Superman(DH23) Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Except the people of King's Landing didn't betray her, and I think it's been debated at length that it went against Dany's entire character to kill innocent people for no reason. She can't even adequately explain it in this episode. "Cersei used their innocence against me, so I killed all of them!", like wtf? GRRM isn't telling us anything because at this point he only provided them a layout for how the books will end. Everything else (like how it got there) was decided by D&D, and in the show, the way they arrived at Dany becoming the Mad Queen and ultimately being betrayed by Jon for The Grea'er Good is just awful in every single way. How so? Tyrion and Dany explained it all to you, you just dont want to hear it. We witnessed Dany commit atrocities, we just justified them. Dany herself justifies them, she tells Jon they can do whatever they want together, bc they know what's right. Jon's line of "what about all the other people who know what they are doing is right" is the essence of the show. Power corrupts. Danys quest for power is what corrupted her. Jon never wanted power. He was raised as a bastard. He witnessed what became of those who were in power and while he was never treated as a commoner, he also wasnt treated as his siblings either. He joined the nights watch, not for power, but to be honorable and get away from being the bastard of winterfell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdallr Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 After all the complete nonsense we've seen this season, I can't believe dragon psychology is what people are hung up on. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Just now, Superman(DH23) said: How so? Tyrion and Dany explained it all to you, you just dont want to hear it. We witnessed Dany commit atrocities, we just justified them. Dany herself justifies them, she tells Jon they can do whatever they want together, bc they know what's right. Jon's line of "what about all the other people who know what they are doing is right" is the essence of the show. Power corrupts. Danys quest for power is what corrupted her. Jon never wanted power. He was raised as a bastard. He witnessed what became of those who were in power and while he was never treated as a commoner, he also wasnt treated as his siblings either. He joined the nights watch, not for power, but to be honorable and get away from being the bastard of winterfell. I'm not so sure he joined the nights watch so willingly - but it clearly formed his character and mindset. The rest of your post is right on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ty21 Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 2 hours ago, Spartacus said: I noticed that too. I thought while watching "They should have just stood in a different place". Hindsight is 20-20 lmao. There was no way of knowing where the bricks would collapse obviously. Does look sloppy but it’s a bit dumb to nitpick. Also, “killed by only like 15 bricks” is kinda stupid cause it only takes one potentially and Jaime was already actively dying. 15 bricks is still a lot lol. I don’t think I’m going to comment on the finale tho. I’m still not sure what to make of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldman9er Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Except the people of King's Landing didn't betray her, In her mind, they did. They sought Cersei's protection.. thereby making themselves a shield of Cersei's. While not a clear betrayal.. they made a reasonable choice to shield Cersei in protecting themselves. Dany just cut through the shield that was the sheeple fodder.. because instilling fear for conquering was the only option Jon/Sansa left available to her.. and she did it while hating it. Too much thinking. Not enough thinking still. Edited May 20, 2019 by oldman9er Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman(DH23) Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Leader said: I'm not so sure he joined the nights watch so willingly - but it clearly formed his character and mindset. The rest of your post is right on. I was talking about when he joined in season 1. Yeah he probably didnt want to be sentenced to the night swatch this time around. But even so, I expect he will fulfill his duty. That's what Ned Starks son will always do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldman9er Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, Leader said: Case denied for lack of admissible evidence. Exactly. It's just a ridiculous mountain to take a stand and die on. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, oldman9er said: In her mind, they did. They sought Cersei's protection.. thereby making themselves a shield of Cersei's. While not a clear betrayal.. they made a reasonable choice to shield Cersei in protecting themselves. Dany just cut through the shield that was the sheeple fodder.. because instilling fear for conquering was the only option Jon/Sansa left available to her.. and she did it while hating it. Too much thinking. Not enough thinking enough. Her torching the city was consistent with her character at the time. IMO she could have instilled that same level of fear by simply flying to the Red Keep and cutting it down while all the city folk watched. I think that would have been impressive enough to get their attention. Edited May 20, 2019 by Leader 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, Superman(DH23) said: I was talking about when he joined in season 1. Yeah he probably didnt want to be sentenced to the night swatch this time around. But even so, I expect he will fulfill his duty. That's what Ned Starks son will always do. Understood and I was referring to "back then" as well. Was he really getting such lousy treatment at Winterfell that he welcomed going north? I dont remember it that well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Re: Drogon’s staggering intelligence. He should fly Dany to Asshai and have one of the red priests resurrect her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdallr Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Just now, Leader said: He torching the city was consistent with her character at the time. IMO she could have instilled that same level of fear by simply flying to the Red Keep and cutting it down while all the city folk watched. I think that would have been impressive enough to get their attention. Marching the unsullied through the streets alone would be enough to instill fear in the population. Let alone a MFing dragon. Is she thinking a peasant baker is gonna get uppity with her if she doesn't wipe out hundreds of thousands? It isn't a logical decision; purely emotional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Heimdallr said: Marching the unsullied through the streets alone would be enough to instill fear in the population. Let alone a MFing dragon. Is she thinking a peasant baker is gonna get uppity with her if she doesn't wipe out hundreds of thousands? It isn't a logical decision; purely emotional. If I were a just getting by Knights Landing lower middle class / borderline peasant - it would work for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 She Dany did go crazy in the end. Outside of Dany and, at times, Tyrion, I didn't end up feeling much of a connection with the other characters in the finale. Some of the send offs ending up feeling a little hollow unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman(DH23) Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Just now, Leader said: Understood and I was referring to "back then" as well. Was he really getting such lousy treatment at Winterfell that he welcomed going north? I dont remember it that well. It was 100% his choice, Ned tried to talk him out of it. Benjen warned him about it. He had been raised that the Nightswatch was one of the most honorable commitments a northman could make. Tyrion tried to tell him otherwise. Jon even says to Tyrion before he takes his vows that Tyrion was the only one who really told him the truth about what it was. Where the show messed up with the whole story, and where I think GRRM will correct is that they didnt need the north to spontaneously make Jon king. Rob had named him his heir. I imagine that will be the catalyst to make Jon king after he takes back Winterfell from the Boltons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Superman(DH23) said: It was 100% his choice, Ned tried to talk him out of it. Benjen warned him about it. He had been raised that the Nightswatch was one of the most honorable commitments a northman could make. Tyrion tried to tell him otherwise. Jon even says to Tyrion before he takes his vows that Tyrion was the only one who really told him the truth about what it was. Interesting. I'll have to watch season one again to refresh those memory cells. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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