Justin Fields

[Epyon]

4 hours ago, malak1 said:

I've watched a lot of USC this year. Caleb Williams holds on the to ball a ton as well. He's a fantastic player but he could have the same sort of issues we've seen with Justin. He does seem to have better anticipation throwing the ball.

While this is true, CW also has a significantly faster throwing motion, and (for better OR worse, since it IS a double edged sword), he also is significantly more likely to "pull the trigger". Caleb, when he is trying to play a quick game, is LIGHTNING fast.  I haven't seen Fields be able to hit those kind of throwing windows anywhere near as efficiently.

[Madmike90]

16 minutes ago, blkwdw13 said:

Regardless of what I say about Fields, I stand by that he gets the whole year and he needs to improve and progress as a passer. I won't make a decision on if I think he is staying or going until the season is over no matter what I say in the game day threads. These last two games have been a great improvement but he needs to keep showing it going forward and hopefully he does. The coaches on the other hand I am more leaning towards they need to go regardless of the outcome of the season.

I find it difficult to say that before the end of the season...what if we pull this back to say a 9-8 season? Do you get rid of the staff then knowing that they are building something and before the season even started our GM came out and said he knew there were gaps in the team? I find that a tough sell...

Also found something Randy Mueller said on the Athletic podcast interest - he was speaking about Mike LaFleur getting a lit pissy during his last press conference after a loss and if he was just a "peace time leader" got me thinking about how Flus for all the losing hasn't really changed his leadership style which is an important asset...

Consistency is an underrated aspect of the NFL and if we finish out the season at say 8-4 then we can't get rid of Flus.

[blkwdw13]

2 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

I find it difficult to say that before the end of the season...what if we pull this back to say a 9-8 season? Do you get rid of the staff then knowing that they are building something and before the season even started our GM came out and said he knew there were gaps in the team? I find that a tough sell...

Also found something Randy Mueller said on the Athletic podcast interest - he was speaking about Mike LaFleur getting a lit pissy during his last press conference after a loss and if he was just a "peace time leader" got me thinking about how Flus for all the losing hasn't really changed his leadership style which is an important asset...

Consistency is an underrated aspect of the NFL and if we finish out the season at say 8-4 then we can't get rid of Flus.

Like I said I’m leaning towards that position. 

[G08]

On 9/28/2023 at 12:39 PM, CWood21 said:

Except Love hasn't been mediocre in the regular season so far.  He's been a top 10 QB unless you're looking almost strictly at his CMP%.

** SpongeBob Voice**

11 days later...

 

 

[malak1]

1 hour ago, G08 said:

** SpongeBob Voice**

11 days later...

 

 

He's certainly no Justin Fields this season. I know that much. 

[HuskieBear]

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

[malak1]

4 minutes ago, HuskieBear said:

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

Get the biggest haul you can for 1.1. 

[TankWilliams]

17 minutes ago, HuskieBear said:

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

Unless Caleb Williams stays or has something to cause a major drop in his draft stock, I'm voting for option 1 I think.  He's one of the top QB talents in a long time and those Fields stats are ok but probably not what I would expect Williams to be getting at the same point in time in his career, plus only 6 wins which is a bit below what I thought this team could do. 

I'd wager they could turn Fields into a pretty decent pick in this scenario, so trading out of 1 again doesn't seem as appealing as having Caleb Williams + a first and change, for example.  I could honestly see the argument either way in this situation, but the idea of locking up Fields long term based on those numbers seems hard for me to justify, even though it'd be one of the best QB seasons for the Bears in history, if not the best.  

I will say, I find those stats very unlikely, but I'll be happy to eat crow on that one if I'm wrong.

Edited October 10, 2023 by TankWilliams

[Sugashane]

16 minutes ago, HuskieBear said:

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

At that point Fields WILL have real trade value and you make the trade before the draft. I despise how CHI has brought in a new coach and/or GM to be bound to the previous regime's QB. Let them pick their own guy. You're going to be hard-pressed to find a chance to draft a prospect like Williams to start your tenure. I'm not praying that Archie Manning (or whoever) is a savant AND the Bears are bad enough to get them. 

I feel like if they are 6-11 and Fields comes out with 235 yards passing per game that it looks like the numbers are inflated from playing from behind. Defenses going into deep shells and playing bend-but-don't-break defenses that make his numbers look better than it really is. With the SOS that really puts the numbers in a poor light IMIO.

I don't want to pay the QB1 to a top contract just to have him be the limiting factor for the offense. As much as I like Fields I just haven't seen enough to warrant backing the brinks truck up for him. 

