Daniel Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 1 minute ago, MagicMT said: I feel like this draft is very well set up for the Titans to pick either Nabers/Odunze or their top or 2nd top rated Tackle. They are in a great spot relative to their needs with QBs probably going 1-2-3 Oh yeah. One of them will be there. I personally think the QB’s health is more important than any other position you can take though, so I am kinda hoping Nabers isn’t there to tempt them. Levis can’t throw anything to Nabers if Will Anderson already broke his ankles. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMT Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 Just now, Daniel said: Oh yeah. One of them will be there. I personally think the QB’s health is more important than any other position you can take though, so I am kinda hoping Nabers isn’t there to tempt them. Levis can’t throw anything to Nabers if Will Anderson already broke his ankles. True, although I'd prefer for Bill Callahan to work his magic on the O-Line and trying to pair Nabers with Levy. You have to give your young QB weapons to properly develop and evaluate him but then again this might be the best (strongest at the top/awesome depth) WR draft ever so it would also makes a lot of sense to draft a tackle in the 1st and a WR in the 2nd. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkeyDoke21 Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 (edited) On 2/3/2024 at 9:34 AM, goldfishwars said: Does contested catch% measure the percent of a players receptions that are considered contested, or the percent of contested balls they come down with a reception out of? Edited February 13 by OkeyDoke21 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 9 minutes ago, OkeyDoke21 said: Does contested catch% measure the percent of receptions are considered contested, or the percent of contested balls they come down with a reception out of? I will say, both Odunze and Polk having that high a percentage of contested catches doesn't make a great argument for Penix. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkeyDoke21 Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Daniel said: I will say, both Odunze and Polk having that high a percentage of contested catches doesn't make a great argument for Penix. That's what I was looking at. I can't decide if them being 1-2, with Odunze being such an outlier is a positive or negative for any of them moving to the next level. Is Rome just that far above everyone else at coming down with a contested ball, or is he not separating from college dbs? Are they bailing out Pennix at an alarming rate? I don't know enough about the stat, or how it compares to prospects of the past to know, but it really stands out. Bulk numbers vs a percentage might be more telling. McConkey could be 1-3, given his playstyle. Makes me want to see some separation statistics on Odunze, and then see what kind of numbers someone like Larry Fitzgerald would have had at Pitt, in comparison. He'd be the best contested catch prospect, in my memory, where creating separation at the next level was never an issue. I've wavered back and forth from viewing it as impressive to troubling and back again 10 times just in these last 5 minutes thinking about it. Edited February 13 by OkeyDoke21 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 That's why I'm a little bearish on Odunze (so bearish that he's WR3): contested catches typically do not translate to the NFL. There are exceptions, of course, the biggest being DeAndre Hopkins. But generally, WRs that rely on contested catches don't work out in the NFL. Odunze doesn't rely on contested catches. He's got plenty of other tools in his belt, but I do think the degree to which he can bully DBs will go down when he gets to the NFL, and will make him a less effective receiver. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterCallSaul Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 52 minutes ago, Daniel said: That's why I'm a little bearish on Odunze (so bearish that he's WR3): contested catches typically do not translate to the NFL. There are exceptions, of course, the biggest being DeAndre Hopkins. But generally, WRs that rely on contested catches don't work out in the NFL. Odunze doesn't rely on contested catches. He's got plenty of other tools in his belt, but I do think the degree to which he can bully DBs will go down when he gets to the NFL, and will make him a less effective receiver. Yeah I really struggle with anyone putting Nabers behind Odunze in rankings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugashane Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 1 hour ago, Daniel said: That's why I'm a little bearish on Odunze (so bearish that he's WR3): contested catches typically do not translate to the NFL. There are exceptions, of course, the biggest being DeAndre Hopkins. But generally, WRs that rely on contested catches don't work out in the NFL. Odunze doesn't rely on contested catches. He's got plenty of other tools in his belt, but I do think the degree to which he can bully DBs will go down when he gets to the NFL, and will make him a less effective receiver. This is something I talked about with someone. I heard him compared to Brandon Marshall, but Marshall was WAY more physically imposing. By play style he reminds me more of Alshon Jeffrey. He isn't as brute-strong as he is smooth for his size. He doesn't seem to really jump away from people on his cuts but he has a good blend of traits for being so tall. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMT Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 Yeah contested catches do not typically translate, but Odunze has that rare combination of elite catch radius, elite ball tracking, elite body-positioning/control and good-great hands AND late hands, which makes it difficult for DBs to defend even if the coverage is great. And as mentionned, he doesn't just win with contested catches, he's a complete receiver. A+ size, good at YAC, good routes (though he could improve on his footwork), good and willing blocker and I think he's going to surprise people with how fast he will run at the combine. He should work on becoming a most physical receiver but the sky's the limit for Rome and he would easily have been WR1 last year (not as the prospect he was last year but the prospect he is in this draft). This truly seems like a special draft class. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 2 hours ago, Daniel said: That's why I'm a little bearish on Odunze (so bearish that he's WR3): contested catches typically do not translate to the NFL. There are exceptions, of course, the biggest being DeAndre Hopkins. But generally, WRs that rely on contested catches don't work out in the NFL. Odunze doesn't rely on contested catches. He's got plenty of other tools in his belt, but I do think the degree to which he can bully DBs will go down when he gets to the NFL, and will make him a less effective receiver. That feels like an overstatement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugboat Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 7 hours ago, goldfishwars said: He literally has the second best contested catch rate in this class... I really don't understand how this is possible. Maybe i've just watched the wrong games or something. But i don't see that in his game...at all. Especially not compared to Odunze (but that's a kind of ridiculous high bar to clear). 