Mike Pettine Defense

[Beast]

51 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

from a few pages back:

"I don't want to pigeon-hole Pettine because I think he'll do whatever his personnel dictates, but he has a reputation for playing his defensive linemen in an under look and using the strong side linebacker as his defense's premier pass rusher. It gives the appearance of a 3-4 with the strong side linebacker opposite the tight end, which means the strong side linebacker will move to the right and left sides of the formation. The bottom line is Packers defensive linemen can expect to be used more often in a gap-control scheme, which means they'll be free to penetrate and disrupt, instead of anchoring and holding the point. Muhammad Wilkerson can blend those two styles. " 

Thanks for pointing this out. Though I'm still wondering certain things like, who'll they play as the strong side linebacker? Matthews or Perry? And if both will be asked to drop into coverage or just one or the other?

[MantyWrestler]

2 hours ago, Gopher Trace said:

I'll give him this offseason and preseason, like I said. What do we have to lose by taking another look?

Better question: what do we have to gain by not giving him a chance? It's not like he's keeping anyone better off the roster at the moment. We can easily fit him in with another draft class, too, so that's not the issue.

You need to give your young guys a little time to develop. He's only entering Year 3, and has actually shown some progression between Years 1 & 2. I'm simply saying: let's see how that progression continues. 26 is older than most at this point in his career, but it isn't old. He's still a ways away from the decline stage.

You've written him off, I get it. I wrote off Jayrone before most other fans did, but I was willing to give him a chance as long as we had not clearly upgraded over him, because there was some chance he'd prove me wrong. He was not much of a defender in his time here, but he had a role for us on specials. I think Fack can be a nice ST guy to have around at the very least. I feel better about his odds as an EDGE than I did Elliot, though.

He’ll get his chance, we just have zero faith in the guy because history has not been kind to him. 

[squire12]

Regarding Fackrell..... Not sure if everyone knows that NFL teams can carry 90 man rosters through most of training camp and preseason.  That is a lot of bodies and players on cheap contracts that have played in the NFL have value...especially in a situation where there is a new coaching staff/DC coming into the equation.  

Whether Kyler Fackrell will be worthy of a roster spot on the opening day GB Packer 53-man roster is another story.  

 

Please draft get here soon.

[Donzo]

2 hours ago, SpeightTheVillain said:

Yeah Fackrell is garbage guys. Hopefully Biegel can turn into something but the Fackrell ship has sailed in my opinion. 

 

Wow, that's an awful post...

Frackrell in preseason and before the bye week was lousy. Frackrell after the bye played a lot of good football.

 

 

[Donzo]

2 hours ago, TheBitzMan said:

You can't tell me that every player in that locker room doesn't realize that Gilbert deserved to be on the field over Fackrell well before he was. 

Really?

They both played the last two games. Gilbert had one tackle- 1... Fackrell had five tackles and a sack in those two games.

What did the players "realize" after that?

[Spartacus]

I'm no fan of Fackrell but when did Gilbert become a better pass rusher?  

[SpeightTheVillain]

1 hour ago, Donzo said:

 

Wow, that's an awful post...

Frackrell in preseason and before the bye week was lousy. Frackrell after the bye played a lot of good football.

 

 

He really didn't. He played ok against Minnesota in the second game but was awful against Cleveland, Detroit, and Carolina

[Shanedorf]

Enough with the Facking around

 

From Jason Wilde on Clay Matthews:

According to McCarthy and Pettine, Matthews will be best served lining up both inside and outside. His move inside midway through the 2014 season rescued a spiraling defense and turned it one of the league’s best units during the second half of the year. He spent most of 2015 inside, too – although he continued to move outside in obvious passing situations – but each of the past two seasons, Matthews was back on the edge.

Pettine’s scheme, which can morph from a 4-3 to a 3-4 from one play to the next, likely will have the Packers in their nickel and dime sub packages much of the time and is predicated on creating one-on-one pass-rushing opportunities for its best rushers. With Matthews, McCarthy firmly believes moving him around will create protection problems for opponents.

“Absolutely. I would classify Clay as a linebacker. We’re not going to just put him in the outside linebacker or the inside linebacker (spots). He’s at his best when he’s creating targeting issues for the offense,” McCarthy explained. “When you line a premier player like Clay up in just one spot, you actually make it easier for the offense to identify and get to him with protection calls and so forth. It will be important for us to move Clay around, and that will be part of the new defense.”

http://journaltimes.com/sports/football/packers-lb-clay-matthews-ready-to-play-the-field/article_67771b80-b887-5289-ab23-297e01538c7b.html

[squire12]

18 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

Enough with the Facking around

 

From Jason Wilde on Clay Matthews:

According to McCarthy and Pettine, Matthews will be best served lining up both inside and outside. His move inside midway through the 2014 season rescued a spiraling defense and turned it one of the league’s best units during the second half of the year. He spent most of 2015 inside, too – although he continued to move outside in obvious passing situations – but each of the past two seasons, Matthews was back on the edge.

Pettine’s scheme, which can morph from a 4-3 to a 3-4 from one play to the next, likely will have the Packers in their nickel and dime sub packages much of the time and is predicated on creating one-on-one pass-rushing opportunities for its best rushers. With Matthews, McCarthy firmly believes moving him around will create protection problems for opponents.

