Week 8 GDT: MNF - Broncos @ Chiefs

[thebestever6]

Why wasn't dt more involved that corner can't cover him he should have 200 yards and 2 tds

[Joe_is_the_best]

2 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

Why wasn't dt more involved that corner can't cover him he should have 200 yards and 2 tds

Who knows. He was open all night.

[broncos67]

Just now, Joe_is_the_best said:

Who knows. He was open all night.

Probably because his QB can't get him the ball

[1234567]

Doesn't matter how good your defense is, you can't win games when you turn the ball over five times. Crappy thing is, we actually put up pretty good rushing numbers tonight, and overall I thought McCoy called a great game. Players just didn't execute. If Denver wants to save this season they're gonna have to trade for a competent QB or we can kiss the year goodbye. Mentally, Siemian is finished. 

[Broncofan]

4 positives I take from this game:

1.   CJ/Booker look like a legit run/pass combo.   JC isn't in our 2018 plans, so looking to 2018 here.  Booker's not by any means a lock in the run game yet, but he's way more decisive, and much better vision.  Def. think his 2H 2016 struggles were the rookie wall.  Nothing I've seen changes that assessment.

2.   Our run D is legit - which is saying something, because we're doing it with Marshall on one good shoulder, and pretty much nothing from the other ILB spot.   I'll admit I was wrong on Peko, nothing in pass rush, but that's not the NT role - he's been fine.    Ray coming back did help our run game and our pass rush was better - Smith is just that good at avoiding sacks, give him credit.   Our pass D also showed up bigtime with one notable exception (more on that later).  We showed a ton of heart on D, should have been down 28-0 or 31-3, but somehow only down 17-3 at 1H end because of our D.

3.  We actually had a run game.   OL was much better in OL, and Anderson was awesome.  Booker was very effective, albeit game script might have made it easier to succeed then.

4.   No one who is core to our team got hurt (I'm reaching, I know).

 

The bad....

1.  OL pass pro - Dee Ford left the game, so we actually caught a break - but we got beat many, many times.   More Watson than Bolles, and interior pressure many times, too.  Not that it was the biggest problem, but with us going to PHI, this is going to be a huge issue vs. that front 4, they're going to eat us alive.

2.  Bennie Fowler - I said it before, I'll say it again - I don't know how he got handed the 3rd WR automatically coming out of TC.   His drop was a killer, and not the only one.  I just don't see a guy worthy of being above the others.   Saw it in spades tonight.

3.  Using 3 RB's - unless a guy is hurt, we should be going 2-RB, and since they're our future, no sense in investing any more time in JC.    He's not someone we can let get more than 8-10 touches a game, because of the risk he breaks down - but that's just killing CJ's ability to get into a rhythm, or see what we have in Booker - don't ever see him as a bellcow, but need to see if he can be our regular 3rd down guy and 2-min drill guy.   No point in having 2 of those guys if the season's getting away from us, go with youth.   Plus, JC's revenge narrative probably hurt us, he was going for the extra yard and got stood up for the strip/fumble-6.    Damn.

 

The just plain awful:

4.  Siemian - I said it before, he's the best option we have to win 2017 games.  Sadly, that's somehow still the case - but that's an awful thing to say, because he's not even the 2016 version who was mostly safe in his decision makings.  Now he's seeing ghosts, and making awful decisions that we'd have killed Lynch for doing, saying Trevor doesn't do that - but he is now.   Worst was he's clearly lost all confidence, because the game's sped up for him - that 2nd INT, he had 15 yards easy, and somehow threw it up for grabs and a pick.  Crusher.

5.  McKenzie - again, there's still time to turn it around for a 5th rounder long-term - but he doesn't belong on the field making those mistakes.  It's not even the fumble - the next return, he's showed ZERO lesson learned, handling the ball like a loaf of bread.   Mistakes happen, but to learn absolutely nothing?    Bruuuuutal.

6.  Our TE pass D - I don't have a problem with Kelce just beating our guys on 50-50 balls, but you can't allow that TD and 30+ yard 4Q play by letting him get a free release.

