Teen Girl Squad Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 I thought the whole game was good outside of the first half of the 3rd quarter. The first half was better than Rams/Pats. Some people really do determine the quality of a game by the scoreboard (both total amount and the amount of lead changes). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 11 hours ago, Forge said: That doesn't make him look worse. That's just the game within the game. That is the decision that the second team will always be faced with in that scenario. Go for 2, win / lose, or kick it and rely on the defense to get you the ball back. This the primary reason that I would take the ball second though. You have the information, and the opportunity to win it if you want. It absolutely makes him look worse because he's on record saying they wanted the ball third and the entire rationale behind that was they wanted the ball if both teams scored. KC was gonna end the game with one posession no matter what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 Just now, AFlaccoSeagulls said: It absolutely makes him look worse because he's on record saying they wanted the ball third and the entire rationale behind that was they wanted the ball if both teams scored. KC was gonna end the game with one posession no matter what. Not every team is going to do that and I'm not even sure that's the default decision making. That's just a counter by the chiefs to the niners decision. You have to consider that they go for two. This built in to the strategizing. If he considered that chiefs would go for 2 in that spot, but still decides that having the ball first in actual sudden death if it gets there is more important, than so be it. It's only worse if he's not building that into the strategy consideration. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 1 minute ago, Forge said: Not every team is going to do that and I'm not even sure that's the default decision making. That's just a counter by the chiefs to the niners decision. You have to consider that they go for two. This built in to the strategizing. If he considered that chiefs would go for 2 in that spot, but still decides that having the ball first in actual sudden death if it gets there is more important, than so be it. It's only worse if he's not building that into the strategy consideration. I mean clearly he wasn't considering the team didn't know the rules and he's on record right now saying he wanted the ball third against KC. It doesn't make any sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 19 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: I mean clearly he wasn't considering the team didn't know the rules and he's on record right now saying he wanted the ball third against KC. It doesn't make any sense. I don't care what the 49ers players know. It doesn't impact how they are playing. Hardman said he didn't know the rules after ending the game. They aren't making the decisions and they are designing the strategy. I care if the decision makers (Shanny) knows and whether the 49ers players know has nothing to do with Mahomes saying the Chiefs were going to go for 2. Wanting the ball first because you want the ball first in actual sudden death if it gets there ? Not a big deal. Not a strategy I agree with, but whatever. Mahomes saying that they were going to go for 2? Not a big deal. Doesn't make Shanny's decision look worse unless he's not considering this as part of the strategy, which is an impossible thing to know. The Chiefs want to live and die on the razor's edge, not every team will do that. It's an option to consider for Shanny, nothing more. Players not knowing? Don't care. They aren't changing their mindset during a play because they know the rules. They aren't suddenly thinking it's okay to give up a TD or that they don't want to score a TD quite as much. And if they are, that's a separate issue that is much larger than not knowing the overtime rules. Now, there is a clip that makes it sound like Shanny didn't know the rules, and that is a huge effing deal. That's the one that matters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 For those curious, here is the clip circulating. This is really, really bad if it he actually means what it sounds like (and it sounds like he doesn't know). This is unforgivable because this actually impacts everything in terms of your strategy and decision making. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ_Eaglesfan Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 6 minutes ago, Forge said: For those curious, here is the clip circulating. This is really, really bad if it he actually means what it sounds like (and it sounds like he doesn't know). This is unforgivable because this actually impacts everything in terms of your strategy and decision making. I mean doesn't the ref before the coin toss literally explain the rules over the speaker to the entire world? This seems like a coach who just lost misspeaking and nothing more to me. They probably should have been more prepared, but I feel like there is no chance fans like us know this stuff and the HC in the SB just is completely unaware of the rules. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 1 minute ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said: I mean doesn't the ref before the coin toss literally explain the rules over the speaker to the entire world? This seems like a coach who just lost misspeaking and nothing more to me. They probably should have been more prepared, but I feel like there is no chance fans like us know this stuff and the HC in the SB just is completely unaware of the rules. Yes lol. I said the same thing yesterday. He also said after the game that he wanted the ball if they went to true sudden death, which implies that he did know the rules. This clip sounds brutal though. And I'm definitely not going to argue that it doesn't give the appearance that he didn't know the rules because it does. I think it's fair for people to question it, but you're never going to be able to say for sure. So if he didn't know the rules? Big issue. If he did know the rules, I Don't agree with how he played overtime, but I don't think there was anything that makes him "look bad" with regards to chiefs saying they would have went for 2 or the players not knowing (there are always players who don't know lol). I feel like people are really reaching to throw is much on to the Shanny story as possible with stuff like that and it's what I've been talking about with Soggust. