SaveOurSonics Posted November 22, 2023 Share Posted November 22, 2023 On 11/20/2023 at 11:17 AM, iknowcool said: You were the one who suggested Jonathan Mingo could do the same thing Tank Dell is doing... but sure, it is my take that didn't age well lol And I'll still stand by what I said. Yes, Dell had a great game (and I have been the one pounding the table the most for him in this thread... so color me not surprised) and he's having a great season... but so is Puka. Lets not act like Puka wasn't putting up those numbers in his first 2 weeks. He's currently 9th in receiving yards and is on pace to clear 1500 yards (to be fair to Dell he's played fewer games and has more TDs, but the Rams were feeding Kyren in the red-zone to start the year). They both are having great seasons though. But again, I am not the one who is diminishing what Dell is doing out there. I'm not diminishing Tank. I love Tank. Great prospect. Love that it's working for him. At the end of the day, he has an MVP candidate throwing to him whereas Mingo has one of the worst QBs in the league (just by yards per game & yards per attempt). Tank is probably looking like a glorified Darnell Mooney on the Panthers. Is that better than what Mingo has shown? It is. My point about Mingo being the hot receiver is largely hyperbolic, I admit, but the resounding point is that I do believe Stroud would be doing a better job of illuminating Mingo's abilities. Mingo has looked really good when Carolina gets him the ball in space & allows him to get north with it. There just hasn't been nearly enough of that, largely due to the nature of the offense (& Mingo rightfully being a more raw prospect than Dell was coming out). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted November 23, 2023 Share Posted November 23, 2023 (edited) 21 hours ago, SaveOurSonics said: I'm not diminishing Tank. I love Tank. Great prospect. Love that it's working for him. At the end of the day, he has an MVP candidate throwing to him whereas Mingo has one of the worst QBs in the league (just by yards per game & yards per attempt). Tank is probably looking like a glorified Darnell Mooney on the Panthers. Is that better than what Mingo has shown? It is. My point about Mingo being the hot receiver is largely hyperbolic, I admit, but the resounding point is that I do believe Stroud would be doing a better job of illuminating Mingo's abilities. Mingo has looked really good when Carolina gets him the ball in space & allows him to get north with it. There just hasn't been nearly enough of that, largely due to the nature of the offense (& Mingo rightfully being a more raw prospect than Dell was coming out). I have watched every Panthers game and I'm not seeing that, do you have any examples? His hands are terrible, that is why the Panthers struggle to get him the ball in space because he probably won't catch it. And he's also one of the worst WRs in the NFL at getting separation. How do you suggest the Panthers get a player the ball in open space who A) can't catch the ball consistently, B) can't run routes well, and C) isn't all that fast? And despite all of that, it isn't like he doesn't get targets. He has 7 games with 5+ targets. Not every target is the same, I will give you that, but the offense HAS tried getting him the ball. He just can't do much with it. And I'm not absolving Young from criticism. The more games pass by, the less confidence I have in him. But regardless of the QB, there is only so much a QB can do to elevate a WR who isn't good, and that is my point in all of this. There is a reason the receivers in Kansas City aren't putting up bigger numbers, and it isn't because Mahomes isn't also an MVP candidate, it is because their skill level is low. What makes Jonathan Mingo any different or better in your mind than Marques Valdes-Scantling? PFF isn't the be all, end all, but there is a reason that out of 124 qualified WRs, everyone but Thielen is ranked 90th or lower (Mingo is rated 105 out of 124). That is why I think it is diminishing Dell to compare him to Mingo or suggest if they swapped roles Mingo could be doing the same. Dell looks far and away better, that is why he is 1 of the 2 hot rookies receivers in the NFL, it isn't just because Stroud is throwing him the ball. Has it helped? Sure, but Matt Stafford isn't an MVP-candidate and yet Puka is blowing it up. Maybe Dell wouldn't be doing the same elsewhere, but I find that far more likely than Mingo being a hot receiver anywhere in the NFL. At best he'd be putting up Rashee Rice numbers. The confidence in Mingo has to be based off evaluations you made of him before the year and if that is the case, fair enough. Stick with your gut. I still have faith (albeit waning) in Bryce for that reason. But I'm not going to sit here and say Bryce would be the best QB if he was in a better situation. Because he's looked poor and I don't have a reason to say that just yet. It is the same thing with Mingo. There is no reason based on how he's performed this year to think he'd be doing better elsewhere. He is not suffering from the bad offense - he is part of the reason for the bad offense because he needs another year or two of development. Look at Quentin Johnson in Los Angeles. He's got a great QB. He's got great players around him on offense in Ekeler and Allen. He was an even better prospect than Mingo. And yet he's not doing anything. Why? Because he isn't good (right now, anyway). A WR still has to be good to put in work. I know everyone loves CJ Stroud and yes he's great. But Tank Dell isn't putting up the numbers he is, if he isn't a good player. If a WR is bad, it generally doesn't matter who the QB is or how good they are (although I'm sure you could pull out some once-upon-a-time exceptions). Edited November 23, 2023 by iknowcool 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaidersAreOne Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 24 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notthatbluestuff Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 This kid is a ROOKIE. Good lord. He's going to be a monster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 30 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said: 2nd rookie QB in League history to win OPOM. The first? This... gives me some PTSD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scar988 Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 (edited) CJ Stroud reminds me with his play-style of a 2nd year Patrick Mahomes (can run, throws dots, but tries to work the ball to his playmakers vs. taking it himself). Dude is killing it out there. He needs some more pieces around him (OL upgrades. A playmaking TE. some defensive improvements on the other side of the ball). But I love what he's shown with Nico Collins, Tank Dell and the other WRs there. A playmaking all-around Bijan or Gibbs type RB would be fun with him as well. Edited November 30, 2023 by scar988 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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