2019 WR Corps

[deathstar]

I think that what some people are struggling with, in regards to Kumerow, is reconciling the obvious deficiencies in his game and his usage in this offense. Barring injury the dudes going to be on the field because he knows the offense, he’s on the same page as Rodgers, and he catches the ball. It’s likely he ends his GB career with less than 700 yards receiving because of his limitations. He could be the Erik walden of WRs. But right now he’s doing enough things right that players like ESB and Davis are behind him. 

[MantyWrestler]

4 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

What's more likely to occur, Moore is going to start catching the football with reps and time, or Kumerow is going to start getting open against much better competition?

I’m not sure that’s as easy of an answer as you think. Moore has been playing WR for a long time and he looks terrible at it.

[Cheech]

4 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Because he hates rookies and young players and any of the natural variance that comes with playing with rookies. So he goes to bat for the least rookie like dude despite not having much in the way of real NFL talent. Rodgers will then ***** in week ten when guys aren't getting open, because the rookies haven't gotten any developmental snaps, and the dudes like Kumerow aren't getting open because they're JAGs.

And also because our media knows that our stupid *** fans get aroused when they read positive Kumerow news, so they go out of their way to ask him those questions. 

This makes sense, until you realize that Rodgers is also praising a UDFA rookie in Sheppard (multiple times). 

Maybe he likes playing with players that learn the offense, run the routes, and catch the ball?

[Mr. Fussnputz]

I'd rather keep Kumerow who will be in his prime for the last few years of Rodgers' career, than Moore who will be "developing" for those 3-4 years. But I don't think Moore is developing at all. He is what he is. When God said he was giving out hands, Moore thought he said pans and asked for two cast-iron ones.

[Mazrimiv]

12 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Davante was a disaster his first two years in the league. His 2015 season is one of the worst statistical seasons by a WR with a decent QB ever. When Davante Adams was struggling with his hands, he was not in any way a "been there, done that" guy. Also, he was absolutely a body catcher. Everything got in on him and he couldn't track the ball at all. 

Adams got over it and improved with practice and reps. That's what young players need to get better.

Saying you don't want a fourth round pick who you knew was going to be a project after a rookie season and one preseason game (in which he caught a TD) on your PRACTICE SQUAD is insane. So what, you can keep the 27 year old perennial 5th receiver JAG that every team has?

Davante was a"disaster" his first two seasons?  That's an odd statement.  Especially coming from someone who is accusing others of attempting to revise history.

[Mazrimiv]

10 hours ago, Norm said:

Just like pretending M Adams is Daniels. Agreed

But seriously. Moore gets ******* open. But idk. I'd say today no but I'm sure he'll change my mind by PS game 4

Moore does get separation, which is why I would not mind him landing on the PS to give him another year to get over the drops.

[Mazrimiv]

Kumerow keeps making plays, Rodgers seems to love him, but most of the fan base seems to be hoping he doesn't make the team.

Kumerow is the anti-Janis. 

[OneTwoSixFive]

5 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

You fixed nothing.

Kumerow having solid hands isn't worth much if he can't get open. 

Kumerow should be referred to in glowing terms from a knowledge and maturity standpoint  when compared to the rest of the guys he's competing with. He's 4 years older and more mature.

Jake Kumerow doesn't run great routes. He runs decent routes. He doesn't catch everything, he has good hands. He isn't a natural football player, he's a guy that's maxed out an athletically limited frame.

Jake Kumerow isn't James Jones in pretty much any aspect of evaluation. They have one similar red flag. The difference is Jones rated good to elite in just about every other area where as Kumerow doesn't come close.

I sure fixed something, if you look at these comments. These people that are talking him up are people that count, because whose opinion counts more ? Yours, or an all time great QB, the Packers current head coach, Davante Adams, one of the best receivers in the league............... 'Inspiring' is exactly the right word to describe him. 

