2021 FA and Trade Talks

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, mattmanz91 said:

The "then what" is we go 8-8 or 7-9 and have to either trade for a vet or trade up in the draft for a QB when we could have just used the #2 pick this year, which we already have, to draft a QB.

Really he finished 2019 going 6-2, let's not forget that. All with an awful HC, awful OL and poor weapons.

This is a typical what have you done for me lately response along with just wanting change. So Wilson is good bc he had a good 2020 (and you'll look past his awful 2018 and 2019). But Darnold who had flashes as rookie and more or less had a very good 2019 for a 2nd year QB given what he had. And a very poor 2020. Is just trash and we need to move on?

Come on Man.

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, Rockice_8 said:

The fact that you had to back that far should tell you all you need to know.  The NFL is begging for guys to throw for 4,000 yards.  Sam is one of the worst starters in the NFL that is fact.

You want to bank on this great improvement year 4 by all means I'm not because we are in position to land a great prospect Wilson or Fields without having to do a thing.  I'm not passing on that chance in hopes Sam does the impossible I'm sorry Im just not.

With working with THE WORST NFL HC. Still a very weak OL and THE WORST supporting skill position cast.

Yes an improved staff (which has already happened) should help him big time. You'd have to imagine JD will always still value OL to help a QB. And I'd imagine help the skill positions as well. His situation and confidence level should nearly be completely different than that of 2019. 

[mattmanz91]

17 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Really he finished 2019 going 6-2, let's not forget that. All with an awful HC, awful OL and poor weapons.

This is a typical what have you done for me lately response along with just wanting change. So Wilson is good bc he had a good 2020 (and you'll look past his awful 2018 and 2019). But Darnold who had flashes as rookie and more or less had a very good 2019 for a 2nd year QB given what he had. And a very poor 2020. Is just trash and we need to move on?

Come on Man.

Not at all, I'd love for Sam to turn it around and be everything we all want him to be. What I'm saying is, given the direction both QBs you mentioned are trending, expecting Sam to be good is a much greater risk than drafting Wilson and expecting him to be good. Sam flashed and finished well in 2019 and then became literally the worst QB in the NFL in 2020. Despite poor coaching and lack of weapons he was still throwing terrible ints, completely missing wide open receivers that were his second read and getting awful happy feet and taking terrible sacks. Zach wilson played through injury and had mediocre seasons, was 100% healthy in 2020, practiced hard to make improvements and lit it up in 2020. Give me to guy trending up over the guy trending down any day all day. 

Edited February 5, 2021 by mattmanz91

[Rockice_8]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

With working with THE WORST NFL HC. Still a very weak OL and THE WORST supporting skill position cast.

Yes an improved staff (which has already happened) should help him big time. You'd have to imagine JD will always still value OL to help a QB. And I'd imagine help the skill positions as well. His situation and confidence level should nearly be completely different than that of 2019. 

He missed open guys over and over last year.  He had happy feet when the OL held up.  Go look at any of his tape from last year. 

I'm not banking on him going into a contract year to make the jump to where we need him to be.

Wilson/Fields are both better prospects, they don't have the bad habits Sam does and we'd reset the money which is another reason to pull the trigger now.  We don't have trade up and waste assets.

Sam is broken.  Time to move on especially if someone is willing to cough up a 1st.  You do that every single time.  There's not even a shred of hesitation on my end.  Bye Sam wish you the best.

Edited February 5, 2021 by Rockice_8

[KingOfNewYork]

I think its more likely Darnold held this team back than the team held him back. 

[doumeyer]

On this QB debate right now, every one of you people all have a strong points. Like I said the other day this will be one of he toughest second over pick in the draft any and NFL GM has vey have to make. What does Douglas due, Keep Darnold, and rebuild the roster, or draft one of the top QB's in the draft, or trade for Watson and give away the store. All I know we must rebuild the roster, no matter who Douglas has at QB next year, we will never win with our current roster.

[xrade]

Here is an interesting thought piece regarding “trading” for Wentz. In short, the Jets would take Wentz and his high cap hit giving cap relief to Philly and taking a disgruntled player. In return the Jets receive draft capital maybe even a future FRP. As for Wentz the QB, maybe he could play well again but the trade is really about cap relief and draft assets. Hmmm.....

https://thejetpress.com/2021/02/04/ny-jets-trade-carson-wentz-condition/

[ekill08x]

1 hour ago, xrade said:

Here is an interesting thought piece regarding “trading” for Wentz. In short, the Jets would take Wentz and his high cap hit giving cap relief to Philly and taking a disgruntled player. In return the Jets receive draft capital maybe even a future FRP. As for Wentz the QB, maybe he could play well again but the trade is really about cap relief and draft assets. Hmmm.....

https://thejetpress.com/2021/02/04/ny-jets-trade-carson-wentz-condition/

There is no way Philly trades Wentz and ends up giving up as well. This article is going to be a massive swing and miss in terms of predicting the trade when the Eagles still end up getting a decent return for him. 