7.  Our ST - they just suck, forget about McKenzie (who at 5 fumbles is completely unacceptable), our coverage isn't anything great.   I am willing to be patient with every other coach, but Olivo has delivered literally nothing.   He's gone at year's end unless there's a massive turnaround.

All in all, unless we can pull an upset in 1 of our next 2 games, which looks like a pipe dream, then we're thinking 2018.    Next week is going to be a total gong show @ PHI.  Ugh.

[Broncofan]

EDIT:  Renck changed the tweet to a possible QB change.  Which because it's @PHI, I get why it won't be Lynch.  And vs. NE would be a PR disaster.

Guessing unless we somehow split the next 2 games, it's Lynch week 11 as we will be looking firmly to 2018 mode.  The Q is likely whether it's Oz vs. Siemian next week.  UGH.

 

 

#Broncos Joseph didn't rule out QB change. Said Oline played better. D played well enough to win. Will look At film #Denver7

11:54 PM - Oct 30, 2017

 

[7DnBrnc53]

2 hours ago, Broncofan said:

EDIT:  Renck changed the tweet to a possible QB change.  Which because it's @PHI, I get why it won't be Lynch.  And vs. NE would be a PR disaster.

Guessing unless we somehow split the next 2 games, it's Lynch week 11 as we will be looking firmly to 2018 mode.  The Q is likely whether it's Oz vs. Siemian next week.  UGH.

 

 

#Broncos Joseph didn't rule out QB change. Said Oline played better. D played well enough to win. Will look At film #Denver7

11:54 PM - Oct 30, 2017

 

Won't be Lynch? That's a shock. I thought that's who Elway wanted in there. 

[jolly red giant]

I put the blame for this loss at the feet of Joseph - he was hired, supposedly, because he was a motivator of men - well he has motivated this offence into the worst in the league at the moment.

[broncosfan07]

I mean you can't coach players to not suck. At some point the players deserve their share of the blame. I can't coach you to throw to open receivers or catch the ball. 

 

Plain and simple it has been proven time and time again Trevor is not a QB who is going to win you a game unless it goes absolutely perfect. There is absolutely no reason for him to see the field again when he has actively proved he will in fact lose you the game.

[Broncofan]

4 hours ago, 7DnBrnc53 said:

Won't be Lynch? That's a shock. I thought that's who Elway wanted in there. 

It’s going to be Lynch ultimately.   But starting him @ PHI then facing B.B. at home just seems like a tall order.  Especially after just 1 week of returning to practice. 

Still we know Oz is just a backup level talent.  So anything is possible TBH it could easily be Lynch.  But it would also speak volumes about how we see Oz if we go Lynch this early after such little practice time and being so far behind in the PS.  

For sure Lynch is getting in there as we are looking more and more like a team destined to go for 2018 than this year, it’s just a Q of when IMO.  

[BroncosFan2010]

Yep, its time to make a QB change. Trevor gave me hope to begin the year, but its clear that at his best he is a QB that can win a game when things around him are working perfectly. That's the trait of a backup. He has lost his calm, field scanning demeanor after all the edge pressures and while that's on the OT, a true franchise caliber guy can make things work even in the face of pressure. Its clear he isn't the answer as a starter and that we need to field other options.

Its crazy but I am ready to see Chad Kelly. Brock isn't taking this team anywhere. Unless we think Kelly could also be broken mentally due to pressure given up by the OL, we need to see what he has. Lynch is likely still injured and Chad might have the swagger this team needs offensively. What do we have to lose? This team isn't making the playoffs unless we have a huge win streak and that only happens if we strike lightning in a bottle at the QB position. Brock isn't bringing any lightning.

We need to see what we have in Chad, see what we have in Lynch, just try every option. And its likely neither show enough. But we need to know. Because if in the very likely even that neither show enough, we need to go out and sign a premier QB this offseason. The defense is STILL good enough to put a mediocre offense on its back and go deep in the playoffs, but that wont be forever. We WILL decline defensively at some point. Its inevitable. But that point isn't a certain season, and if we can bring this defense back next year at a similar level, improve RT and have a competent QB, we can win a lot of games. Teddy Bridgewater on a incentive laden deal might be the most realistic we can hope for, which is a bit sad because Teddy is the player I thought Trevor could be. And even then, Teddy is far from a sure thing and has the frame of a long distance runner. Ugh. The options are just so limited.

