LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 1 minute ago, MWil23 said: I haven’t bashed Baker for his Georgia performance but for me with Darnold it boils down to: He performed courageously despite that swinging gate OL compared to Bakers awesome OL. It’s not his fault they’re so good but still, it’s a factor. Darnold made about 3-4 WOW throws like two sideline back shoulder fades thrown perfectly and another frozen rope deep corner route with timing, anticipation, and accuracy all while staring down the gun barrel. Why I like Sam so much. No disrespect to Baker, but those throws weren’t asked of him at OU and certainly not against Georgia. This is where I’m at. Darnold makes NFL reads and SPECIAL throws, has the frame, arm, personality, as well as youth. I like Baker and think another top 10 team is gonna get a heck of a qb, but I still like Darnold more. Same applies to Rosen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FGK Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 1 hour ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: My biggest hesitation is his size. Being an analytics guy, you’ll know you’re betting on someone 6’ to be the exception to the rule. Is that a foolproof way of looking at him? No, not at all. Realistically though there have only been 2 guys in the last 20 years to actually do it. Completely true. Like, this is the argument against him IMO. The weak defenses/system offense is a bit of a hesitation, but this is what it boils down to. There have been two sub-6 foot QBs to have true success in the last 20 years. You're basically gambling on him breaking the trend and it's a question of if you're comfortable making that bet. I think I am, mostly because he has actually had less balls batter down by % than most of the other top QB candidates. But I definitely get wanting to stick with the #s on this one, and the #s say short QBs face a major uphill climb. Though I do wonder how much of that is opportunity versus natural disadvantage? Like, 80/20, 60/40? Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonanza23 Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 3 hours ago, brownie man said: Only other players you’ve got to know at 4 are Minkah and Denzel Ward. I honestly don’t think Chubb is in the discussion Ogbah was doing great at well at Myles. I personally think if Chubb is there he will be BPA. He’s an immediate upgrade to Ogbah as much as I like him. I am also not convinced Garrett will stay healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonanza23 Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 1 hour ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: This is where I’m at. Darnold makes NFL reads and SPECIAL throws, has the frame, arm, personality, as well as youth. I like Baker and think another top 10 team is gonna get a heck of a qb, but I still like Darnold more. Same applies to Rosen. Yeah Darnold makes big league throws all the time. He’s simply a superior prospect. And I think you absolutely have to take Mayfields offense into consideration. Those misdirection plays open up receivers all game long. It’s actually awesome to watch. All he has to do is get it to him. However there is a lot to like about him. He does make big league throws and is accurate. In fact measuring accuracy I’d go Rosen, Mayfield then Darnold. I love Mayfields attitude. Cat just wants to win. I’m pretty sure he’s an nfl qb but he’s just behind the big 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NudeTayne Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 8 minutes ago, Bonanza23 said: Yeah Darnold makes big league throws all the time. He’s simply a superior prospect. And I think you absolutely have to take Mayfields offense into consideration. Those misdirection plays open up receivers all game long. It’s actually awesome to watch. All he has to do is get it to him. However there is a lot to like about him. He does make big league throws and is accurate. In fact measuring accuracy I’d go Rosen, Mayfield then Darnold. I love Mayfields attitude. Cat just wants to win. I’m pretty sure he’s an nfl qb but he’s just behind the big 2. I put Mayfield's will to win up there with Brady and Rivers. Darnold has that special needs glazed over calm like Eli and Flacco, a nice trait to chill everyone else out. Rosen reminds me a bit of Rodgers as far as his demeanor. I see the lowest floor with Darnold and extremely high ceiling with all three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioG Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Tell me everything about Minkah Fitzpatrick as a CB and as a S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 12 minutes ago, ohiogenius said: Tell me everything about Minkah Fitzpatrick as a CB and as a S Dnk. Have reads things going both ways. Looked real good in coverage the other night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie man Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 10 minutes ago, bruceb said: Dnk. Have reads things going both ways. Looked real good in coverage the other night. Exactly when I watch him I see nothing that would make me think he couldn’t play FS and be a star at it @Mind Characterdoesnt however so idk. Which is why I’d love Barkley You don’t have to worry about Chubb making Ogbah useless or Minkah with possibly not being great at FS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioG Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 I remember when Jalen Ramsey came out and people thought he would be a safety and didnt have the hips for CB I wasnt sure how well Fitzpatrick compared to Ramsey Does he have the speed/fluidity to be a #1 CB because lord knows hes going to know everything about the opposing WRs with how meticulous his prep is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 1 hour ago, ohiogenius said: I remember when Jalen Ramsey came out and people thought he would be a safety and