[JibjeResearch]

1 hour ago, HuskieBear said:

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

NO!

JF1 is the future, and we will draft a WR and TE in round1 to play more of the 2TEs and 2WRs set.

Edited October 10, 2023 by JibjeResearch

[TankWilliams]

7 minutes ago, JibjeResearch said:

NO!

JF1 is the future, and we will draft a WR and TE in round1 to play more of the 2TEs and 2WRs set.

How you can possibly say that with confidence after this season so far is crazy to me.  His last 2 games were good, but remember we are talking about the team that gave up 70 points the week prior and the commanders.  Even the commanders game I'd say has an asterisk in my evaluation considering almost all of the passing game went to DJ Moore.

[Sugashane]

4 minutes ago, TankWilliams said:

How you can possibly say that with confidence after this season so far is crazy to me.  His last 2 games were good, but remember we are talking about the team that gave up 70 points the week prior and the commanders.  Even the commanders game I'd say has an asterisk in my evaluation considering almost all of the passing game went to DJ Moore.

I mean, a QB that gets owned by good defenses and beats up on bad ones is still better than the average for Chicago. lol

[dll2000]

2 hours ago, HuskieBear said:

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

I don't go by stats, there is a lot of factors to a football story. 

But, if he looks good enough to me I keep him and trade 1.1 for a mint.  That is my ideal scenario even with having to pay him, because even a can't miss rookie can still miss.  A bird in hand is worth two in the bush.   

If he looks like he is going to be mid I trade him for what I can get and take the QB at 1.1.  You can't pass that opportunity if it is there.  

I have always maintained that Justin is talented enough to be very good and have not given up on him.   Even before Denver game.   But I haven't seen it consistently enough yet.

This is his first year with adequate talent, but they ended camp with too many injuries and too much drama on top of it.  You could see disaster coming.  They are righting ship a bit, Getsy did much better last game.  So let's wait and see what happens.

Like @Sugashanepointed out they performed well against two of worst defenses in entire league.    Still a lot of season left though.  Also a lot of good offenses have had crappy games.   Buffalo just played like absolute horse dung offensively in London.  They are still a very good offense.   It happens to most everyone.     

A lot of people panicked way too early on Justin.   The Green Bay loss in opening week was a lot for psyche to take, I get it.  I was a little depressed about it too, though I honestly expected it with all the O line injuries last minute.  

Also too early to take victory laps and say he is the guy.   

He could still either succeed or fail.    Every time he plays bad this year we are going to freak and every time he plays good (and I think he will do both) we are going to celebrate.   

I will reserve judgment until end of season. 

 

 

[Ty21]

5 hours ago, HuskieBear said:

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

In these scenarios, one option is to take MHJ at 1 and the other is to take MHJ at 3/4? Sign me up for the 1.1 one. 

[Epyon]

7 hours ago, HuskieBear said:

Because we all yo-yo between Super Bears/Super Bowl and depression - here's a scenario

Bears finish season 6-11 and get a pick between 7 and 12. CAROLINA finishes 2-15 and we have pick #1

JF averages for the rest of the season: 230 passing yards, 1.5 tds, .6 ints, 35 rushing yards, .3 rush tds

That puts his season totals at 3,903/29/13.4 and 611/4.6

Do we...?

1) Draft Caleb Williams, try and trade JF for value

2) JF is future, use #1 pick to grab MHJ and player to be named later with our pick

3) Look for a trade down to 3/4 so we can still grab a MHJ/Olu and grab some additional draft capital

4) See if there's a bigger trade out there - maybe AZ finishes with picks 6 and 9. We grab those two picks (probably AT LEAST), miss out on MHJ and Olu, but have 3 picks between 6 and 12. Allows our draft to look like Alt/Verse/Nabers or Alt/Nabers/Philly style trade with our 3rd 1st round pick

I trade Fields, and trade 1.1 to load up the team for THE REAL QB1: Tyson Bagent

Seriously though, I run up to the podium and draft Williams, and move Fields.  If we are able to draft Williams (or Maye even, I'm higher on him than most... he's just a massive risk given NC's offensive system).... Fields basically needs to be playing at MVP levels for me to keep him vs rolling with a rookie and the ~$50,000,000 extra  cap space we can build around him with that we wouldn't be spending on a Fields extension.

Regardless I hope Poles has stock in Pepto Bismol.... because your numbers paint a basic nightmare scenario for Poles as a GM. Three choices at QB and you can't afford to pick the wrong one. That's a lot of stress on the GM.