We need to switch to one of the kids at QB, revert to a ground-and-pound offense and limit the kid to 20-25 passes a game. CJ, Booker and Charles all got 4.9 YPC or more last night on 29 total carries. That's a nice amount of carries for a team with a competent QB but we need to take a page from the book-of-Fox and run the ball until 45+ times. I want a 70-30 split. Its the best move at this point.

[champ11]

1 hour ago, BroncosFan2010 said:

Yep, its time to make a QB change. Trevor gave me hope to begin the year, but its clear that at his best he is a QB that can win a game when things around him are working perfectly. That's the trait of a backup. He has lost his calm, field scanning demeanor after all the edge pressures and while that's on the OT, a true franchise caliber guy can make things work even in the face of pressure. Its clear he isn't the answer as a starter and that we need to field other options.

Its crazy but I am ready to see Chad Kelly. Brock isn't taking this team anywhere. Unless we think Kelly could also be broken mentally due to pressure given up by the OL, we need to see what he has. Lynch is likely still injured and Chad might have the swagger this team needs offensively. What do we have to lose? This team isn't making the playoffs unless we have a huge win streak and that only happens if we strike lightning in a bottle at the QB position. Brock isn't bringing any lightning.

We need to see what we have in Chad, see what we have in Lynch, just try every option. And its likely neither show enough. But we need to know. Because if in the very likely even that neither show enough, we need to go out and sign a premier QB this offseason. The defense is STILL good enough to put a mediocre offense on its back and go deep in the playoffs, but that wont be forever. We WILL decline defensively at some point. Its inevitable. But that point isn't a certain season, and if we can bring this defense back next year at a similar level, improve RT and have a competent QB, we can win a lot of games. Teddy Bridgewater on a incentive laden deal might be the most realistic we can hope for, which is a bit sad because Teddy is the player I thought Trevor could be. And even then, Teddy is far from a sure thing and has the frame of a long distance runner. Ugh. The options are just so limited.

We need to switch to one of the kids at QB, revert to a ground-and-pound offense and limit the kid to 20-25 passes a game. CJ, Booker and Charles all got 4.9 YPC or more last night on 29 total carries. That's a nice amount of carries for a team with a competent QB but we need to take a page from the book-of-Fox and run the ball until 45+ times. I want a 70-30 split. Its the best move at this point.

Pretty much agree. I wouldn't freak out like a lot of people if Trevor played the next two games and then they put Lynch in, but switching to Brock is fine. God twitter will have a field day with that. I know not too many of you are on twitter, but Brock was 10000% the biggest joke in sports last season lol.

Don't foresee  them giving Kelly a shot, but if he's healthy and you see Lynch in a few games idk why not. 

[Kmart128]

There has been rumors flying that you guys are interested in one of our OT depth players. The 1st player to come to mind is Sentrel Henderson. Loads of talent but had a problem with a sickness, used marijuana to cure it and got suspended. Well while he was gone he lost his job. There has also been talk that we are looking for a running mate for McCoy.

So what do you think of this trade?

Sentrel Henderson for Devontae Booker... Seems like a better fit for both players

[broncos67]

There's so much blame for this loss I don't even know where to start.

First, the positives:

- Our run defense is absolutely stellar. Joe Woods did a masterful job in this area and it shouldn't be overlooked. His defense is better than Wade's was last year. The zone is annoying, but in general, this team has been absolutely as good as you could be in today's NFL on the defensive side of the ball.

- The running game and offensive playcalling was good this game, for the most part. Even with Charles' fumble, all the backs had lanes to run. This is a testament to the OL. Leary is a great addition- he's been as good as advertised.

Okay, that was a whopping two. Now for my favorite part.

- Trevor Siemian sucks. Nothing more needs to be said. He's totally rattled. He's regressed, and it's time for him to sit on the bench.

