2023 NFL Draft Prospects

[Madmike90]

Just now, RunningVaccs said:

The only counterpoint I have looks like, sounds like, and is in fact, Mike McCarthy. 

I guess it's nice fans aren't hunting Eberfluseses'daughters on Instagram (Trestman era, really happened) but I really struggle to see what this staff is above average at. I do applaud the decision to start moving Fields around, but frankly I think it only happened when all the bears fans in Chicago yelled "move the pocket!"all at the same time. 

Not saying you can't win a lot with these guys, but I really think they'll go exactly as far as Fields takes them. 

No dude...No.

[StLunatic88]

35 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

 

This is a massive shock IMO.

But….. why?

Not that I would even be targeting him, but just seems weird 

[Madmike90]

1 minute ago, StLunatic88 said:

But….. why?

Not that I would even be targeting him, but just seems weird 

Yeah to me he was playing all season as if he just didn't want to get hurt so he could then go to the pros...maybe he was hurt all year and trying to play through it? Maybe he really believes in Jayden Daniels in year 2? Like you said just weird.

[beardown3231]

3 hours ago, RunningVaccs said:

Eberflus* strikes me as the dead-average kind of HC that might end up being respected mostly because of having a specail QB on his team.  Fine by me if he gets carried up by Fields. I've really seen zero special traits or ideas. He'd make en excellent neighbor even if he's probably a bit fussy about his lawn. 

What's the cost difference in FA for DT and edge rushers at the top?  I don't really think either Carter or Anderson is going to be world beaters, but understand that Carter probably fits better. Even so aren't pass rushers usually more $, so maybe it makes sense to get Anderson for when we are eventually on a budget again?

 

*If I had time and motivation I would creat "Mark Uberfleece" on twitter as some kind of alternate universe Eberflus. Crazy innovative but unstable genius coach.  

What makes you think this?

[Sugashane]

2 hours ago, StLunatic88 said:

You are basing all of this on the DE play? Of guys who likely wouldn’t start for 30 other teams, and only sub package players for like half the league right now?

Seems like an unrealistic bar to measure by

Of course that isn't all. But if you're a DE and constantly getting sucked in so they get outside of you there are two possibilities.

1- you screwed up and blew your assignment or

2- your scheme didn't account for contain and is a blatantly stupid call

If it's 1 then the coach has to make a change. Benching them for failures, getting a wider alignment, or ensuring that the OLB is scraping to contain. Idc if you have to make a statement by putting a DT out there because of how inept the DEs are. You said it yourself, these guys likely wouldn't start anywhere else, so what exactly are you losing? 

If it's 2 then either aid your DC or just take the reigns back on playcalling. 

But we have the fewest sacks, the worst 3rd down percentage, etc. That comes in a large way with a lack of talent but there is no urgency or creativity on defense. If we all know our DL sucks, if we all can see there's no pressure coming from 4, them why aren't we trying anything else? We blitz only 16% of the time, if your guy cant beat the guy across from him then you have to try and manufacture pressure. We don't even try. We have the league worst 16 knockdowns in the league, the next 5 have played one less game than us. We're 10 behind the next team with 13 games. We don't even put a QB down 4 times for every 100 passes? If your scheme can't function because of talent, then at least try to outcoach the guy across from you. 

I wasn't excited about the hiring in all honesty but what has he shown us? He bungled the situation with Jenkins and Patrick- how has anyone watched them and believed they were remotely the same player? They could spot Jones' talent but not see Patrick and Mustipher are garbage? Time management I can kind of ignore because he is a rookie HC, but he's been coaching for decades too. His handling of an obviously hurt Fields was criminal. As was watching Fields get mauled for the first what, 6 weeks? Knowing the OL sucked and getting a few weeks of proof they were still setting him up for failure with straight dropbacks and rarely chipping. Defensive coach or not he isn't football illiterate, he should know how outmatched that group is with a 4 on 5 or 5 on 5 set. At some point I want to see what he brings to the table. Nagy was a player's coach apparently but that meant squat when he was solely propped up by his defense. Penalties are down but when you can't even sniff a QB you take out almost any chance of a roughing the passer. Lol

Getsy at least finally adjusted though, we are still hoping Eberflus and Williams will/can. I want to measure the differences between the 2023 defense and 2022 defense. With real talent added there should be a dramatic improvement almost across the board. 

[StLunatic88]

30 minutes ago, Sugashane said:

Getsy at least finally adjusted though, we are still hoping Eberflus and Williams will/can.

Please point to the Justin Fields on defense…..

The only talent we do have on defense is in the secondary and they have been a rotating trauma ward since like week 4.

To pretend we can take anything away from this defense is fools errand.

 

And I’m still waiting on what gives you any idea that any professional team would choose their OC over their HC (who hired him). Remember when everyone was up in arms that Byron Leftwitch didn’t get hired as a HC? How’s that going these days?

[AZBearsFan]

4 hours ago, StLunatic88 said:

But….. why?

Not that I would even be targeting him, but just seems weird 

He has special talent but had a bad season. Daniels is a senior and kinda stinks. Boutte had one game with Nussmeier instead of Daniels (the last one) and all of a sudden looked like we expected him to look all year.