“Absolutely. I would classify Clay as a linebacker. We’re not going to just put him in the outside linebacker or the inside linebacker (spots). He’s at his best when he’s creating targeting issues for the offense,” McCarthy explained. “When you line a premier player like Clay up in just one spot, you actually make it easier for the offense to identify and get to him with protection calls and so forth. It will be important for us to move Clay around, and that will be part of the new defense.”

http://journaltimes.com/sports/football/packers-lb-clay-matthews-ready-to-play-the-field/article_67771b80-b887-5289-ab23-297e01538c7b.html

Some posters here have been on that train of thought for a few years now.  He should no longer be a full time EDGE rusher, but moved around the D and be a matchup problem for offenses to have to account for.  The issue last year was there were no other competent EDGE players to allow CM to move inside and around the D more.  Prior to that, Peppers and Datone Jones could offer some options at EDGE.

For me, it makes finding a competent 3rd EDGE rusher that much more necessary in this draft (of through the development of someone already on the roster).  

[Joe]

7 hours ago, TheBitzMan said:

So you guys are willing to continue along this Fackrell path and get him on the field over guys like Biegel/Gilbert who have actually showed promise and a potential draft pick? 

Let's say this all works out, what is Fackrell's ceiling? 

That's spinning it to say the least. All I'm saying is that he should get a legit shot in the new defense.

[Beast]

1 hour ago, Shanedorf said:

From Jason Wilde on Clay Matthews:

According to McCarthy and Pettine, Matthews will be best served lining up both inside and outside. His move inside midway through the 2014 season rescued a spiraling defense and turned it one of the league’s best units during the second half of the year. He spent most of 2015 inside, too – although he continued to move outside in obvious passing situations – but each of the past two seasons, Matthews was back on the edge.

Pettine’s scheme, which can morph from a 4-3 to a 3-4 from one play to the next, likely will have the Packers in their nickel and dime sub packages much of the time and is predicated on creating one-on-one pass-rushing opportunities for its best rushers. With Matthews, McCarthy firmly believes moving him around will create protection problems for opponents.

“Absolutely. I would classify Clay as a linebacker. We’re not going to just put him in the outside linebacker or the inside linebacker (spots). He’s at his best when he’s creating targeting issues for the offense,” McCarthy explained. “When you line a premier player like Clay up in just one spot, you actually make it easier for the offense to identify and get to him with protection calls and so forth. It will be important for us to move Clay around, and that will be part of the new defense.”

http://journaltimes.com/sports/football/packers-lb-clay-matthews-ready-to-play-the-field/article_67771b80-b887-5289-ab23-297e01538c7b.html

Thanks for sharing that

1 hour ago, squire12 said:

Some posters here have been on that train of thought for a few years now.  He should no longer be a full time EDGE rusher, but moved around the D and be a matchup problem for offenses to have to account for.  The issue last year was there were no other competent EDGE players to allow CM to move inside and around the D more.  Prior to that, Peppers and Datone Jones could offer some options at EDGE.

For me, it makes finding a competent 3rd EDGE rusher that much more necessary in this draft (of through the development of someone already on the roster).  

Yes, that changes stuff, it makes the need for another OLB even higher (to maybe even higher as or higher than CB) and ILB lower. It also suggest to me, that maybe they'll take a more physical edge like Davenport than I was previously thinking... as I was thinking they would want a more verstile guy like Matthews, which fits Landry better... thought it could be either if they like them. Though Packers also seemed to be looking at those DBs hard.

[Sasquatch]

GB has quite a few JAG’s on defense, and in my opinion, a JAG does not equal a liability.  However, there’s a fine line between the two.  We just can’t afford to retain any players that are, more than average, liabilities.  JAG’s function well in concert with stars and playmakers - they don’t flash, but they don’t make mistakes either.  You need JAG’s, just as you need stud playmakers.  We more or less know who the stars on defense are, and we can probably quite easily point out the JAG’s.  There seems to be the most disagreement in here about the liabilities.  I’m not ready to put Fackrell into the liability category yet.  The question is, are there any players on defense that clearly lean more toward the liability column and who must be replaced through this year’s draft (or free agency)?

[Leader]

7 hours ago, Sasquatch said:

GB has quite a few JAG’s on defense, and in my opinion, a JAG does not equal a liability.  However, there’s a fine line between the two.  We just can’t afford to retain any players that are, more than average, liabilities.  JAG’s function well in concert with stars and playmakers - they don’t flash, but they don’t make mistakes either.  You need JAG’s, just as you need stud playmakers.  We more or less know who the stars on defense are, and we can probably quite easily point out the JAG’s.  There seems to be the most disagreement in here about the liabilities.  I’m not ready to put Fackrell into the liability category yet.  The question is, are there any players on defense that clearly lean more toward the liability column and who must be replaced through this year’s draft (or free agency)?

Fackrell hasnt turned it on as hoped - at LB at least. Has he reached his NFL ceiling? Perhaps thats the case. I dont quibble over the subtleties. If he's on the bubble - fine - somebody better has to beat him out for a roster spot or field time. Thats all that counts with me.

[TheBitzMan]

14 hours ago, Beast said:

I've never said that and you're making stuff up (again). You talked about respect and learning... how to respect and learn, when you don't listen and try to put lies into other people mouths?

I respect your opinions and never meant to put anything in your mouth. My bad if that's how it was taken. I was defensive about your insinuations, that's it. We will have to agree to disagree on this one. 

I can't believe this discussion was about Kyler Fackrell. The NFL really needs to push up the draft. Can we submit this thread as evidence?

[TheBitzMan]

13 hours ago, Spartacus said:

I'm no fan of Fackrell but when did Gilbert become a better pass rusher?  

I never said he was better per say. My argument is/was that Fackrell has had more than enough chances to prove anything. Gilbert should've been on the field more for us to know what he is. For whatever reason he was never given that opportunity.