7 hours ago, goldfishwars said: YAC King and Home Run Hitter Route Seller High Point/Body Control Tough Runner Shifty as a runner Catch with defender bearing down and plays through the hit But yeah, real soft... I mean, i feel like we're watching two completely different sets of highlight clips here. I don't see anything remotely physical in any of this. There's the home runs (which is going to Nabers bread and butter imo) where he just completely burns a defense and gets behind them. He's still gonna have some of these in the NFL, but i don't see him just running right through an entire secondary without anyone even getting in the vicinity, nearly as often as a Pro. And certainly not if he's some team's clear cut #1WR target and draws constant doubles and press and extra attention wherever he goes. There's YAC but it's like i said, where he catches the ball with a 10 yard cushion and just runs around DBs in space with a huge head start. There's some "broken tackles" that are literally just DB fails, trying to bite his ankles and eating turf, or trying to drag him down from behind by his jersey. There's a "high point" of the football where he just slips behind the DB who didn't have the hands and timing to high point it in front of him for an easy, uncontested pick. There's just nothing even remotely "physical" in any of this. So yeah. I stand on him being "soft". Doesn't mean he's a trash prospect or that he won't be plenty productive in the NFL. I just think he's a bit overrated, as more of a "homerun hitter" and "get him the ball in space and let him run" type. Exactly like Ridley. I don't see that "dawg" who a QB is going to force the ball to in tight double coverage on a desperate 3rd and long and come out with a 1st down. 5 hours ago, MagicMT said: It's crazy how two people can watch the exact same thing and come away with completely different observations. Not saying that one is right and the other isn't, just that it is damn hard to evaluate prospects! When I watch Nabers I see the opposite, an explosive WR that is great at YAC, an awesome route runner who is good at contested catches with a great catch radius and that absolutely has that "dawg" in him. I know most people won't agree but to me Nabers is way closer to MHJ than to Odunze (and I absolutely love Odunze). Nabers to me is a mix of Chase and DJ Moore and will be a top 10 NFL WR for a loooong time. Man...DJ Moore was an absolute machine when it came to physicality and generating YAC without any sort of cushion. As a prospect, i thought that was actually going to be way more of his game that it's even become as a Pro, but my comp at the time was...vaguely Steve Smith like. And Chase was just an absolute bully at the catch point. Just beat up on DBs to take the ball. And has continued to do so at the NFL level. Both just on an entirely different plane of physicality for me as prospects, compared to Nabers. I loved both of those guys and was probably more bullish on both than most. I just don't see any of the same with Nabers. 4 hours ago, Daniel said: Count me in the minority too. Odunze is great, and I would be thrilled for him to end up in Tennessee, but I would be way more thrilled to get Nabers. Of course we need a tackle more, so I have to live with getting neither. I don't think Nabers > Odunze is the minority. At all. I think it's been pretty clearly entrenched that Nabers is the presumptive WR2 in this class for most people. I'm just part of the actual minority that doesn't feel that way. The only real other thing is...people thinking about whether Nabers > MHJ. Which is absolutely insane to me, considering how good MHJ is, and how far and away he is for me at the top of the class. But i think the idea that some people are even weighing that idea of Nabers as WR1 is indicative of the general perception that he's at very least, the "consensus WR2". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugboat Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 1 hour ago, Sugashane said: This is something I talked about with someone. I heard him compared to Brandon Marshall, but Marshall was WAY more physically imposing. By play style he reminds me more of Alshon Jeffrey. He isn't as brute-strong as he is smooth for his size. He doesn't seem to really jump away from people on his cuts but he has a good blend of traits for being so tall. I can definitely see a little bit of Jeffery to Odunze's game. Has that same deceptive easy movement and just so effortless in timing and feel, with a huge catch radius and understanding of how to use his body to bring in balls even through good coverage. He plays big boy ball. Which is where...Odunze's ability to turn chicken **** throws into chicken salad, is hugely valuable to me, and also as @Daniel and @OkeyDoke21 suggested...a bit of a reason i'm probably a lot lower on Penix than most. Especially since it wasn't even just Odunze bailing him out. Polk is also a big "easy" target that comes down with the ball more often than not, even when it's not a clear and easy reception in the open field with no pressure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 4 hours ago, Daniel said: Count me in the minority too. Odunze is great, and I would be thrilled for him to end up in Tennessee, but I would be way more thrilled to get Nabers. Of course we need a tackle more, so I have to live with getting neither. It's not hard to imagine the Titans getting something like Alt in round 1 plus Franklin in round 2. That would be pretty good for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 24 minutes ago, sparky151 said: It's not hard to imagine the Titans getting something like Alt in round 1 plus Franklin in round 2. That would be pretty good for them. I would love Franklin to fall that far. But honestly, this WR class is strongest at the late first/early second round. Thomas, Coleman, Franklin, Mitchell, sometimes Legette, McConkey, and even a few others are being put there. It makes me wonder which will separate themselves, or if the group will fall until someone makes a move and starts a run. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teen Girl Squad Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 5 hours ago, MagicMT said: I feel like this draft is very well set up for the Titans to pick either Nabers/Odunze or their top or 2nd top rated Tackle. They are in a great spot relative to their needs with QBs probably going 1-2-3 Its pretty much impossible for the Titans not to hit a homerun in round one unless they get cute with Bowers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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