I think with a better QB situation in 2023 Boutte’s draft stock would skyrocket again. I don’t know if they see a huge future for Nussmeier, but LSU will probably be a really desirable spot for transfer portal QBs this offseason, especially with Boutte coming back. 

[StLunatic88]

7 hours ago, AZBearsFan said:

I think with a better QB situation in 2023 Boutte’s draft stock would skyrocket again. I don’t know if they see a huge future for Nussmeier, but LSU will probably be a really desirable spot for transfer portal QBs this offseason, especially with Boutte coming back. 

2 things

Daniels still has eligibility for 2023, and has already used his free transfer. So it’s either LSU or the NFL for next season. 

And Boutte is a special talent that is likely already a 1st round prospect, a pretty high one. He is going to make his draft move in workouts and interviews, not with another season in college. That works for some guys, but if that’s the reason he is going back, he’s getting bad advice, he’s likely to expose himself more, not improve his stock enough to take that risk

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

10 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

What makes you think this?

What does this staff do well? Tell their guys to hustle? That's not exactly football-industry-disruptive there. 

For every dose of basic football competency above Nagy (BFCAN) there's a bunch of weird timeouts and personnel decisions that don't make sense.

I'm accepting that this team might be good when the talent gets better, but I'm just saying I see nothing special about the coaching. 

 

And my Mike McCarthy example wasn't too celebrate him, just pointing out that with a great QB and some good bounces a very average couch can win it all. I agree he sucks don't worry.

[Bigbear72]

44 minutes ago, RunningVaccs said:

What does this staff do well? Tell their guys to hustle? That's not exactly football-industry-disruptive there. 

For every dose of basic football competency above Nagy (BFCAN) there's a bunch of weird timeouts and personnel decisions that don't make sense.

I'm accepting that this team might be good when the talent gets better, but I'm just saying I see nothing special about the coaching. 

 

And my Mike McCarthy example wasn't too celebrate him, just pointing out that with a great QB and some good bounces a very average couch can win it all. I agree he sucks don't worry.

So my take is this. I agree we haven't seen much that truly stands out. However, the things that you point out as flaws can be said about most coaching staffs in the league. Additionally, just as we have stated on countless occasions that judgement should be reserved for Fields due to lack of talent around him, shouldn't we be taking that approach with the coaching staff? Let's see what things look like with an influx of talent first. If you don't have the horses you just don't have the horses. I do believe that the staff does do a good job of making adjustment during the game and have made adjustments throughout the season. 

I think that what you guys are looking for, truthfully, doesn't happen very often. How many elite coaches are there really? Four, maybe five, if that. To further that, how many elite coaches were elite to start? I get that we live in an era of immediate gratification but sustained success takes time. No dynasty, sports or otherwise, was built in a day.

[AZBearsFan]

1 hour ago, StLunatic88 said:

2 things

Daniels still has eligibility for 2023, and has already used his free transfer. So it’s either LSU or the NFL for next season. 

And Boutte is a special talent that is likely already a 1st round prospect, a pretty high one. He is going to make his draft move in workouts and interviews, not with another season in college. That works for some guys, but if that’s the reason he is going back, he’s getting bad advice, he’s likely to expose himself more, not improve his stock enough to take that risk

1. I’m not up on the transfer portal eligibility rules and don’t remember how the 2020 covid season impacted eligibility, but Daniels has started for 4 seasons (3 at ASU and 1 at LSU). Does the portal grant a 5th year of eligibility? Or does 2020 not count? Not saying you’re wrong - just don’t know for sure.

2. Boutte was thought by most to be a top 10ish pick coming into the season but then really underwhelmed this year (538 yards in 11 games), and doesn’t have JSN’s injury excuse. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if he slid entirely out of the 1st round, but if he even thinks he slid out of the first round he could potentially be looking at more guaranteed money on NIL to stay in college than to hit the draft this year. He’s only 20 years old right now too (2002 birthday) so it’s not like staying an extra year in college will make him an “old” prospect next year either. 

I mentioned JSN for this a few days back too, but Boutte is a guy who would make a ton of sense to me at USC with Caleb Williams next year via the portal with Jordan Addison presumably heading to the NFL. That would seem to be an environment for him to put himself right back into that elite prospect discussion. Nobody is likely to pass Harrison Jr. as WR1 next year, but Boutte could definitely be WR2 with a bounce back 2023 season. Right now at best I’d say he’s WR4 in this year’s class (behind Johnston, Addison and JSN in some order), and maybe further down than that behind guys like Jalin Hyatt and Rashee Rice, both of whom also have high upside NFL traits and who had much better 2022 showings than he did. 

[Madmike90]

Anyone else starting to worry that Jared Goff is becoming Ryan Tannehill for the Lions and that could mess up the idea of them taking a QB should they finish about us? Dan Campbell clearly wants to play a brand of football built around physicality and toughness up front...I could see them passing up on Stroud or Levis to take a Jalen Carter and that would really suck...just goes to show how important it is that we finish with the 2nd overall pick if we want everything on the table...