[xrade]

11 minutes ago, ekill08x said:

There is no way Philly trades Wentz and ends up giving up as well. This article is going to be a massive swing and miss in terms of predicting the trade when the Eagles still end up getting a decent return for him. 

That may be true, but Philly is currently $50+M over the cap. They can’t cut him, but they could trade him. Why? Cap savings, poor play and he wants out. The question that should be asked is why keep him?  As for compensation, who is going to give up draft picks for an overpriced, underperforming 29 y.o. QB. It is a salary dump and salary dumps will cost the dumping team. The article mentions Osweiler and Goff. Tell me, would you trade for him and at at what cost?  If you were the Philly GM what would you do?

 In essence the Jets would be “buying” draft picks. 

[Jag68Sid87]

I think we need to define what talent is. We are suggesting here that Sam Darnold is the best young quarterback this franchise has had since Joe Namath. OK, so what is talent? Is the ability to read defenses a talent? The ability to sense trouble in the pocket? Is footwork in tight spaces a talent? Because if they are, Darnold is among the worst I have seen (not just wearing Gang Green colors, either). Is thinking the game a talent? 

What I am suggesting here is, give me Chad Pennington every day of the week over Sam Darnold. Pennington had one fatal flaw, he had a noodle arm and then he got hurt and that noodle arm became progressively worse. Otherwise, he had what it takes to be a successful QB in the NFL: brains, awareness, presence, leadership, creativity, accuracy.

Again, if 14 is our QB in 2021, I will root for him to succeed...knowing full well what the ultimate outcome will be. To me, we would merely be delaying the inevitable if we kept him.

[ekill08x]

17 minutes ago, xrade said:

That may be true, but Philly is currently $50+M over the cap. They can’t cut him, but they could trade him. Why? Cap savings, poor play and he wants out. The question that should be asked is why keep him?  As for compensation, who is going to give up draft picks for an overpriced, underperforming 29 y.o. QB. It is a salary dump and salary dumps will cost the dumping team. The article mentions Osweiler and Goff. Tell me, would you trade for him and at at what cost?  If you were the Philly GM what would you do?

 In essence the Jets would be “buying” draft picks. 

Depending on what they would be giving us, it would be really interesting. Wentz has had success but hes declined a little every year since the Super Bowl season. If they were really giving up a bunch to get rid of him it would be hard to pass up on. There just seems to be a ton of red flags with coaching this guy.

[Jag68Sid87]

14 minutes ago, ekill08x said:

Depending on what they would be giving us, it would be really interesting. Wentz has had success but hes declined a little every year since the Super Bowl season. If they were really giving up a bunch to get rid of him it would be hard to pass up on. There just seems to be a ton of red flags with coaching this guy.

In fact, the reports are that Philly wants multiple firsts to trade Wentz. 

He will either be dealt for less than that, but not with Philly adding, or he will remain the backup in Philly.

There is nothing to suggest Wentz is going to be given away.

[xrade]

36 minutes ago, Jag68Sid87 said:

In fact, the reports are that Philly wants multiple firsts to trade Wentz. 

He will either be dealt for less than that, but not with Philly adding, or he will remain the backup in Philly.

There is nothing to suggest Wentz is going to be given away.

It is true there is nothing to suggest what the article states. It is a thought piece. It is not an opinion or report or even a speculative assumption. The question to me, is it out of the realm of possibility that something like that happens?  It really is not unlike the Osweiller trade. Philly really has no negotiating stance, unlike Houston. Wentz will cost $35M this year. Does Philly really want to spend that on an unhappy backup?  All I am saying is do not be shocked if Philly has to give up high end draft capital to get rid of him.

[KimuraGod]

You’d be a fool to trade first round picks for Wentz. We would have to take draft picks to take him off phillys hands. 

[doumeyer]

1 hour ago, xenajets said:

You’d be a fool to trade first round picks for Wentz. We would have to take draft picks to take him off phillys hands. 

I agree, how did this crazy talk start about trading for Wentz. Our concern  right now has to be at WR position if we lose Perriman, all we got left is Crowder & Mims & a bunch of no names. And when we pick at 23 all the top WR's will be gone. This is just another problem for Douglas .And we have not seen enough of Mims to know if he is the next coming of OBJ. Mims spent more have the season in sick bay.