Comments

“He is an extremely intelligent guy who is in the right place at the right time. He makes contested catches, he makes the plays that are there and he does the little things. I’m always applauding in an overt way to let the other guys (know) this is the way to practice.” — Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers on Kumerow

“I think Jake’s done an outstanding job. He’s just reliable. He’s consistent. And I think that’s what you look for in players. He’s got really strong hands. And he’s a much bigger guy than I think he might come across. So, yeah, I’m excited about him.” — Packers head coach Matt LaFleur

“I think Jake has shown it for awhile. You saw a lot of it in preseason. He made some big plays, some splash plays. you see those all the time. but he’s a guy that, every day, you never have to tell him how to work, he sees it. He comes in and it reminds me of how I came in. Seeing the way they’d finish to the end zone, he didn’t have to be told to finish to the end zone. He sees that, and he goes just as hard as the top guy, if not harder.” — Packers wideout Davante Adams on Kumerow

“Just little things … that he does I think almost separates him from a guy you might not trust as much because you know the guy is going to do it right. He’ll always be in the right spot, he knows what he’s doing all the time and what the other guys are doing. And when he gets a chance to make plays, he makes plays. And he does it in a super classy, understated way. Obviously, I’m a big fan of him. I could keep going.” — Rodgers on Kumerow

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Oh, and I undersold his height by an inch (he is 6'4"). You argue against me as if I had him down as the no.2 receiver, but I've already dealt with that (I had him at no.6 as you can find out if you look back to where I rated the receivers). As for the 'decent routes', that suggests average and he's better than that (especially taking into account he is 6'4" and not some 5'10" smurf).

I do agree that Kumerow's frame is about what it will always be, and I also agree that James Jones tested better than Kumerow (Jones has much more explosion, as shown in their broad and high jumps), though Kumerow has the better 3 cone (6.9 to 7.06). However, both are good at boxing out defenders, both are very smart, both track the ball in the air very well, both have strong hands, so it is not just about similar speeds and a high success rate catching balls.............not so different after all.

PS If you think I picked Kumerow from that list of three WR originally tabled, you would be wrong. I went for Davis (with the proviso that he gets healthy fairly quickly).

 

Edited August 11, 2019 by OneTwoSixFive

[AlexGreen#20]

35 minutes ago, OneTwoSixFive said:

I sure fixed something, if you look at these comments. These people that are talking him up are people that count, because whose opinion counts more ? Yours, or an all time great QB, the Packers current head coach, Davante Adams, one of the best receivers in the league............... 'Inspiring' is exactly the right word to describe him. 

Comments

“He is an extremely intelligent guy who is in the right place at the right time. He makes contested catches, he makes the plays that are there and he does the little things. I’m always applauding in an overt way to let the other guys (know) this is the way to practice.” — Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers on Kumerow

“I think Jake’s done an outstanding job. He’s just reliable. He’s consistent. And I think that’s what you look for in players. He’s got really strong hands. And he’s a much bigger guy than I think he might come across. So, yeah, I’m excited about him.” — Packers head coach Matt LaFleur

“I think Jake has shown it for awhile. You saw a lot of it in preseason. He made some big plays, some splash plays. you see those all the time. but he’s a guy that, every day, you never have to tell him how to work, he sees it. He comes in and it reminds me of how I came in. Seeing the way they’d finish to the end zone, he didn’t have to be told to finish to the end zone. He sees that, and he goes just as hard as the top guy, if not harder.” — Packers wideout Davante Adams on Kumerow

“Just little things … that he does I think almost separates him from a guy you might not trust as much because you know the guy is going to do it right. He’ll always be in the right spot, he knows what he’s doing all the time and what the other guys are doing. And when he gets a chance to make plays, he makes plays. And he does it in a super classy, understated way. Obviously, I’m a big fan of him. I could keep going.” — Rodgers on Kumerow

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oh, and I undersold his height by an inch (he is 6'4"). You argue against me as if I had him down as the no.2 receiver, but I've already dealt with that (I had him at no.6 as you can find out if you look back to where I rated the receivers). As for the 'decent routes', that suggests average and he's better than that (especially taking into account he is 6'4" and not some 5'10" smurf).