- Menelik Watson sucks. Another bargain bin garbage FA signing from Elway at the RT position. He's a freaking turnstile, it's horrific.

- Isaiah McKenzie sucks. There is not currently a justifiable reason for him to be on the roster. He cannot catch. He cannot return kicks adequately and that's literally his whole reason for being drafted. Sorry, if he played on the Patriots, he'd be gone and we'd move on. That's why they're so successful- admit mistakes quickly and deal with them. McKenzie is horrendous. Time for Langley to get a try.

- Brock Olivo needs to be fired. Seriously, I don't think this is an overreaction. Can anyone name anything good about our ST unit? We have a kicker in a slump, a punter who has regressed, no return game to speak of, we get gashed on kickoffs to the point where we had to concede field position last night with short kicks as a way to NOT get gashed. Olivo is trash- it was an olive branch for the Dave Toub fans but now it's time to get someone competent.

- Every WR behind Thomas/Sanders should be off the team by the end of the year. Fowler is an incompetent bundle of nerves. Latimer does nothing. Taylor, meh. Let Henderson play because of the big play "potential" but this team needs to find some veteran options who can do anything and are dynamic. They should be trading for someone like Martavis Bryant, IMO. 

- Vance Joseph needs to make a QB change. It's symbolic more than anything. This team is an abject mess offensively, but they need to do something. The defensive players are already getting mad (a good thing, IMO) and we need to start giving the appearance of caring. Frankly, the absolute best thing for Denver right now is to finish 4-12 or something and get a high pick. The rare opportunity to have a solid unit (defense) and add a potentially franchise changing player offensively would be huge. It happened once with Von, we need that chance again.

- This offseason better be different than the past few have been or else people are going to start turning on Elway. There's already a chorus of fans smart enough to see that he's failed in building this years team. I'm revising my percentage to 70% of this falls on Elway. There is so little contribution from young players on this team it's sickening. Look at literally every other good team in the league and notice that they have young contributors (meaningful contributors, not just guys on the roster) and then compare that here. The talent identification and acquisition through the draft is an absolute joke. It's actually disgraceful. Offensively, I can barely name any young guys who appear to be long-term contributors. You have Bolles and Paradis. Maybe Jake Butt? The Henderson(s) are complete question marks. No young QB. It's a trainwreck. I'm not sure it's any better on defense. Gotsis has become average which is not what you want out of your 2nd round pick, but I suppose it's better than the performances of Osweiler/Latimer/Sambrailo/Ball etc...that we've whiffed on. Where is Demarcus Walker? Shane Ray is a nice complement to Von, but he's been hurt. At least he's made a small impact. ILB is a mess. Marshall has a big contract but has been playing meh. Todd Davis blows. In the secondary we have veterans (part of why we are so good). Simmons is getting there, he's definitely a core piece. I struggle with my feelings on Parks. Honestly, he's JAG to me- maybe slightly better. 

So in total, we have next to no young building blocks.  We're relying on FA to build our team and eventually that was going to catch up. Denver needs to go back to the well this offseason. There are no sacred cows. You keep some core pieces, and you draft for true BPA. No more locking in on players. I'll give them a pass with Bolles ONLY because the need was so glaringly obvious. But Elway needs to knock it off with targeting specific 2nd and 3rd rounders instead of BPA. Our inability to draft meaningful contributors in Round 2-4 has been, by far, the biggest achilles heel of this team and it's why we are where we are.

[broncos67]

1 minute ago, marshawn lynch said:

There has been rumors flying that you guys are interested in one of our OT depth players. The 1st player to come to mind is Sentrel Henderson. Loads of talent but had a problem with a sickness, used marijuana to cure it and got suspended. Well while he was gone he lost his job. There has also been talk that we are looking for a running mate for McCoy.

So what do you think of this trade?

Sentrel Henderson for Devontae Booker... Seems like a better fit for both players

Booker is our best RB (IMO) so I'd hate to trade him for Seantrel. I do think Buffalo would make a good trading partner with Denver, but I'd rather we part with draft picks since we're unable to use them properly anyway.