him even more dangerous than what Greg Roman has been able to craft to this point. Plus give him 5 years for him to develop under said coach and I don’t know whose stopping him for five years straight. Mike Mayock in his last draft season noted Jackson was a superior passer/had a superior proday coming out of Louisville than Teddy Bridgewater (this when other analysts were questioning if he should play QB) and we saw what Payton could do with building a passing attack built around Teddy’s strengths vs Drew Brees.

Wilson is the superior passer of the football, it’s not close at their current levels. But at 22, I don’t think Wilson was a superior QB to Lamar at 22. Thus given a great coaching room to cultivate Lamar’s elite talents over a 5 year span and I think that’s as close a guarantee of a SB win as you could find.

Whereas we’ve seen Drew Brees, a similarly rated QB all time as Wilson, with elite coaching around him, not win a SB in a 10 year span with some of the best offenses in league history from his age 30-40 seasons. Wilson himself won his Super Bowl at 25 years old when he presented a superior dual threat ability and wasn’t draining nearly as much cap space.

TL;DR: So in a scenario where I’ve got age 32-37 Russell Wilson and a scenario where I’ve got age 23-28 Lamar Jackson, both with a quality coaching staff, only Lamar still has roughly 2-3 more seasons at a discounted rate... I’m quite easily taking Lamar in that sweet spot scenario over Wilson.

Edited May 26, 2020 by diamondbull424

[Drachma]

Wilson. He's already done it once. Lately he's been a one man band for the Seahawks on offense. I think Jackson's gimmick will come to a hault in 2020. Defenses will look at what happened when they played the Titans in the play-off's and start figuring out a way to adjust to his running ability. 

He'll need to learn how to dance and roll around in the pocket more to effect the passing game like Wilson, Mahomes, Watson & Rodgers have done to take that next step forward. But I think the Ravens are due for a down year in 2020. 

[Ray Reed]

3 hours ago, Drachma said:

Wilson. He's already done it once. Lately he's been a one man band for the Seahawks on offense. I think Jackson's gimmick will come to a hault in 2020. Defenses will look at what happened when they played the Titans in the play-off's and start figuring out a way to adjust to his running ability. 

He'll need to learn how to dance and roll around in the pocket more to effect the passing game like Wilson, Mahomes, Watson & Rodgers have done to take that next step forward. But I think the Ravens are due for a down year in 2020. 

I could find you literally 50+ quotes from this website after the 2018 season that said the exact same thing about Lamar after the Chargers playoff game in 2018. Like, the exact same quote. Word for word - just swap out "titans" for "chargers" and "2020" for "2019". And then Lamar went out and won the 2nd ever unanimous MVP in his first year starting at 22 years old in a year people were guaranteeing he'd be "figured out" by the rest of the league.

 

This thread question is Russell Wilson. I won't pretend I've seen enough from Lamar's 22 career starts to say he's a better quarterback than Russell Wilson - that's silly. And usually the better quaterback gives you a better chance at a super bowl.

But I have seen enough from him to know that every "Jackson is a gimmick that will be figured out eventually, obviously" comment I see on here - on a near-daily basis -proves just how myopic at best and ignorant at worst 95% of this website is when it comes to football. 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2020 by Ray Reed

[lancerman]

Russell if it’s all equal 

[SDotNova]

Russell Wilson without a doubt.

But Lamar can win one. So not really a knock on him. Just that Wilson has proven he can win it all and be consistently great every year.

[SaveOurSonics]

On 5/26/2020 at 8:43 AM, Ray Reed said:

I could find you literally 50+ quotes from this website after the 2018 season that said the exact same thing about Lamar after the Chargers playoff game in 2018. Like, the exact same quote. Word for word - just swap out "titans" for "chargers" and "2020" for "2019". And then Lamar went out and won the 2nd ever unanimous MVP in his first year starting at 22 years old in a year people were guaranteeing he'd be "figured out" by the rest of the league.

 

This thread question is Russell Wilson. I won't pretend I've seen enough from Lamar's 22 career starts to say he's a better quarterback than Russell Wilson - that's silly. And usually the better quaterback gives you a better chance at a super bowl.

But I have seen enough from him to know that every "Jackson is a gimmick that will be figured out eventually, obviously" comment I see on here - on a near-daily basis -proves just how myopic at best and ignorant at worst 95% of this website is when it comes to football. 

100% agree with this.

As much as people want to convince themselves otherwise, Lamar Jackson is the type of talent that defenses cannot consistently figure out. It's very similar to Michael Vick. When you have an athlete and mismatch weapon like that on offense, they will exploit the opposition's faults. 

But ya, Wilson is the fairly easy answer to this question. If he continues on this trajectory, he'll likely retire as a top 10 QB all-time. You can't assume that will be true of Lamar. 

Edited May 28, 2020 by SaveOurSonics