2019 Steelers offseason news

[Dcash4]

The question is to what end are they mad? We are getting “sources” and “unnamed player” reports. 

If I am a player, and in a must win game - that has playoff implications, which means it has financial implications....yeah, I want one of the best players in the world in his position playing during the game. He could have strangled my grandmother and I would still want him playing.

Doesnt make the decision wrong, might just means players wanted a different outcome. 

[CKSteeler]

2 minutes ago, warfelg said:

You've changed reasoning multiple times to fit the "blame Tomlin and only Tomlin" argument.

 

It's possible that AB is an *** and Tomlin handled it poorly publicly. That last parts important because even though some players are saying things without putting their name on it for this situation doesn't mean we know how the entire situation is handled for his entire career.

Actually, I blame Antonio Brown plenty for this. It's also just another example of Mike Tomlin and his merry bunch of idiots.

You can bold publicly all you want. The reports on how players felt had nothing to do with the public aspect of this. They're unhappy with how Tomlin handled this behind closed doors. And when veterans are stating that if this is going to get fixed, it's going to have to be them, that's not a positive reflection on how Tomlin has handled these situations.

[warfelg]

The reports are on how he handled 1 situation. Not every situation to ever happen under his tenure as a coach.  And there are plenty of reasons they could feel it's on them to step in on a situation like this and not the coach.

I've avoided saying this, but you write and address these situations like someone who has never been in a locker room.  Or if you have you've only been in one type from one side.  Different teams, locker rooms, different players, they all have different personalities to them.  When I played in HS, we had an authoritarian coach.  Everything came from him.  Got to college and I played for a coach where it was expected that to be ready to play, that was on you, not him.  As I got to coaching, I had some teams and units that I barely had to say a word. Discipline was taken care of by captains, and the team was rallied by the captains.  In others, I had to handle everything by myself, and if I couldn't get that team excited for the game, then we were likely to lose because I know my players couldn't do it themselves.

And let me tell you what, as someone who could have benched their best player in a big game....that is the most gut wrenching hardest decisions to make in your life.  I caved.  I waited for the next game against someone I knew we would beat to sit him.  That's not something that you do with ease.  Which means to me, got Mike Tomlin to get there, he's tried other things with Antonio in the past and they have all failed.  Making him miss a game was likely his last line of defense in trying to get through to him.

[Dcash4]

12 minutes ago, warfelg said:

The reports are on how he handled 1 situation. Not every situation to ever happen under his tenure as a coach.  And there are plenty of reasons they could feel it's on them to step in on a situation like this and not the coach.

I've avoided saying this, but you write and address these situations like someone who has never been in a locker room.  Or if you have you've only been in one type from one side.  Different teams, locker rooms, different players, they all have different personalities to them.  When I played in HS, we had an authoritarian coach.  Everything came from him.  Got to college and I played for a coach where it was expected that to be ready to play, that was on you, not him.  As I got to coaching, I had some teams and units that I barely had to say a word. Discipline was taken care of by captains, and the team was rallied by the captains.  In others, I had to handle everything by myself, and if I couldn't get that team excited for the game, then we were likely to lose because I know my players couldn't do it themselves.

And let me tell you what, as someone who could have benched their best player in a big game....that is the most gut wrenching hardest decisions to make in your life.  I caved.  I waited for the next game against someone I knew we would beat to sit him.  That's not something that you do with ease.  Which means to me, got Mike Tomlin to get there, he's tried other things with Antonio in the past and they have all failed.  Making him miss a game was likely his last line of defense in trying to get through to him.

War, I don’t even want to continue our Colbert discussion anymore. I just want to live in this space of coaching and motivation. It’s about as in sync with an opinion as I can get. 

[warfelg]

2 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

War, I don’t even want to continue our Colbert discussion anymore. I just want to live in this space of coaching and motivation. It’s about as in sync with an opinion as I can get. 

haha.  To me it just becomes apparent quickly as someone who's coached different levels, different group sizes, different areas, played in different locker rooms, for different coaches.  If I could tell you the things that happened in those locker rooms like this stuff, you would be shocked over the fact that 99% of the stuff you don't know.

[Displayname]

I’m just curious on how you would rate Antonio Browns toxicity to the team. Is it at T.O level? When you’re a grown A*s adult and need to be constantly put in your place, especially as a man, How much wear n tear on the parties that are involved if this has been dating back since Ryan Clark publicly stated. NO ONE likes it when a grown man acts like a spoiled 12 year old.

tomlin may not of handled the situation the ideal right way. It seems to me that it was the last resort option because nothing else can get through his thick skull. Hell, we all have our breaking points and I think tomlin was right around the ball park with his. Possibly Ben also and Ben has mishandled it also through out the season. Could possibly say the team also, maybe their so emotionally drained by it. Browns type of behavior has been cancerous and can be contagious to the parties he’s been closest with. Lucky, it hasn’t rubbed on JuJu.....yet. I think the reason why we’re hearing the team speak out about it is because some of them are really hurt by it.

looking back at everything, it looks like this season has had all the signs of the beginning of the end of a relationship. 

 

[AFF]

Trade AB for Patrick Peterson and a 3rd.

Sogn John Brown for deep threat.

Cut Dupree and trade up for Polite from Florida at Edge.

Wont happen but hey it’s just an idea. 

