lancerman Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 52 minutes ago, wwhickok said: His knee hit first. Then he crossed the goal line. TD. The lack of relevance you talk about is due to overvlcomplication of the rule which needs to be dissolved. It's absolutely relevant because it's what's wrong with the rule. It's not over complicated. It's the simplest thing ever. How to catch the ball. 1. If you are upright, get possession of the ball, make a football move to transition to a runner/ball carrier. 2. If you are falling, don't drop the ball throughout the process of catch. That's not complicated. That's so simple a 2 year old could understand that. What it makes it complicated is when people confuse a receiver and a runner and think the plane is a magic exception that nullifies the need to a catch a ball, or when some people think having a knee on the ground means it's the equivalent to having both feet on the ground and you can somehow establish yourself as a runner while not even being upright. It's people adding irrelevant things to make things that don't apply to a very simple rule a catch. Compare my rule to this. 1. If you are upright, get possession of the ball, make a football move to transition to a runner/ball carrier 2. If you are falling, don't drop the ball throughout the process of the catch, however if one of your knees hits the ground you can make a reach move and it counts as a establishing yourself as a runner, oh and if any of this happens near the plane it's an exception and you don't even need to make a catch, you just need possession over the plane. See how the first rule is simple and the last rule is overly complicated with two major exceptions to the rule? Here's the reality if the Jesse James catch happened in the middle of the field and the ball came loose the way it did and a Patriot scooped it up, everyone would be screaming bloody murder that it was an incompletion. Because it happened at the goal line they want to act like it should be a TD. He's not a runner. He never was a runner. He lost control of the ball during the fall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigilantZombie Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 18 minutes ago, lancerman said: It's not over complicated. It's the simplest thing ever. How to catch the ball. 1. If you are upright, get possession of the ball, make a football move to transition to a runner/ball carrier. 2. If you are falling, don't drop the ball throughout the process of catch. That's not complicated. That's so simple a 2 year old could understand that. What it makes it complicated is when people confuse a receiver and a runner and think the plane is a magic exception that nullifies the need to a catch a ball, or when some people think having a knee on the ground means it's the equivalent to having both feet on the ground and you can somehow establish yourself as a runner while not even being upright. It's people adding irrelevant things to make things that don't apply to a very simple rule a catch. Compare my rule to this. 1. If you are upright, get possession of the ball, make a football move to transition to a runner/ball carrier 2. If you are falling, don't drop the ball throughout the process of the catch, however if one of your knees hits the ground you can make a reach move and it counts as a establishing yourself as a runner, oh and if any of this happens near the plane it's an exception and you don't even need to make a catch, you just need possession over the plane. See how the first rule is simple and the last rule is overly complicated with two major exceptions to the rule? Here's the reality if the Jesse James catch happened in the middle of the field and the ball came loose the way it did and a Patriot scooped it up, everyone would be screaming bloody murder that it was an incompletion. Because it happened at the goal line they want to act like it should be a TD. He's not a runner. He never was a runner. He lost control of the ball during the fall. Except you're simplifying the first rule for the sake of your argument love action has proven that it's not that simple, at all. No one would've said incompletion because at the point it came loose he had been touched, it would've been down by contact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancerman Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 31 minutes ago, wwhickok said: Except you're simplifying the first rule for the sake of your argument love action has proven that it's not that simple, at all. No one would've said incompletion because at the point it came loose he had been touched, it would've been down by contact. I'm actually not simplifying it. It's literally black and white. You're adding features to the rule to get the outcome you want. The complication is people not knowing the rule and adding things that aren't part of it. Rule of thumb, unless you are upright when you make the catch, never let the ball hit the ground. Very simple Watch the Jesse James catch again. He's not touched. If someone scooped up the ball when it was out of his control are you seriously trying to say that's fumble on the field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaglesPeteC Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 On 2/6/2018 at 5:00 PM, BayRaider said: - Worst Defense he has ever fielded as the Patriors head coach. Probably a lot due to letting players walk, trading them. It was actually quite odd seeing the Pats give up so many points every game this year. - Josh McDaniels and Matt Patricia both did a fantastic job this season and are now both Head Coaches. So they are not to blame. - Tom Brady had one of the greatest Super Bowl QB Performances ever. Probably would of been the greatest but without the fumble. But still Top 5. - He benched Malcolm Butler. This game would of been closer with Butler in the game. 3 points or less. Pats perhaps could of even won IMO. Even though the Pats were 13-3, they weren't very dominant this year. 11 wins topps if played in the NFC IMO. I mean.....the Eagles had a little something to do with it...