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 I'm pretty sure "what the overtime rules are" is not usually a coaching point, considering all the guys we've seen in the past that didn't know a regular season game could end in a tie (Najee Harris, Donovan McNabb, etc) Learning the overtime rules is an extracurricular activity, so some guys didn't do it. I mean, I've read the CBA and the complete rulebook and casebook in the past, and there were things about the new playoff OT rules I was unclear on because this was literally the first time it happened with the new rules (I had assumed the game would end when the clock hit 0:00 if the score wasn't tied, turns out both teams are entitled to an entire possession, so you're only up against OT halftime.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ_Eaglesfan Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 11 minutes ago, Forge said: Yes lol. I said the same thing yesterday. He also said after the game that he wanted the ball if they went to true sudden death, which implies that he did know the rules. This clip sounds brutal though. And I'm definitely not going to argue that it doesn't give the appearance that he didn't know the rules because it does. I think it's fair for people to question it, but you're never going to be able to say for sure. So if he didn't know the rules? Big issue. If he did know the rules, I Don't agree with how he played overtime, but I don't think there was anything that makes him "look bad" with regards to chiefs saying they would have went for 2 or the players not knowing (there are always players who don't know lol). I feel like people are really reaching to throw is much on to the Shanny story as possible with stuff like that and it's what I've been talking about with Soggust. My general rules are I don't care what players and coaches say to the media. They lie all the time. They misspeak constantly. They randomly get emotional and say things they don't mean for various reasons. I just don't put much stock into stuff like this personally. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeotheLion Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Forge said: For those curious, here is the clip circulating. This is really, really bad if it he actually means what it sounds like (and it sounds like he doesn't know). This is unforgivable because this actually impacts everything in terms of your strategy and decision making. Fwiw, I thought he meant at the end of regulation when they settled for a FG. Still doesn't make much sense as Mahomes would still likely have had a chance to tie unless they got a first and bled the clock down. I can't imagine he didn't know this. And if he didnt know this, I think he'd be more likely to go for it on the 4th and 4. If he knew a TD won the game he's going for it imo based on his early decision. Edited February 13 by LeotheLion 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 48 minutes ago, Forge said: For those curious, here is the clip circulating. This is really, really bad if it he actually means what it sounds like (and it sounds like he doesn't know). This is unforgivable because this actually impacts everything in terms of your strategy and decision making. I genuinely didn't know this OT rule change - but I'm a spectator, it's not my job to know. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 4 minutes ago, LeotheLion said: Fwiw, I thought he meant at the end of regulation when they settled for a FG. Still doesn't make much sense as Mahomes would still likely have had a chance to tie unless they got a first and bled the clock down. I can't imagine he didn't know this. And if he didnt know this, I think he'd be more likely to go for it on the 4th and 4. If he knew a TD won the game he's going for it imo based on his early decision. Agreed. Regulation is what I initially thought as well. The "in the end" trips me up, but as @AZ_Eaglesfan hard to be able to crack the things coaches and players say off the cuff sometimes. If they pick up that 3rd and 5, KC may never see the ball again. But they also may not have needed a TD in that scenario. Its just really hard to get through what he's intending to say based on a ten second clip, that's why I just acknowledge that if he didn't know its awful, and if he did it was a strategy decision. Not one I agree with, but apparently some people do. Also agree with the notion that if he didn't know, that first possession in overtime is probably different at the end. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakuvious Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 I kind of want there to be some interview like 20 years from now, where it comes out that Warner just messed up telling the ref what they wanted, and this has all just spiraled from Shanahan trying to take the heat for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnguy2015 Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 Mentioned this in the other thread about the decision, but I think Shanahan was right to want the ball first, but should have committed at that point to finishing the drive with a TD+2. If Reid gets the ball first and scores, he'd be going for two himself to make sure Kyle can't win before sudden death, and if you give Mahomes the ball first in sudden death that's curtains for you. Assuming your gassed and banged up defense won't be able to stop him and that your two MVP finalists will have to make sure he never gets the chance to win it, first by getting 8 and then by driving down the field for a FG in sudden death before he can respond, is your best bet, and going first is the only way that's guaranteed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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