Speaking of having everything on the table it is basically impossible to figure out what direction we will go in terms of players in FA or the draft right now because we have so many needs and so limited knowledge of what Poles & Flus are going to truely value.

[StLunatic88]

1 hour ago, AZBearsFan said:

1. I’m not up on the transfer portal eligibility rules and don’t remember how the 2020 covid season impacted eligibility, but Daniels has started for 4 seasons (3 at ASU and 1 at LSU). Does the portal grant a 5th year of eligibility? Or does 2020 not count? Not saying you’re wrong - just don’t know for sure.

So 2020 just doesnt count for anyone, thats why we are seeing such old teams, and as a result, old drafts. That will be over in a few years

And his one free and clear transfer was used for the move from ASU to LSU

Now looking at it though, I guess he could transfer again as a Grad Transfer? But is he there yet being at ASU and LSU? Especially the way he left ASU?  Not sure, and I havent heard a single thing about that or headed to the NFL at this point

1 hour ago, AZBearsFan said:

2. Boutte was thought by most to be a top 10ish pick coming into the season but then really underwhelmed this year (538 yards in 11 games), and doesn’t have JSN’s injury excuse. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if he slid entirely out of the 1st round, but if he even thinks he slid out of the first round he could potentially be looking at more guaranteed money on NIL to stay in college than to hit the draft this year. He’s only 20 years old right now too (2002 birthday) so it’s not like staying an extra year in college will make him an “old” prospect next year either. 

But not many were ever looking at Boutte's numbers when it came to the Draft process, almost all are looking at his skills and potential.

He may not have JSN's "excuse" (feels way more like a guy just opting out but never wanting to admit that to anyone), but he also has Jayden Daniels, which is a much larger excuse for his numbers than any lingering injury would be.

Im saying that he was projected Top 10ish with the same numbers last year (actually better this year, but its not crazy different) so he was being ranked there on the skills and projections, not on his numbers. so whats a 4th year going to do different other than possibly expose him? He is the type that should kill workouts, might show well at the combine, and if he holds it together in interviews he should move right back up the board into the first round. 

2 hours ago, AZBearsFan said:

Boutte is a guy who would make a ton of sense to me at USC with Caleb Williams next year via the portal with Jordan Addison presumably heading to the NFL. That would seem to be an environment for him to put himself right back into that elite prospect discussion.

But from what is being reported, hes going back to LSU? Thats what doesnt make all that much sense

[Bigbear72]

The more I look at our situation the more I believe that we will not be drafting Carter or Anderson (though I would love either). I believe that we are almost guaranteed to trade down given the opportunity. I looked at FA and there just isn't really a whole lot of substance there. We would have to hit and outbid on almost all of the significant FAs and that would be very unlikely. There are limited OLs, almost no edge, almost no WRs, and just a handful of LBs. There are also just a few 3Ts to be had. We will trade down, make some improvements and continue to build in 2024.

[StLunatic88]

16 minutes ago, Bigbear72 said:

The more I look at our situation the more I believe that we will not be drafting Carter or Anderson (though I would love either). I believe that we are almost guaranteed to trade down given the opportunity. I looked at FA and there just isn't really a whole lot of substance there. We would have to hit and outbid on almost all of the significant FAs and that would be very unlikely. There are limited OLs, almost no edge, almost no WRs, and just a handful of LBs. There are also just a few 3Ts to be had. We will trade down, make some improvements and continue to build in 2024.

Youre falling into the same trap that many were this offseason. This overhaul isnt going to be complete in one or two offseasons. Its going to be incremental steps so we can build a sustainable foundation and then we hopefully wont be back down to this level for a very long time. Quick fixes help for a year or two, but you will have to keep bottoming out every few years.

We cleared the Cap in year one, we also identified that we have the QB to hitch our wagon to. We also took some shots on some guys in free agency and the draft, to varying degrees of success (call it the Pringle-Brisker spectrum). But we also identified a good chunk of guys who will make up the original core of a few units that will set the floor.

Next we need to add some very good, very solid free agents that we can expect to be part of that core that Im talking about. Also need to get a true barometer on the Weapons for fields, specifically Mooney and Claypool, but also another look at Kmet and Herbert (maybe they have made their mind up on those two.

 

You are correct saying that a trade down from the #2 pick is very disireable in our eyes, but its a two way street;

• What if we actually end up at 3, and both Young and Stroud go before us?
• Even if we end up at #2, What if Young is the only clear cut QB, and all the other QB needy teams see Stroud, Levis and Richardson as just different levels of preference?
• Or what if the only offer we really have is like from the Colts at pick 8/9 and all they are offering is their 3rd and next years 1st, is that enough?
• What if its the Commanders that barely miss the playoffs because Hinekie finally falls apart. Is it worth dropping to #17? Even if its for #48, '24 1st and a '25 1st?
• Or what if Carolina wants to come up from #5? Is #35 and #57 (QB tax) worth likely missing out on both Cater and Anderson for?

We cant just expect that the trade we want is there, its going to be weighing alot of options, and Poles is really going to have to work, if we even end up in the position we are talking about