incognito_man Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 33 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said: Pretty much. Anybody that watched our defense this year knows that it's not anything close to the 17th defense in the league. Impossible to make that call unless one watches all defenses equally. That's the benefit of DVOA. It evens out the playing field. Unadjusted DVOA has us at the 21st ranked defense, which is what fans see on TV watching only GB. There's a slight bump for facing the 9th most difficult schedule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOnlyThing Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 1 hour ago, packerrfan74 said: been the same rhetoric since 2012 Yep. Hard to believe in retrospect how much enthusiasm there was for this D back when this thread began last summer. Looks downright silly now. After advocating for a defensive transformation after the blowout loss to Atlanta in the NFC Championship game, I too got sucked into thinking that this might at least be a better than average unit during training camp (and that was before Brooks was signed and Fackrell and Elliott were projected to be OLBs 3&4). The D, yet again, needs to be fundamentally transformed beginning with the defensive coordinator. Anything else is, as you say, the same old rhetoric. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizza In A Cup Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawaiiFan808 Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 39 minutes ago, Pizza In A Cup said: Oh lawd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesehawk Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Pizza In A Cup said: I’m just gonna point out that every single report we heard about Fackrell this past offseason was negative. If i recall, someone posted that Fackrell hadn’t beat ANYONE on 1v1s since he was drafted. Like 0/32. That’s poor management to go into a season with him as a starter.. there were below average options available that would have been better than Fackrell was. I’m all for keeping TT for at least another year, but that’s an F on his report card Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 8 minutes ago, packerrfan74 said: I’m just gonna point out that every single report we heard about Fackrell this past offseason was negative. If i recall, someone posted that Fackrell hadn’t beat ANYONE on 1v1s since he was drafted. Like 0/32. That’s poor management to go into a season with him as a starter.. there were below average options available that would have been better than Fackrell was. I’m all for keeping TT for at least another year, but that’s an F on his report card Uh...he was like #5 on the depth chart, not a starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 ILB convert then big contract time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 8 hours ago, incognito_man said: Impossible to make that call unless one watches all defenses equally. That's the benefit of DVOA. It evens out the playing field. Unadjusted DVOA has us at the 21st ranked defense, which is what fans see on TV watching only GB. There's a slight bump for facing the 9th most difficult schedule. 9th most difficult schedule does not account for... Quick, somebody post the numbers for third down percentages, time on the field, and every statistic that proves DVOA doesn't mean crap because there's no damn reason in hell why even the toughest schedule in football should account for how terrible we are on third down and just about every important defensive statistic OTHER than DVOA. I like the idea of some form of non-biased measurement of defense, but there's something wrong with DVOA's formula if they have us at 17th in the NFL. And the most damning fact of it all is that Dom Capers has repeatedly said himself that the way he judges his defense is based on a QB's passer rating. PRETTY sure we're dead last there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesehawk Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 8 hours ago, incognito_man said: Uh...he was like #5 on the depth chart, not a starter. Let's just say on the 53 man roster. Bum. It was Perry/Clay/Brooks/Fackrel/Biegel when the season started I believe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ugLymayNe Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 9 hours ago, incognito_man said: Uh...he was like #5 on the depth chart, not a starter. Fackrell had less than 20 snaps in a game only three times this season. Maybe he was the "#5" after Biegel came back and they wanted to get him on the field and Brooks was healthy, but he played more than either this season. One of Ted's worst picks in his time in GB tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 1 minute ago, ugLymayNe said: Fackrell had less than 20 snaps in a game only three times this season. Maybe he was the "#5" after Biegel came back and they wanted to get him on the field and Brooks was healthy, but he played more than either this season. One of Ted's worst picks in his time in GB tbh Too bad he stinks .. we needed that one to work out since it was our highest OLB selection since Nick Perry was drafted in 2012. Ted had better start adding some real talent at OLB this offseason or this defense will never improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 4 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said: 9th most difficult schedule does not account for... Quick, somebody post the numbers for third down percentages, time on the field, and every statistic that proves DVOA doesn't mean crap because there's no damn reason in hell why even the toughest schedule in football should account for how terrible we are on third down and just about every important defensive statistic OTHER than DVOA. I like the idea of some form of non-biased measurement of defense, but there's something wrong with DVOA's formula if they have us at 17th in the NFL. And the most damning fact of it all is that Dom Capers has repeatedly said himself that the way he judges his defense is based on a QB's passer rating. PRETTY sure we're dead last there. I agree that passer rating against is a gold standard for judging a defense and we are 30th in that currently. Our defense wildly underachieved this year for a host of reasons. I don't think we were the 17th best defense. I think 23-26ish seems about right. Points puts us at like 25th, DVOA at 17th, passer rating against at 30th. And then a slight bump for schedule. We weren't the worst, we weren't good. And it needs to get better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 25 minutes ago, incognito_man said: I agree that passer rating against is a gold standard for judging a defense and we are 30th in that currently. Our defense wildly underachieved this year for a host of reasons. I don't think we were the 17th best defense. I think 23-26ish seems about right. Points puts us at like 25th, DVOA at 17th, passer rating against at 30th. And then a slight bump for schedule. We weren't the worst, we weren't good. And it needs to get better. A well reasoned and stated post that I fully agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOnlyThing Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 12 hours ago, Pizza In A Cup said: In order to expedite the process, might as well collect all the explanations (not excuses, but "explanations") as to why Ted should in no way be held accountable for Kyler Fackrell being the worst ranked OLBer in the NFL in 2017: -Whomever it is that ranked Fackrell as the worst OLBer is either biased against the Pack or incompetent or both; -If the "explanation" above fails, try the no one, least of all the GM of the Packers, could have possibly known Fackrell was going to be this bad and anyone criticizing Fackrell now is just relying upon hindsight; -Then there is the always popular Fackrell just needs another year in the weight room (caution do not bring up the fact he turns 27 next season and is just 2 months younger than Bakhtiari); -Another good one is Fackrell only played so much in 2017 because Perry and Matthews got injured (again be sure to ignore the injury histories of Matthews and Perry in making this argument); -A new one is Peppers was dead set on getting out of GB and returning to Carolina so Ted was left with an impossible situation at OLB this offseason (if repeated often enough this might even be believed); -A new favorite, ALL problems on the defensive side of the ball are Dom's fault, ALL of them including Fackrell; and -If all else fails and you are pushed to explain why a 2016 draftee was given significant time at the all important OLB position and failed so badly that he was ranked the worst player at his position in the NFL, just go with the old standby that Fackrell was just a 3rd round pick and every GM misses sometimes but our Ted is an elite drafter so there. By no means should a Ted fan ever concede any of the following: (i) Fackrell was a bad draft pick, (ii) counting on Fackrell to be a contributor as an OLBer in 2017 was a poor decision, and (iii) the OLB position was a position of weakness in 2017 primarily because the GM failed to provide sufficient talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesehawk Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 6 minutes ago, TheOnlyThing said: By no means should a Ted fan ever concede any of the following: (i) Fackrell was a bad draft pick, (ii) counting on Fackrell to be a contributor as an OLBer in 2017 was a poor decision, and (iii) the OLB position was a position of weakness in 2017 primarily because the GM failed to provide sufficient talent. I am a TT fan and literally just listed those things as issues. Gotta be able to see both sides of the coin bro. Gonna give yourself an aneurysm being so hell bent on the negativity. No GM is perfect. Acknowledge his weaknesses and shortcomings but don't forget to praise his successes. All hail TT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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