didnt have the hips for CB I wasnt sure how well Fitzpatrick compared to Ramsey Does he have the speed/fluidity to be a #1 CB because lord knows hes going to know everything about the opposing WRs with how meticulous his prep is 1 hour ago, ohiogenius said: Tell me everything about Minkah Fitzpatrick as a CB and as a S In short, he never ever plays FS in Alabama's alignment. When he is a safety he plays SS in a box supporting role. And in that role he is special. Jalen Ramsey was an ultra long athlete with elite Ball skills. His length and athleticism are on a different level. People wanted to move him to Safety because of his unparalleled length and his unorthodox and underdeveloped back peddle in college (he had none at all). At FSU, they kept everything in front of them or shuffled and ran in over or trail technique. A few coaching tips here and there and he was always going to be a special CB. Minkah's different in that he's better suited as a box defender and SS that can moonlight in press man as a nickel/Boundary CB. 1 Playing him at FS would be like playing Jabrill at FS. They both have the athleticism and with time they can flash at that spot, but it's not naturally what they do best. When draft season comes Minkah will be compared to Tyran Mathieu at first but when people really start to watch him they will compare him to Jabrill Peppers albeit a more instinctual, powerful, and bigger pass defender. He hardly ever this year (tbh he did some last year) ranges in the deep post. And is only called FS b/c either no one watches him that much, or naturally for the reason that he used to be a CB and it's rare to see a CB transition to SS so people assume that if he's transition from CB to Safety that it must be at FS and he should be ranging in the post and deep third like many free safeties. I think he could be special as a physical boundary corner but needs a lot of work. He has the speed, but his eyes aren't great and he doesn't really have the instincts to run with a WR with his back to the QB then find the composure to turn around and make a play on the ball. He's better when things are in front of him and he can just diagnose the quick passing game. That's why he's a really really good nickel CB. Hunter Renfrow did him dirty last year such that he struggles with the quickness of slot WRs. His skill set and Jabrill's are redundant unfortunately...Unless we think Jabrill can permanently play FS. If so, Jabrill at FS and Minkah at SS would make for a dynamic set of interchangeable defensive playmakers (depending on play specifics calls to utilize their strengths). If we draft him, it's to play SS or Boundary CB...I like him more as a box Safety with nickel CB versatility. Just watch how he was used in this game and it should tell you everything you need to know....he's not a FS...never plays there....doesn't know how to play there. Minkah Fitzpatrick the FS is a myth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 24 minutes ago, brownie man said: Exactly when I watch him I see nothing that would make me think he couldn’t play FS and be a star at it @Mind Characterdoesnt however so idk. Which is why I’d love Barkley You don’t have to worry about Chubb making Ogbah useless or Minkah with possibly not being great at FS. Calais Campbell, Donte Fowler, and Yannick on the Jags don't make each other useless...They form an unstoppable and game changing pass rushing dynamic. Sometimes they kick Calais inside and rush all 3 or vice versa. Why can't we do that here? When Myles rushes on the inside it's devastating and so it is with Ogbah. Minkah is going to make a pro bowl SS/box safety or a good Boundary CB, he's just not a FS just like Jabrill wasn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Interestingly enough...the QBs coming out this year also played last year. From PFF in 2016 In 2016, Darnold played well overall, grading as the 19th best quarterback in FBS with a grade of 80.9. Darnold handled pressure as good as any quarterback prospect in the 2016 draft as well as this coming draft, ranking No. 2 in adjusted completion percentage while under pressure at 67.6 percent. He also thrived against the blitz where he ranked No. 1 in adjusted completion percentage at 79.0 percent. Darnold was inconsistent throwing deep in 2016, however. He graded 46th out of 116 qualifiers on deep passes (20 or more yards in air) and ranked 49th on passes thrown 30 or more yards in the air. Darnold ranked just 68th in percentage of big-time throws. ---------------------------------- Against the blitz he was exceptional last year... This year the blitz ran through the OL like wet tissue paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bosko1616 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 If I want a pure CB I really like Josh Jackson if we traded down from 4. Arizona - 4th overall Browns - 15th, Patrick Peterson and future picks. Use 15 on Josh Jackson. Huge upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, bosko1616 said: If I want a pure CB I really like Josh Jackson if we traded down from 4. Arizona - 4th overall Browns - 15th, Patrick Peterson and future picks. Use 15 on Josh Jackson. Huge upgrade. This would be sweet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 50 minutes ago, Mind Character said: Calais Campbell, Donte Fowler, and Yannick on the Jags don't make each other useless...They form an unstoppable and game changing pass rushing dynamic. Sometimes they kick Calais inside and rush all 3 or vice versa. Why can't we do that here? When Myles rushes on the inside it's devastating and so it is with Ogbah. Minkah is going to make a pro bowl SS/box safety or a good Boundary CB, he's just not a FS just like Jabrill wasn't Don’t forget Malik Jackson with those 3. I’ll worry about having too many good pass rushers when it becomes a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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