[grubs10]

1 hour ago, CKSteeler said:

Actually, I blame Antonio Brown plenty for this. It's also just another example of Mike Tomlin and his merry bunch of idiots.

You can bold publicly all you want. The reports on how players felt had nothing to do with the public aspect of this. They're unhappy with how Tomlin handled this behind closed doors. And when veterans are stating that if this is going to get fixed, it's going to have to be them, that's not a positive reflection on how Tomlin has handled these situations.

Explain to me why you think veteran players are more mad at Mike Tomlin than AB for this specific situation.  Cuz I literally can't come up with any reason why someone would feel that way.  If I had to guess it was either someone not very bright who let their emotions get the best of them or thats not actually what they said(meant).

AB may be a major diva, but until this week it had never affected his work ethic or production on the field.  You seem to be blaming Tomlin for this situation because he has let AB get away with things and never called him out publicly even though AB has always been this way behind the scenes.  And yet it is well documented that AB is an incredibly thin-skinned, narcissistic, diva who has had his lowest moments when being questioned about things by the press in the past. You think that would have resulted in AB falling in line and not him having a tantrum and trying to demand a trade.

 

Do you think Mike Tomlin should have been able to change AB as a person? 

Are you saying that Mike Tomlin should have gotten rid of AB a long time ago?

Are you saying you can't understand why Mike Tomlin might put up with and/or cover for AB while he was showing up to everything, working harder than anyone, and producing more than anyone?

Are you saying its inexcusable that Mike Tomlin didn't automatically identify the best way to handle his best player throwing a tantrum and skipping practice leading up to a "playoff game"?

These players that wanna come out and give their 2 cents on the situation without putting their names on it can kick rocks.  If I found out who they were I wouldn't want them on team anyways.  Only reason you wouldn't put your name on it is because you don't want your team mates and coaches to know it was you and your not man enough to say it to their face.  To me it sounds like guys wanting to blame anybody but themselves for the disappointing season.

 

This is why i get labled a Tomlin stan.  Because I refuse to hold him to an unrealistic standard just because he is the "head coach".  He is a human being who has his own flaws, biases, "blind spots", tendencies, strengths, weaknesses, etc., just like every other human being on the planet.  I don't think I'm crazy for saying "Hey lets try to make an attempt to fix some of these issues and see how good we do before we try to change  the entire system."  It would be nice if Tomlin  would have been able to identify his weaknesses and correct them on his own by now, but again, every human being on the planet can struggle with this at times.   If the GM and Owner aren't able to tell the head coach that he needs to make changes or he is gone then that is a bigger, structural issue, that isn't fixed with a new coach.  If Mike Tomlin is unwilling to make changes after being shown why the changes are being made then he should be gone without any further thought.

No one can tell me Tomlin is dumb.  He may be arrogant, he may be too proud to admit faults at times, but he is not dumb.  If you sit him down and show him all the times that clock management, bad challenges, and situational play calling have backfired and how the teams that do the best in these situations have guys on staff specifically designated to provide input on those situations then he can't argue with it.  Then tell him that he is required to hire someone to fill this role and show significant improvement in these areas or he will be gone.  By all accounts that hasn't been done yet and that's my biggest issue.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2019 by grubs10

[Chieferific]

I think this is being overblown. It's 2 days into the Off Season. It will die down and Brown will be fine. 

[warfelg]

Well well well.  Seems like this all started with Tomlin restricting Brown some by not allowing his trainer, nutritionist, social media guy access full access facilities. Rather interesting.

[warfelg]

Not to say that Tomlin is excused for this.  But man the fact that Brown reacted like that to the coach telling him his personal people are not allowed into the facility is amazing.  Now if it comes out that Ben's people are allowed full access and Brown's aren't, then this becomes so much worse.

[jebrick]

Depends on if Ben has a social media person with full access.  That is the only one that should be squashed and it is probably the one he threw a temper-tantrum on

[warfelg]

4 minutes ago, jebrick said:

Depends on if Ben has a social media person with full access.  That is the only one that should be squashed and it is probably the one he threw a temper-tantrum on

I dunno.  Even if it was everyone I would be upset in Browns shoes too.  Why should one guy be allowed to have his trainer/nutritionist making sure he eats right and works out right, but I can't have someone else there doing the same.

 

Now....I will say, and as bad as this sounds, it kinda makes me appreciate Tom Brady and how he handled something similar.

[jebrick]

Brady's "nutritionist" is a quack and was drumming up business while "helping" TB.  That BB allowed him access for so long should be the story.

If Tomlin backs Ben over everyone else I do not care.  How easy is to replace a Wr vs a franchise QB.  They can't have 53 nutritionists and 53 trainers running around the facility.  Tomlin wants to pick and choose that is fine.  AB is throwing a temper tantrum that I would expect a 5 year old to throw when they do not get their way.  Skipping team meetings and practices over not having your social media person there to record it is stupid.

 

The biggest fault is Tomlin not communicating with the players about what was happening.

[warfelg]

24 minutes ago, jebrick said:

Brady's "nutritionist" is a quack and was drumming up business while "helping" TB.  That BB allowed him access for so long should be the story.

That's not the part that's important to what I was referencing though.  Yes there was issues of reports of a growing rift, but Brady didn't throw temper tantrums in practice, didn't refuse to show up, take off on his team in camp and make them makeup an injury.