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmen Cygni Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 2 hours ago, wwhickok said: Except you're simplifying the first rule for the sake of your argument love action has proven that it's not that simple, at all. No one would've said incompletion because at the point it came loose he had been touched, it would've been down by contact. Ever heard the term, "playing chess with a pigeon"? Just walk away from this nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buc Ball Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 41 minutes ago, Carmen Cygni said: Ever heard the term, "playing chess with a pigeon"? Just walk away from this nonsense. The irony... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagles23 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 4 hours ago, wwhickok said: It's really this simple. By rule the ground cannot cause a fumble for a runner. A ground can cause a fumble if the runner is untouched by a defender. (See Eli vs the Eagles a few years back) What you're proposing is a catch and fumble by Jesse James had it occurred in the middle of the field Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancerman Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 40 minutes ago, Buc Ball said: The irony... From the poster who made the terrible defense wins championships threads and the guy who added virtually no substance or context to his argument in this thread. He doesn't have the credibility to have his word taken as fact like he seems to think he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theJ Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 I love reading the first few posts of a 10 page or longer thread and then fast forwarding to the last page to see what singular, off topic thing we're arguing about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stafford4Pres Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Belichick On 2/6/2018 at 5:41 PM, HorizontoZenith said: No. Brady couldn't catch a simple pass in which he had an open field in front of him. Brady lost this game. There's no way you're actually serious.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 20 hours ago, Carmen Cygni said: Give it up. He snatched the ball, started to bring it down, saw the goaline , and then proceeded to reach - in a secondary move- over the goal line. It's a TD. Perhaps receivers should be taught to NOT reach for the goal line like that so there isn't any controversy if the receiver doesn't take 3 steps like that Eagle player in the SB did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmen Cygni Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 3 minutes ago, Pugger said: Perhaps receivers should be taught to NOT reach for the goal line like that so there isn't any controversy if the receiver doesn't take 3 steps like that Eagle player in the SB did. Technically a knee down is two feet, so that's three including his back foot, and he crossed the goal line to end the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CKSteeler Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 19 minutes ago, Pugger said: Perhaps receivers should be taught to NOT reach for the goal line like that so there isn't any controversy if the receiver doesn't take 3 steps like that Eagle player in the SB did. No coach - including Belichick - seems to do that. And since that pathetic hanger-on Lombardi put that nonsensical narrative out there, we've seen multiple examples of Patriots players doing just what he claimed they were taught not to do. And why, as a football fan, would we want to see players prevented from making plays by some stupid technicality of the rules which isn't enforced consistently? This simply didn't used to be a problem like this. Even with replay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancerman Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 15 minutes ago, CKSteeler said: No coach - including Belichick - seems to do that. And since that pathetic hanger-on Lombardi put that nonsensical narrative out there, we've seen multiple examples of Patriots players doing just what he claimed they were taught not to do. And why, as a football fan, would we want to see players prevented from making plays by some stupid technicality of the rules which isn't enforced consistently? This simply didn't used to be a problem like this. Even with replay. Irony is it came out that Belichick does exactly that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagles23 Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 15 minutes ago, CKSteeler said: No coach - including Belichick - seems to do that. And since that pathetic hanger-on Lombardi put that nonsensical narrative out there, we've seen multiple examples of Patriots players doing just what he claimed they were taught not to do. And why, as a football fan, would we want to see players prevented from making plays by some stupid technicality of the rules which isn't enforced consistently? This simply didn't used to be a problem like this. Even with replay. Secure the catch then worry about YAC. That's nothing new. Want to reach forward while going to the ground? Don't let the ball hit the ground Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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