I do agree that Kumerow's frame is about what it will always be, and I also agree that James Jones tested better than Kumerow (Jones has much more explosion, as shown in their broad and high jumps), though Kumerow has the better 3 cone (6.9 to 7.06). However, both are good at boxing out defenders, both are very smart, both track the ball in the air very well, both have strong hands, so it is not just about similar speeds and a high success rate catching balls.............not so different after all.

PS If you think I picked Kumerow from that list of three WR originally tabled, you would be wrong. I went for Davis (with the proviso that he gets healthy fairly quickly).

 

If Kumerow was this stud, why hasn't he ever played? He's had 4?5? years to figure this thing out and has never once cracked into the Top 5 of an NFL rotation

[Golfman]

5 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

No one has said he has. 

This conversation started with Golfman's insane declaration that he didn't even want Moore on the Practice Squad.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. Moore can't catch and we hung onto him last year thinking he'd get it straightened out. Can't catch this year either...........!................

He sure does run pretty routes though! I used to play a lot of basketball. We'd refer to Moore as a self-guard! 

I hope he figures it out. I hope suddenly he takes off the boxing gloves, realizes he has fingers and starts using them. Given his reluctance to use his hands, or position them correctly to catch the ball when forced to, I'm not holding my breath. 

But I'm the one making insane declarations! Got it, have a great day! 

 

[AlexGreen#20]

46 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

Kumerow keeps making plays, Rodgers seems to love him, but most of the fan base seems to be hoping he doesn't make the team.

Kumerow is the anti-Janis. 

Kumerow had 2 catches for 27 yards. I get that we weren't exactly throwing the ball around the yard (thanks Kizer and LaFleur) but this man wasn't a stuff last night.

and you're reading this fanbase completely wrong. There's a poll up top disputing your assertion.

If Kizer's throws on the same crossers to Moore and Kumerow were reversed, perfect for Moore, significantly behind Kumerow, this entire conversation is different.

[AlexGreen#20]

1 hour ago, Mazrimiv said:

Davante was a"disaster" his first two seasons?  That's an odd statement.  Especially coming from someone who is accusing others of attempting to revise history.

Was it the sub 55% catch rate or the sub 5.5 yards per target that has you so high on Adams second year?

[AlexGreen#20]

7 minutes ago, Golfman said:

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. Moore can't catch and we hung onto him last year thinking he'd get it straightened out. Can't catch this year either...........!................

He sure does run pretty routes though! I used to play a lot of basketball. We'd refer to Moore as a self-guard! 

I hope he figures it out. I hope suddenly he takes off the boxing gloves, realizes he has fingers and starts using them. Given his reluctance to use his hands, or position them correctly to catch the ball when forced to, I'm not holding my breath. 

But I'm the one making insane declarations! Got it, have a great day! 

 

Jake Kumerow will never be a plus receiver. 

Moore might at some point be a plus receiver and does more on specials.

That's all this conversation should come down to.

[incognito_man]

@AlexGreen#20

Think Kumerow has trade value for a roster bubble/would-be-cut player?

I could see another team wanting a guy like Kumerow more than GB. He could be a decent #5 option somewhere else.

I just don't see the value he offers THIS year's team.

[AlexGreen#20]

3 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

@AlexGreen#20

Think Kumerow has trade value for a roster bubble/would-be-cut player?

I could see another team wanting a guy like Kumerow more than GB. He could be a decent #5 option somewhere else.

I just don't see the value he offers THIS year's team.

I just think every team in the league has a Kumerow they're trying to develop.

When you look at him as a prospect, what do you have? 4 years of essentially no contributions through three different teams? 

If it wasn't for the bloodlines, does he even get a shot in the league? I'm not saying he isn't among the top 150ish WRs in the NFL, I'm just not sure what that does for you as a GM.